Coming February 6, 2024 . . .
MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
Pre-order at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop
Coming February 6, 2024 . . . MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE by Michael Wolraich Pre-order at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop |
By Sam Levin @ The Guardian, Feb. 6
The president’s tumultuous first weeks in office could influence uptick in viral sharing of misleading articles and propaganda that stoke progressive anxieties
Comments
What major Progressive organizations or personalities are actually stating this so-called Leftist fake news as fact?
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 10:26pm
Let me try to clarify what the author is talking about here.
This article clearly uses the common current definition of "fake news" as stories that get passed around on social media like Facebook and Twitter, not by organizations or personalities. That's how I understand the term as well. That's because it is something I've fought against on blogs since the whole "anti-MSM" movement starting in like 2003. I've never been a big fan of ground-up amateur journalism of any kind. That's because that trend was waving this flag in front of me from my cultural history studies: POPULISM. EMOTIONAL OUTRAGE POPULISM = fake narratives being passed around. A rumor going round the world before the truth can put it's boots on. As in: The U.S. military guy who supposedly pissed on a Koran in Iraq or Afghanistan, after which there were major riots allover the geographical area ending in some deaths.
As far as names and examples,there are plenty in the article.with links! And there's a whole lot more in the embedded links to Merrimack College's viral list. And then there's the quotes from people whose work is to track these things, like Snopes, Berkman Klein Center at Harvard University. and a professor of informatics and computer science at Indiana University.
I don't know what more I can give you. I don't presume it's my job when I post an article to defend it, I didn't write it, I'm just sharing it. But in this case, I do agree that with the emotional response to President Trump, the danger is very real.
by artappraiser on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 11:08pm
I get the point of the article, but I see the problem from a different perspective. If blacks protest against a given issue, and one outrageous black person makes a statement, every black person gets labeled as supporting the outlier. The media are master at this technique. Minister Louis Farrakhan praises something that President Obama said. President Obama is then charged with supporting Black Muslims, a group viewed as radical. Martin Luther King Jr gets labeled a Communist.
We have an actual so-called President with an actual white supremacist as an advisor. The so-called President is praised by an actual racist David Duke. Media does not force our so-called President to address these facts in detail. I think that Progressives are called to be responsible for complete nonsense while Conservatives are not called into account. I have no doubt that there are crazy Progressive people posting crazy things on the intertubes. Progressives should ask for proof that any mainstream Progressives are directly connected to the nonsense statements, and ask for examples of prominent Progressives promoting the stupidity.
MLK would be labeled a terrorist, the same label applied to BlackLivesMatter. I worry more about what the wingnuts are doing than what Progressives might do.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 8:24am
There is no widespread problem with Progressives that causes concern. Kellyanne Conway talks about alternative facts, Reverend Darrell Scott, one of Trump's blacks, told us that Chicago "gang thugs" wanted a meeting with the Trump administration and offered to lower the body count in Chicago. When questioned further, Scott admitted that he was "sleepy" when he made the statement, and that his contact was a former gang member.
http://www.essence.com/news/darrell-scott-gang-thug-statement-donald-trump
The Trump administration is lying repeatedly. The Trump administration is the danger, not Progressives.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 9:39am
I think we're discussing wholesale fake news churned out & distributed by partisans in mass quantities.
This to some extent has been done by funded groups that specialize in churning up outrage.
But it can also be a wishful thinking piece that strikes the right chord. (1 guy noted a bunch of buses that he thought could be paid protesters, but then found out a big tech company was busing in conference-goers. But the original speculation was re-tweeted in the millions; the retraction/explanation got maybe 1000).
The Snopes anecdote is misleading - I go to Snopes often before I post something stupid and unbelievable (smartass comments here-->_______). My mother rarely does. Guess which sides of the spectrum we're on.
We've had fake news and particular poisonous blogging on the left before - the PUMA stuff largely got dismissed and ignored, for example. Empty Wheel has a few egregious cases recently where liberals may have got caught recently, but part of that is that the rightist Administration is so fucking bonkers it's really hard to call something too absurd to be true. Okay, Trump didn't skin his son and use the material for Christmas ornaments. I'm pretty sure. Short of that, who knows. Counter that with a pretty big sum of people who 20 years ago thought Hillary was hanging dildos from the White House Christmas tree and drinking her own urine, well, the right is still way ahead of us. Even now, all the "Obama destroyed the Constitution" stuff has been way out there, far removed from the Clinton distortion field.
