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In Brutal Baltimore Hate Crime Video, Echoes of Kitty Genovese

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 1:28 am   |

In a McDonald's restaurant in Baltimore last week, two teenage girls kicked, stomped, and beat a transgendered woman.  Why?  She was using the women's bathroom.  The perps beat the victim to the point of a convulsive seizure, while a McDonald's employee recorded the assault.  The spectacular and stunning video, posted incongruously on WorldStarHipHop, is here.  (In case anyone is concerned that describing the assault calls attention to the identity of a crime victim, she has not only been widely reported upon, she has appeared on camera in an interview revealing herself and discussing the attack.)  I have two points of contact with this news event that left me rapt as I watched this:  the Kitty Genovese angle, and also the status of the victim.  Both are, I think, worthy of attention. 

First, the video is a 2011 echo of the attack on Kitty Genovese, the 28 year old woman famously stabbed to death in Queens while a dozen or more onlookers heard her cries during parts of the assault upon her and did nothing.  Relatedly, I saw a suicide by drowning in 1994, as I have written about periodically in this space.  It really disturbed me when it happened, and oddly, I was on my way to see the film Spanking the Monkey, which concludes with another attempted suicide in water.  I was disturbed first and foremost by the death, by being made to ID the victim, and by my own failure to help the victim in time.  But I was particularly disturbed by a German tourist who filmed the drowning from the LaSalle Street bridge over the Chicago River without trying to call 911 or throw a flotation device.  The McDonald's assault reminds me of that.  Who is this guy who thought it appropriate to record the attack?  One answer is, now he's a guy who got fired by the McDonald's franchise owner.  And who is the person in the audio track of the beating who warns the perps to run because the police are coming?  Oy.  This is worse than Genovese, it's more like the bystanders wanted to commemorate and aid the brutality.

Just as the Genovese story galvanized concern about urban crime and indifference to it, just as Rodney King's beating provoked scrutiny of police brutality and urban racial tension when many wanted to see our society as postracial, and just as the murder of Matthew Shepard drew focus to the brutalization of gay and lesbian persons, this vicious beating holds the potential to remind our society that everyone is human, and that no one should be subjected to assault in general, and most particularly not for who or what they are.  It received a lot of play on Drudge Friday and Saturday, which seems to me to be a good thing, even if accidentally so.

Second, there is no question that transgendered people are about the most despised minority there is.  The victim was beating for using a women's bathroom.  I learned professionally of a case in which a transgendered woman was driven from using the bathroom at her place of teaching, and then did not work.  She claimed discrimination, the school said otherwise, rationalizing that students felt unsafe (violence might ensue, they argued) with a man in the bathroom, never mind that the transgendered woman had a drivers' license calling her a woman.  So the transgendered woman was supposed to use the men's bathroom -- no threat of violence there, right?

I have a transgendered sibling, though we haven't spoken in eight years for no reason I know of.  I have also represented a company that has a senior representative who is transgendered.  After learning of publicity surrounding the latter person, a coworker of mine who met my transgendered sibling cornered me to crow about how the senior company official was a "twisted freak," as were all such folks.  The relish my coworker took in saying this really educated me about the evil that there is in people.  I think we are liberals because there are people who are weak.  We are there not to make everything right, but to stand against the playground bullies who want to hurt the weak and powerless because they can.  My coworker later was essentially made to apologize.  But it pissed me off enough to take the case I described in the foregoing paragraph.  Sometimes you have to stand up and bear witness, even though it isn't particularly professionally advantageous.  And there is a pleasure in that, doing something concrete against and on account of people being mean.

Finally, speaking of people acting badly, if you check out the extensive comment thread (448 comments) from an LGBTQ site that reported on this story, you'll see all sorts of messed up stuff.  I hadn't mentioned it, but the assailants happen to be black, and the victim white, and the thread is pocked with (largely moderated) instances of gross racism and N-word dropping.  One commenter laments any social injustice, and in the same breath calls the perps "bitches".  There is race hostility, race guilt, sexism, and other varieties of hostility.  I won't comment on it, but it's worth a read too.  Even in a commentariat that seems or wants to mean well, there's a lot of The Ugly to be fought.  Just saying…

Three wishes in closing.  Above all, peace and healing to the victim.  Also hoping that the juvenile alleged perp learns the shame of what she did and gets better.  And finally, like the Shepard beating, hoping this video actually prevents rather than sensationalizes human suffering.