There is some stuff that's probably just trying to get our goat - whether true or not - supposed legislation to make it not a crime to hit a protester on the highway or rightwing legislators suggesting Sundays are when "the wife ought to be bringing their husbands breakfast in bed" - minibrouha in a bottle - sanity says just drop it (except to counter actual legislation if really exists), but yeah, it keeps the nerves on in, makes everyone jumpy.
[Learn Progress seems to be 1 site churning stuff out - largely stuff that's not that different from unbelievable stuff Trump or daughter or partner already did. Palmer Report is also unhinged, but again - are liberals really buying all this stuff and retweeting it? I don't think with near the carelessness and enthusiasm on the right - jeezus, all these fake "Founding Father had quote about liberty and Muslims" posts I've gotten over the last 10 years....]
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 8:47am
Re: Hillary was hanging dildos from the White House Christmas tree and drinking her own urine,
One of my most depressing experiences in the blogosphere was in 2008 when a bunch of Obamabots invaded TPM Cafe where I had come to enjoy analyzing news with some smart minds of various persuasions for a couple years. They came to post political advocacy, including some narratives nearly as bad as the above quote. Got further all het up by a year of "horse race" coverage in a bubble of their own making. Hence, Trump being elected is not as much a surprise to me as some others in my meatspace world. I know how deluded passionate advocates can get, especially if fans of personality whether they are sports fans or Obama fans or Trump fans. I recall in particular one gal insisting Michelle Obama despised Hillary and that is why one must not vote for her. If the goal is to get rid of Trump, while I have the same goal, I don't trust that source, I want to deconstruct what they are saying. Because: Never Forget. Agitprop is very dangerous. I will admit this country has been a miserable failure at public education but I will never give up the idea that it can work. The alternative is quite simply: no hope.
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 2:54pm
Is that person's perspective shared by a significant number of people? I don't see how you can wipe out bizarre statements. How much effort should Progressives divert from addressing Trump to correct a fringe point of view?
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:04pm
I dunno, it was conventional wisdom back in August or September that apparently Michelle and Hillary don't get along, couldn't stand being around each other. I couldn't figure out why people thought either had that thin skin, considering it was all pretty rough-em-up politics till some point in the game, but they were all used to the angry side of things as if we haven't been through enough cycles to be immune to the little stuff...
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:25pm
The current question is how much effort should Progressives expend to correct fringe "news" rather than focus attention on the newly confirmed, unqualified Secretary of Education and the other true facts coming out of the Trump administration. Responding to the diversion is never ending. The only way to break the cycle is to have a continued attack pointing out Trump's idiocy and ridiculing Trump and his minions. Responding to the Progressive fringe as a responsibility only re-enforces that there is a connection between rational Progressive thinkers and the fringe.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:38pm
Let's go bigger picture. She was not by far the only one, just one extreme example of the mania. Bunch of millenial fans of Obama the god like king of cool personality with black skin get all passionate about electing someone whose white papers they haven't read, pound the streets, some even faint at rallies. He gets elected, they aren't thrilled, because they didn't actually investigate his plans, only got caught up in the horse race, don't show up for the mid-term elections because they are boring, he gets stymied by a GOP Congress, and they don't show up for the next elections either. Don't show up to vote for Hillary in 2016, Trump gets elected by new version of passionate maniacs who haven't actually investigated his plans but like the color of his skin and his cool or hot or whatever and how he can trounce the others in debates.
See LBJ, Gene McCarthy, Chicago 7, Nixon, etc.Been there, done all that. Worked on McCarthy's campaign as a teenybopper because: I was anti-war and wanted to meet older guys with long hair and mustaches. And Gene was sweet and cute, said some of the right stuff of the little I heard or read.
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:49pm
Fake news is not the issue that is upsetting you. Your problem is with the American electorate. Good luck changing that.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:51pm
I'll just throw out that a gazillion studies show if everyone eligible in this country were forced to vote over the last three decades, we'd always have moderate left of center government. All the sturm and drang comes from certain energized or non-energized groups at certain times, energized or not energized over stuff that is often not "truth".
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 4:07pm
People make a decision not to vote. Many people who do vote are not well informed. Some voters are susceptible to fake news. The path to victory is to find enough well-informed and I'll-informed people who agree with you.
There were plenty of stories about Hillary Clinton's flaws. The media made certain that we were informed of her history. There was less attention paid to Trump's flaws. In fact, he was given free airtime to spread lies. Information created the meme that Hillary was a phony and a crook. Hillary's flaws were exposed. Trump never released his taxes. How do you cope with a system that demanded scrutiny of one side, but not the other?
Perhaps the reason that people become extremely defensive a candidate or politician is that they see information revealed that is negative regarding their preferred candidate, but little information about the opponent.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 5:30pm
AA, I truly understand your concern. You have to understand that we have a white supremacist with a white supremacist senior adviser. The so-called President openly lied about the national murder rate in front of a group of sheriffs. He wants to create fear. He is gearing up to use that fear to crush minority communities. Jeff Sessions will be sworn in as his AG. The assault is imminent. I fear for my community. I fear lies being told by Trump and his evil companions. I don't have time to worry about what the Progressive fringe who make statements that have little practical impact. We have to fight the active battle facing us from Trump.
Crime rate data
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/02/07/513952870/in-meeting-w...
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 8:33pm
Another painful memory example: M.J. Rosenfeld saying "what's wrong with populism?" Well, not painful, more like: final proof he and his fans were deluded idiots.
Further: Rosenberg actually deluded himself into thinking that Obama was not strongly pro-Israel, because: he had black skin?! I couldn't figure out any other reason that could be, when Obama kept doing and saying pro-Israel things! And the realization that if Josh Marshall still respects Rosenberg, well then, he's got to have delusion issues, too.
(I bet Bruce Levine can back me up on this, I am sure it's a painful memory for him too.)
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 3:56pm
Worked on McCarthy's campaign as a teenybopper because: I was anti-war ... ...
And now that you are all grown up you are what, pro-war, indifferent to war, or don't think war is worth thinking about one way or the other? Or even worth avoiding if possible? Just wondering.
by A Guy Called LULU on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 4:13pm
Why do you care what my opinion is on such issues? I think when you ask such things of a person you don't know on the internet: you are looking for someone to argue with or you are looking for someone to follow. Your brain needs advocacy for some reason. Mine is just the opposite. The advocacy system of thought, and formal debate as well, depends upon withholding facts that are detrimental to one's case (or spinning them out of shape) and then working it out at the end, or not, just endless effort at persuasion and argument. I'd rather not waste my time on any of that and just get all the information from the getgo, and make my own decision in private, none of your business, you shouldn't care and I don't want to argue about it, you tolerate me and I tolerate you. We share our brains to analyze only. I am not a follower. I think the world is complex. I myself would never join a military force, ever, no matter what the reason, even possible death. But I know other people might under certain conditions and I wouldn't be able to change their mind. Is that good enough?
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 4:28pm
P.S. One thing I will admit to strongly believing: Passionate advocacy without a judge like overseer in the mix is a major cause of: war.
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 4:40pm
Yeah, I erased a response reflecting on how much more complex something like Vietnam was than it seemed or was presented as 50 years ago. Easy to be cool, anti-war and simplistic, or Ramboish and simplistic. To dig into the complexities is another matter.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 4:46pm
Your comment reminds me of how the denialism about Saint JFK (martyr who must be made a peacenik) is pertinent on this whole creative narratives of history front. And how that just synchs into what is still the most fertile ground for conspiracy theorizing of all time.
The kinds of things I think about now: what will history written by millenial generation historians look like? Given that they've mostly been taught to forget about chronology, and work with memes....
by artappraiser on Tue, 02/07/2017 - 5:16pm
I share your antipathy for the hero worship of Obama in 08. I was incredulous when I saw people weeping, fainting, and shouting out "I love you" at a politician. Really, weeping over a politician. But very little of that was caused by what I'd consider fake news of the type that's become popular this year. Back then it was spin sometimes malicious spin, but any outright lies just didn't take hold with the majority of democrats. This year it was objectively false totally made up stories with absolutely no connection to reality. Shared and spread on facebook getting a million or multimillion views. With people getting paid for these fabrications, tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars. It truly is a new phenomena. Tech companies like google and facebook need to re-evaluate how they disperse advertising dollars or we are in big trouble as a nation.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 02/08/2017 - 1:14am
yes, I remember you well as a rare kindred soul, oceankat! And I'm glad I was too busy to have to watch this recent worse round, rather coming in at the pushback stage.
by artappraiser on Wed, 02/08/2017 - 1:27am
Are Macedonian teens making 6 figures a month on it?
by NCD on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 10:32pm
Strikes me that would be a good thing, better than angry liberals doing it for free! And what a future those teens might have!
But it also sounds more like Uber's promises about how much a driver can make.
by artappraiser on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 11:10pm