Somewhere on the intertubes you can find an analysis of the Kitty Genovese case that shows it wasn't such a heartless New York neighborhood after all.

Basically they neighbors lived above a bar with nightly disturbances, only 1 or 2 people actually saw anything, the rest just heard some noises, and one that saw, an old woman, probably saw Genovese walk away on her own - not obvious that something was wrong.

And several claimed they called the police, which isn't unlikely in the pre-911 days that calls would be lost or ignored and not recorded. Okay, found it:

http://www.psych.lancs.ac.uk/people/uploads/MarkLevine20070604T095238.pdf

by Desider 4/25/2011 - 5:25 am

The Wikipedia entry I used as a link makes a point of debunking the exaggerated claims that Genovese was heard crying for help by dozens who didn't call.  I used the Wiki sources' more understated claim that a dozen or perhaps more heard her cries at different points in the attack, recognizing that there is a significant element of myth and urban lore surrounding it. 

One thing that I found interesting in reading the Wiki was that Genovese was apparently gay or bi, something I didn't recall.  One of the commenters on the thread I noted said how she as a lesbian had been hassled in a bathroom for being the lesbian in the bathroom, so she empathized with the victim in this case.  To me, the Genovese story and this story are about empathy.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 11:28 am (re: Desider)

Genovese lived with her lesbian lover, who's recorded her memories of her. Apparently they were well-liked in the apartment. The murderer simply went out "to kill a woman", something he'd done a couple other times. There were no extenuating circumstances out of him being a complete nutcase.

One guy wanted to call the police but his wife didn't want to get involved, so he told a neighbor who called the police and then went down and found Kitty and cradled her head in her lap until the police arrived. Somehow that sounds like empathy.

by Desider 4/25/2011 - 3:50 pm (re: Articleman)

That's all interesting, and I stand by calling for more empathy on the front side.  Whether it was 34 or 9 people who heard and ignored an attack on her, that's not ok.  The German guy I saw not use his cell phone to call 911 witnessing a suicide was not ok. 

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 3:58 pm (re: Desider)

And my own little "get involved" case was a guy beating a girl in a bad neighborhood (mine) late at night. Fortunately I was in my van, so I drove up on the sidewalk like I would run both of them over, and when he got off her, she hopped in the van and we drove away. He chased us for a few blocks but then I lost him. 

And that was an odd location that reminds me of the Kitty Genovese story, a Mexican bar where I remember two guys out on the sidewalk hugely drunk that looked like they were going to kill each other, and then someone else came up behind and smashed a bottle over one's head, and while I'm talking to the 911 operator, the original 2 are hugging each other and laughing and going back into the bar to drink some more. Living la vida loca.

by Desider 4/25/2011 - 4:07 pm (re: Desider)

Well told. Are you sure you didn't lift that from a James Lee Burke novel?

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 4:36 pm (re: Desider)

I am James Lee Burke. Or at least a 2nd cousin on his mother's side.

by Desider 4/26/2011 - 1:15 am (re: Oxy Mora)

More like Jamie Lee Curtis.

by quinn esq 4/26/2011 - 1:44 pm (re: Desider)

Ahnold. Jamie Lee was the other one, wearing the teddy.

by Desider 4/26/2011 - 2:18 pm (re: quinn esq)

Whoa; Burke can tell a story that makes ya shiver, can't he?  Hold-your-breath writing, and like Parker's Spenser, his protagonists of necessity are violent at times, but have strict moral codes.  Really interesting to be immersed in their worlds.

by we are stardust 4/26/2011 - 8:29 am (re: Oxy Mora)

The Sun article says that one employee and one woman did try to separate the attackers from the victim. Had more people stepped in, there may have been far less violence. But.

I almost hate to bring this up, but the open/concealed carry crowd might observe that a responsible citizen might have been better able to stand against such an attack if they were armed. And the obvious response to that is that the event may well have turned deadly had the wrong people been armed. I remember several articles about men getting shot dead while trying to stop other men from beating their own wives or girlfriends in public.

My family, my wife, two small kids and another in my arms, was once getting out of our car in a store plaza parking lot. We open the doors and some angry guy is shouting at his wife, then starts shouting that I parked the wrong way in the space (?). My wife asked him to stop cursing in front of our children, and he responded rudely. I could have put my little one down and gone over to beat the crap out of him, and I had a feeling that my wife wanted me to do just that, but he might have had a concealed pistol or a knife. So I ignored him and got them all the hell away as fast as I could.

That's not an exact parallel to the McD's beating, but it makes me sympathetic to the plight of citizens who want order, but worry about encountering people with weapons.

by Donal 4/25/2011 - 8:30 am

I applaud the McDonald's employee who stepped in to separate the perps from the prone victim in the video, and whoever called the police too.  It is also true that if more people (maybe the guy with the camera, no?) stepped in, lots of suffering could have been avoided.  But people need that empathy, instead of viewing it as a car crash (to borrow an inapposite metaphor someone in the comment thread used for it) to rubberneck at.

The idea of people in a McDonald's bathroom with guns fighting over who belongs in a stall is not a comforting one to me.  Based on the stomping and kicking the perps employ on the video, I don't see a level of humanity or impulse control that makes me wish everyone in the Mickey D's was armed, but that's just me.

I think someone cursing at a family with children is likely to be a bit unhinged and you were right to back away.  I think of the road rage incident in suburban Phoenix recently in which a man cut off another man.  The man who was cut off stormed out with his gun, only to have the cutter-offer blow him away.  I read that no charges were filed because it was self-defense.  I also read that both were NRA members.  So yes, it's good to leave the crazy alone. 

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 11:39 am (re: Donal)

I used to have this diary up at my Posterous site; can't even remember if it's still there.  I stuck it up as a companion to celebrating the repeal of DADT.  It's by Margaret and FDL; she wrote it to remind us all that the repeal did NOT cover the transgendered.

She had been in the Navy and was rather unceremoniously screwed once she was outed and eventually discharged without honor, lost all her benefits and a bunch of pay.  She also wanted us to know what transgendered actually means, and I discovered that I really hadn't known.  Pretty eye-opening to see how much I had wrong, or was fuzzy about.  Anyway, here's the great diary.

by we are stardust 4/25/2011 - 8:37 am

I hope incidents like this are indicative of a catharsis in our society instead of the inevitable demise of it.

I once visited the Grand Canyon with a companion. As we stood enraptured by the majesty of it and thinking it proved the existence of God, we were interrupted by a couple who wanted us to take their picture and handed me their camera. The woman said, "And try to get some of the "background" in the picture". Ever since then I have wondered about peoples' motivations for filming something.

Like you, I am drawn to the person who would film an incident such as the beating of a transgendered person. Maybe the prospect of launching a sensational You Tube video and basking in the fame of having done so is now in the psyche. If so, one might conclude that Warhol's thought on our culture was unfinished and should read--

"...fifteen minutes of fame but no such restraint on shame."

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 11:29 am

What is the background and what is the point is kind of a Rorschach thing, I think.  One person's majesty and mystery is another person's afterthought.

It is hard for me to imagine the camera guy filming a beating of a woman by two men, or filming a racially motivated beating among a group of men.  The act of filming seems not only detached here, but (if the filmer is the person whose Twitter and Facebook defended the perps) an act of approval.

Sixty years ago, I think there was more tolerance for violence against difference.  Thirty years ago, I think there was some more.  As long as there are people, there will be some tolerance for violence against difference, and with it, the need to point it out.  And I'm still mad at the German guy for filming the suicide, but happy the Chicago police confiscated his video, which I saw them do, and I know they knew it was gratuitous and improper for them to do.  I'm quite certain he never got it back. 

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 11:56 am (re: Oxy Mora)

The German guy is a really clear example--how could a person with empathy do such a thing, even with the excuse of a lapse of some kind. It's hard to imagine a logical or acceptable reason for the video.

I like your focus on the issue of empathy.   

As I remember, empathy and the degree of empathy was/is thought to be measurable by psychologists. I remember a graduate school class, one of those tests, I scored high on empathy, as well as, the prof noted in class, female traits like cooperativeness. (I trust the class test thing is no more.) I hadn't at that time yet realized that a "female" trait or two in a man is a good thing and I developed some antipathy toward the prof..

In the restroom beating, I like to think I would have intervened. I don't think the thought of guns would have deterred me. But I think the fear of intervening, because of guns, may be a new twist which might temper a person's "empathy" more so now than in the past.. Maybe there is just a lot of noise in our society which in general is dampening empathy, at least in actions such as stopping this fight.

The golfer who last week was shot dead on a golf course by an adjacent property owner after the property owner had just shot the golfer's dog is another case. As pointed out, the only rational action in such a situation is to get away as quickly as possible. I'm guessing the case will be that the shooter had standing issues with encroachment and had something to do with his gun ownership. (Is that an empathetic thought?)We have to assume there are many such people rubbing shoulders with us in public, so beware.

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 1:45 pm (re: Articleman)

There's also a collective action problem in the beating here.  If a group of people moves in to block the perps, that makes it easier for any one person to.  A bystander filming, I think, promotes distance by others.  The lack of action in response by anyone here reflects some combination of indifference, lack of empathy, or not wanting to be on the leading edge of a difficult intervention.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 1:56 pm (re: Oxy Mora)

"promotes distance by others" , I think that's right on.  

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 2:06 pm (re: Articleman)

While it's a bit bizarre, I don't see anything keeping the manager from either cold-clocking the girls or dragging them out and locking them out of the store.

Instead, it's a non-urgent shaking of his head through the whole thing.

Yeah, there are times when it might be uncomfortable to act, but this is absurd.

by Desider 4/26/2011 - 1:19 am (re: Oxy Mora)

Dave Robicheaux would have acted instinctively, righted a wrong, and put society, for a few moments, back in balance. (I've read that this is the moral underpinning of a good detective novel)

I don't intend to watch the video so don't know at what point I would have intervened. I tired out pretty quickly on Saturday hitting fly-balls to my grand kids, so I don't think my punching would be very effective. I think what I would have done, because I played tackle, is throw my considerable mass of an aching body at the perps' knee caps and hoped for the best.

Now, Clete, Robicheaux's buddy, that's a different matter. I hesitate to think what he might have done.

 

 

by Oxy Mora 4/26/2011 - 11:32 am (re: Desider)

OK, so maybe I'm just a bit sports-ignorant, but what sport has both fly-balls and tackling?

by Verified Atheist 4/26/2011 - 11:51 am (re: Oxy Mora)

Sex.

by Oxy Mora 4/26/2011 - 12:31 pm (re: Verified Atheist)

Given that answer, I would humbly suggest you re-read the comment I was responding to…

(I mean, with your grandkids?!?)

by Verified Atheist 4/26/2011 - 2:17 pm (re: Oxy Mora)

Canadian baseball.

And Question Period.

by quinn esq 4/26/2011 - 1:43 pm (re: Verified Atheist)

Yes, someone needs to give Oxy some wiffle bat practice, move her up to fungo, and by the time she's wielding a Louisville Slugger properly - some bovine hormone and weight repititions filling in - should be able to take on any freak at McDonalds. My suggestion is probably you're a bit lighter, so a 28", 20oz version will give you a fast swing and quick rebound (you don't want them grabbing the thing and using it on you). If you're concerned about bruises, a couple wrappings of newspaper keeps the blue out.

And as they say, Play Ball!!! 

by Desider 4/26/2011 - 2:27 pm (re: quinn esq)

Where do you get this great stuff, James? Guys on the street hitting each other with beer bottles. Wrapping baseball bats with newspapers to prevent bruising? 

Anyway, thinking of wrapping, and other not even not funny comments which cycle us  back to the original post on the possibilities of depraved thinking, this is one--a wrap.

by Oxy Mora 4/26/2011 - 3:13 pm (re: Desider)

It ain't over till the fat lady sings. And till someone mentions De Niro's baseball elegy in "Untouchables".

"Baseball! A man stands alone at the plate. This is the time for what? For individual achievement. There he stands alone. But in the field, what? Part of a team. Teamwork... Looks, throws, catches, hustles. Part of one big team. Bats himself the live-long day, Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, and so on. If his team don't field... what is he? You follow me? No one. Sunny day, the stands are full of fans. What does he have to say? I'm goin' out there for myself. But... I get nowhere unless the team wins."

Thunk.

by Desider 4/26/2011 - 3:24 pm (re: Oxy Mora)

Hmmm, interesting.

This is a little bit from an NPR story I heard on the recent death of photojournalist Tim Hetherington. It may help you understand what was going through that germans mind. Or maybe not. I'll just submit it, fwiw.

Last year, I spoke to Tim Hetherington about a documentary he co-directed with Sebastian Junger. It's called "Restrepo," and it was nominated for an Oscar.

Hetherington made the film while he was embedded with U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan. And during the interview, he shared an anecdote about the death of one soldier and how another soldier was very disturbed because Hetherington had kept filming.

Later, that soldier apologized, and so did Tim Hetherington.

(Soundbite of archived broadcast)

Mr. TIM HETHERINGTON (Director, "Restrepo"): I just said, listen, I'm really sorry. I'm just in default. I'm in shock. I just go into default mode, which is just to carry on filming, almost like the camera protects me.

And in some ways, it's the same thing as soldiers. I think you're in a state of shock and you can't react - you know, you bury these things deep inside of yourself that - and one day later, you have to kind of face up to those events.

http://www.npr.org/2011/04/20/135580887/photojournalist-hetherington-kil...

I'd never really thought of it that way. Perhaps though understanding our very human limitations, we can find empathy, even for people we find impossible to understand.

(hug)

by bwakfat 4/25/2011 - 9:52 pm (re: Articleman)

Chicken, thank you for responding.  Before commenting back, in the interest of not putting on undeserved airs, I need to confess that when the guy jumped in after looking at me and then-wife (we were atop the LaSalle Street bridge about a half-city block away, he was down on the concrete walkway just above the river far below us), then-wife almost immediately got what was happening, and I thought he was just swimming.  Probably within 45 seconds she got me to see that he wasn't treading water well and may have intended self-injury.  So none of us reacted to it the same way, and I didn't get it right away, which likely didn't matter in the end, but it might have.

So we decided to split up, her to run to find a phone and me to throw the life preserver to him (I can't swim, and it's hard to get out of the Chicago River at this spot).  The whole time the German was closer to the scene.  He gets out his camera from his briefcase.  She eventually got 911, and I got to the water with the life preserver just in time to see him bob down out of view.  Turns out the dude had a cellphone in his briefcase and went for the camera.  It's even weirder now that Kyle has pointed out all the Good Samaritan laws in Europe.

So I don't know what made that guy tick, that's for sure.  It's a welcome reminder, and the experience was a really important one to me, so I'm glad for a new way to look at it.  But there were only four people around, the homeless guy (Howard), the German guy, and L. and myself.  I had a hard time that week because I felt I should have realized more quickly that he was drowning, and should have gotten to the spot with the life preserver sooner.  I just can't imagine seeing him flailing and staying behind the camera.  

I did a photo show last year largely themed around death (roadside memorials), and there's a photo in it of a memorial to a 16 year old girl named Sugey who died on I-25.  Some people find the art exploitive of her.  It's meant to be respectful and evocative, and I couldn't make art about a dead stranger without trying to do that.  So I guess in that sense too, the German's actions feel like misappropriating something sacred, by not honoring it, by kind of pimping it.

But I have to say in the end that your comment is really cool.  Empathy is great, but there are the unknowns in people that we don't know.  It can be good to remember, necessary to, even.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 11:43 pm (re: bwakfat)

My intent was to offer some comfort, if possible. I do struggle with the feeling "if only," myownself, and have for 30 years.

Sometimes, I think we're all bound up in a fate that plods along, and our actions may not make any difference at all, but at the same time, that doesn't give us an excuse not to try. You did try. You went above and beyond, at least, from this chickens perspective.

by bwakfat 4/26/2011 - 8:36 pm (re: Articleman)

Thank you, Chicken.  That's kind.

by Articleman 4/26/2011 - 11:39 pm (re: bwakfat)

In today's climate, people who observe violent acts may feel tht if a person is crazy enough to attack another person in public, they are crazy enough to attack you. There is also the threat of the violent person being armed. If a person is angry enough to attack a person for being transgendered, they probably have such low esteem for themselves that they feel that they have nothing to lose. Blowing a good Samaritan away might not even be an afterthought.

The use of the N-word on the website noted by Articleman reflects tensions between some in the LGBT community and some in the Black community. There are likely still bad feelings about the way Blacks voted for Prop 8 in California and the 20% of Black voters in Ohio who voted for GW Bush over Kerry following Bush's religious outreach program that focused on an anti-Gay marriage agenda.

by rmrd0000 4/25/2011 - 11:31 am

I confess to having broken up fights thrice in my life, and it was expressly because outrage and adrenalin surged passed thinking.  Stupid, but some events can compel us to act reflexively.  I do get now in my life, I can't leap in.  But not many years ago I use my car to break up a fight, only getting out at the last minute, and staying near the open door for safety sake.  Did all the police follow-up, etc. so the perpetrator could pay for it.  Leaping into a conflict in which you know there are weapons would be a whole 'nother ballgame, IMO.

by we are stardust 4/25/2011 - 11:43 am (re: rmrd0000)

I wonder if anyone with a cellphone thought to call the police? The guy who videotaped the event might be able to use the exuse that he was saving i for the police, if h actually made the police aware of his acton. If he didn't call the police, or mke the tape available to police, then his actions cannot be defended. It's possible that he thought that the police would confiscate his phone. Sad.

by rmrd0000 4/25/2011 - 12:29 pm (re: we are stardust)

There are tensions between different communities, and the need to knit them together.  I knew an African-American in law school who absolutely hated the comparison of the gay civil rights struggle (then far less evolved, it was 1989) to the civil rights movement of the 1950s and 1960s, which I remember bumming me out when I discussed it with him.  

I think tensions between these communities can and do run in both directions (the thread is evidence of that, as queer-sympathetic people tend to read Bilerico and there were so many deletions for racial stuff).  One takeaway from the thread over there is the need for empathy running both directions.  It was good that the author preemptively signaled that he wasn't going to allow either racist or transphobic comments in the thread, it was a not-gentle hint and a good one. 

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 12:02 pm (re: rmrd0000)

I had a similar interaction with a Jewish friend who wanted clear distinctions between the Holocaust and Slavery/Civil Rights.

by rmrd0000 4/25/2011 - 1:10 pm (re: Articleman)

I hadn't mentioned it, but the assailants happen to be black, and the victim white, and the thread is pocked with (largely moderated) instances of gross racism and N-word dropping.  One commenter laments any social injustice, and in the same breath calls the perps "bitches".  There is race hostility, race guilt, sexism, and other varieties of hostility.  I won't comment on it, but it's worth a read too. 

It needs to be mentioned. Like this. Or this.

The maddening, inescapable fact is that anger's targets aren't fair--it's usually kick-the-dogism writ large.--Ta Nehisi Coates

by artappraiser 4/25/2011 - 12:02 pm

I also liked Obama's Georgia primary speech in which he noted homophobia in King's pulpit.  It connected these different civil rights struggles, which for me has always been a truth.  It spoke to me.

Your links both reflect or reproach homophobia in the black community, which is at least partly consistent with the comments rmrd made.  I would again respond that there are also some LGBT people who reflect racism or sexism at times.  For me, the truth of the video is more universal, the need for empathy it calls out more universal. 

And homophobia aside, there is also less of a consensus for the humane and equal treatment of transgendered people than there is for gay, lesbian or bi people, or people of color, IMO, another point it calls out in sharp relief.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 12:08 pm (re: artappraiser)

But I was particularly disturbed by a German tourist who filmed the drowning from the LaSalle Street bridge over the Chicago River without trying to call 911 or throw a flotation device.

I first thought about this type of behavior as encapsulating kind of an anti-Heisenberg principle but inaction is action. And I thought, hell, we are going to be inundated by these types of films as filming capabilities have been distributed to millions and most probably billions.

And what if someone is thinking about suicide, sees a camera or two and then decides to go ahead with it because he is being filmed.

Your transgender story and report concerning the comments demonstrates that all of us or at least most of us have this incredible bias that we deal with every day...and some event takes place and we explode.

I guess that is what confession is for as a holy rite! ha

by Richard Day 4/25/2011 - 1:04 pm

There are countries, I believe France is one, which have laws making a person criiminally liable if they could have helped in an emergency but did not do so.

by A Guy Called LULU 4/25/2011 - 1:40 pm

Hey LULU.  I originally wrote this blog with a paragraph on how American law is really wrapped up in the act/inaction distinction.  Goes to our freedoms, I guess, in this case the freedom of people to watch a brutal beating without lifting a finger.  This also follows on Dick's comment above.  The hypothetical in Criminal Law of someone dying in a ditch and someone pausing to see that and then driving on, without any responsibility, can never sit well.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 1:45 pm (re: A Guy Called LULU)

I'm sure you're familiar with the hand grenade argument. I encountered it in a college class called Doing Philosophy. Very briefly, someone throws a grenade into a circle of soldiers. If a soldier hurls himself on the grenade, sacrificing himself to save everyone, we call him a hero, but if he doesn't, do we call him a coward? IOW, can we require people to sacrifice for the common good? Back then the prof was leading up to the abortion debate, but it seems to apply here as well.

by Donal 4/25/2011 - 1:52 pm (re: Articleman)

My comment upthread about the collective action issue presented here is at least related to your point.  I'd say the people who didn't attempt to give aid during the seizures are cowards.  And while I wouldn't go that far on people not breaking up the attack, once the employee who tried to break it up shouted at them, I would hope others would at least join in that kind of general discouragement of the perps, especially because the perps had not shown or implied they had weapons.  There is a lot to be said for calling the police and waiting, but what are the two perps going to do if the crew comes out from behind the counter and says, please leave?  They didn't seem like they were going to attack anyone who spoke to them, nor did they attack the guy who did.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 2:00 pm (re: Donal)

I'd say the people who didn't attempt to give aid during the seizures are cowards.

Here in Washington State, they may also be breaking the law.

More stuff in general about Duty to Rescue can be found here.

by kyle flynn 4/25/2011 - 3:25 pm (re: Articleman)

Look at the roster of states enacting these laws, very interesting.  Cool to learn something today, thanks very much.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 3:28 pm (re: kyle flynn)

It's like a big red dish towel pinned up on the wall with a handful of blue push pins across the top. Reminds me of a map I saw recently.

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 4:45 pm (re: Articleman)

Somewhat off target but freedom of expression reminded me of an issue which school administrators are now having in regard to defining "bullying" behavior, so I'll mention it. Discussion the other night on PBS that although a school may have specific rules, etc., on bullying, the problem is that the bullying happens on-line, out of school, but involves students who would otherwise be under school discipline. Seems to put the administrators in a tough position to make the call. 

by Oxy Mora 4/25/2011 - 1:58 pm (re: Articleman)

I wasn't taking a position on whether such a law is "right" or not but throwing it out for possible reaction. I watched the video early this morning on a link from a different sight. Anyone would agree, I think, that several of the people present could have easily stopped the beating but didn't. I think their actions, or inaction, is despicable. I would have had no qualms about punching one or both of the attackers in the nose after they went back over and over and brutally kicked and punched the victim. I am confident that that would have stopped the attack if more moderate means had already failed.
 Most laws are passed to enforce actions which we believe people should take regardless the law.  While a law such as I referred to would likely have so many grey areas that I doubt I would be in favor of it, if we had such a law I believe several men at that McDonalds would be correctly found guilty of violating it.

by A Guy Called LULU 4/25/2011 - 2:16 pm (re: Articleman)

I think your comment is exactly right, and I respectfully second that I would have run out against the attackers, not saying I would have punched anyone, though I would respect others for doing so.

by Articleman 4/25/2011 - 2:20 pm (re: A Guy Called LULU)

The Wiki article linked above was quite interesting both in what it informed but also some questions it suggested.  When it got past discussions of codified law and addressed our ethical obligation to intervene it began with the following.

"Legal requirements for a duty to rescue do not pertain in all nations, states, or localities. However, a moral or ethical duty to rescue may exist even where there is no legal duty to rescue. There are a number of potential justifications for such a duty.

One sort of justification is general and applies regardless of role-related relationships (doctor to patient; firefighter to citizen, etc.). Under this general justification, persons have a duty to rescue other persons in distress by virtue of their common humanity, regardless of the specific skills of the rescuer or the nature of the victim's distress.

These would justify cases of rescue and in fact make such rescue a duty even between strangers. They explain why philosopher Peter Singer suggests that if we saw a child drowning and could intervene to save him, we would do so, no matter the damage to our clothing or shoes or how late it might make us for a meeting. Singer goes on to say that we should also attempt to rescue distant strangers, not just nearby children, because globalization has made it possible for us to do so".


Jumping from the micro to the macro makes some things look way different. Singer sounds like a neo-con to me. I am not a fan.

by A Guy Called LULU 4/25/2011 - 6:23 pm (re: Articleman)

I don't want to run too far afield, but I'm curious.  Are you "not a fan" of Singer in general, or not a fan of the idea you've highlighted in red?  Or something I'm missing entirely?  Because Singer is no neo-con.

by kyle flynn 4/25/2011 - 8:28 pm (re: A Guy Called LULU)

 It is the idea highlighted in red that sounds to me like a neo-con idea. So, while I feel people are often obligated to get involved at close range, applying the same judgment to international affairs brings in many, many factors  of circumstance and my personal judgment of past results in foreign intervention, usually called "help", makes my default position different than what Stinger seems to advocate in this tiny reference to his philosophy. I did not mean that Stinger is a neo-con himself, 100% of what I know about him comes from the bit I quoted above.

by A Guy Called LULU 4/25/2011 - 8:50 pm (re: kyle flynn)

As in 'P2P' memes used as a rationale for er...warlike interference with no endgame plans?

by we are stardust 4/25/2011 - 8:56 pm (re: A Guy Called LULU)

Yeah, I think so. Just jump in, let it flow, and know that it will all work out if we pool our efforts because we are "exceptional" know how to analyze the data, and can figure out and institute what all the unexceptional really need as we go along.

by A Guy Called LULU 4/25/2011 - 9:26 pm (re: we are stardust)

Oddly, I'm working on a piece that has as a subtext: 'the experts will get it right any minute now'; something we've been trained to believe, wah, wah...   ;o)

How's that working out so far?  Depends who you are?

by we are stardust 4/25/2011 - 9:33 pm (re: A Guy Called LULU)

Just saw this:

A DAD-of-four who split up a fight in a McDonald’s was shot dead moments after being told he wouldn’t see the morning.

Raymond Mitchell, 34, had only popped into the restaurant to buy a hot chocolate.

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But he apparently caused offence after splitting up two men fighting in the queue.

One of them, who had several gold teeth, shouted at Raymond: “You are gonna die tonight, you are not gonna see the morning.”

The thug is then said to have phoned an accomplice to fetch a gun, yelling into his mobile: “Bring me that thing.”

Raymond left the 24-hour McDonald’s but was chased into a cul-de-sac. The gun was then delivered and Mr Mitchell was beaten and pistol-whipped before being shot three times in an alley in Brixton, South London, at 6.50am on Sunday. Raymond, nicknamed Brown, was taken to hospital but died hours later.

One neighbour, who saw the shooting but was too terrified to be named, said: “He was begging, literally begging for his life. I didn’t dare look out my window in case they saw me. I heard them laughing and swearing at him, calling him a ‘b***h’. I heard them laughing afterwards as well.”

Raymond’s partner, who asked not to be named, said: “I’m terrified. They’re still out there and they’ve not been caught. I’ve been told how they were laughing, actually laughing after they beat him and shot him. How could anybody do something like that?”

by Donal 4/26/2011 - 7:56 am

How could that story be correct? Doesn't England outlaw private gun ownership?

by A Guy Called LULU 4/26/2011 - 10:08 am (re: Donal)

Yes, to a point, but so does Baltimore.

by Donal 4/26/2011 - 10:31 am (re: A Guy Called LULU)

The guns of Brixton.

by Articleman 4/26/2011 - 12:22 pm (re: Donal)

You know, what I think of most in this case isn't Kitty Genovese, but lynchings. Especially the lynching postcards that people produced in the South, with crowds of participants smiling for the camera right beside the victim's body.

That's what makes it a hate crime: it's a public act, meant to communicate that the victim is not allowed their rights in public. And the perpetrators expect that every bystander will have their back.

by Doctor Cleveland 4/26/2011 - 7:21 pm

You're entirely correct.  It's a collective violation of a person's humanity, though in this case, unlike a lynching, there is a guy showing some courage running out and screaming at the perps.  It would be fascinating to me to know what the other bystander employees thought or did.  

The tweets from one employee (since taken down, but there are screen shots of them on the net) give some window into his thoughts, which are consistent with the perps views that for using the women's bathroom and smarting off to the perps, the appropriate sentence was assault and humiliation.

The fact that the guy posted the video, aside from showing what an utter moron he is, is oddly consistent with your analogy.

by Articleman 4/26/2011 - 11:45 pm (re: Doctor Cleveland)

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