dagblog - Comments for "Advice to Democrats: Divide and Conquer"

Yeah, they have some problems

oleeb — Sat, 30 Jul 2011 01:57:27 +0000

Yeah, they have some problems and I wish it were possible to actually split them but it just isn't gonna happen and even if it were within reach the Democrats, particularly under Obama, are so weak and inept they couldn't manage to exploit that weakness. It is sad, but all too true that as disgraceful and reprehensible as the Republicans are, the Democrats match them in terms of incompetence and cowardly weakness.

I've always tried to live

brewmn — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 20:02:14 +0000

In reply to I, for one, welcome the

I've always tried to live there, jolly. You'll note that I decided Obama wasn't going to benefit from my meager political largesse a little more than a year after he took office. It was clear to me by that time he wasn't going to fight our fight in any meaningful way. That said, I still think he'll win in 2012, and I hold out some hope that we'll look back on his presidency, if not with pride, at least with the knowledge that it was the transitional political moment that pushed the John Birch wing of our politics back into the corner they scurried out of when right-thinking folks were blinded by the genial folksiness of Ronald Reagan.

And, are you really sure you;re the best person to be assessing the "good mental health" of others? ;)

Oleeb, your history is

Michael Wolraich — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 14:29:31 +0000

In reply to It would be nice if what you

Oleeb, your history is completely right. The Republican established their impressive unity by purging liberals like Mathias, and I don't want to underestimate their ability to stand together.

But there is also something different this year. Gingrich and DeLay fostered the young right-wing reps and used them like stormtroopers to push their agenda.

Boehner, by contrast, is not in control of the right wing, which has an even larger presence than in Gingrich and DeLay's time. The Tea Party Republicans don't owe him anything and do not offer him allegiance. They've been virtually out of control on this debt thing.

Political conflict is driven not only by issues but also by personalities and factional loyalties. This Republican coalition is more socially unstable than at any point since the early 90s when moderates led by Dole and faced off against Gingrich's conservatives.

(That said, I don't really disagree about your prescriptions for Dems, who need to recover some kind of core principles.)

I understand the frustration,

Verified Atheist — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 11:11:31 +0000

In reply to You do know though, that if

I understand the frustration, and don't have any easy answers. However, Republicans are as likely to tell you not to vote for Bernie because you don't want to hurt the Democrats as Democrats are to tell you not to vote for Bachmann/Palin because you don't want to hurt the Republicans. I.e., most Republicans would love for you to vote for Sanders. (The only ones that wouldn't be the ones who would be afraid he might actually win, just as with Democrats and Bachmann/Palin. That said, I think Bachmann/Palin are more likely than Sanders, as frightening as that sounds.)

You do know though, that if

Resistance — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 11:01:44 +0000

In reply to Bernie: http://www.youtube.co

You do know though, that if we push for Bernie; some will accuse us of undermining the Democrats chances in upcoming elections?

We are told "Some day the Democrats will all think like Bernie". Win the Future, don't vote for Bernie Now, do it in the future.

Some Democrats and Republicans would tell us "You wouldn't want to hurt the Democrats, by voting your conscience now. Wait and keep waiting; we should take baby steps for the good of the Democratic Party"

Bernie speaks up in defense of many. The Democrats give lip service, "Win The Future"

I, for one, welcome the

jollyroger — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 05:45:57 +0000

In reply to I can think of a few folks

I, for one, welcome the Brewman to Reality City, and look forward to his evolution towards good mental health...

It would be nice if what you

oleeb — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 05:17:57 +0000

In reply to Advice to Democrats: Divide and Conquer

It would be nice if what you are recommending was something that will work but unfortunately it is not. Republicans are in essential agreement on every major issue and most minor issues. They also understand that when they stick together they achieve more favorable outcomes. No temporary fissure in that rock solid unity will have any lasting effect whatsoever on the Republicans.

In contrast, Republicans exploit pre-existing structural and permanent divisions among those who call themselves Democrats. The Blue Dog group of Democrats fundamentally disagree with the mainstream thinking of the Democratic Party and openly favor corporate interests over those of the common people. These so-called centrist Democrats routinely depart from the mainstream of the Democratic Party and undermine the basic agenda the majority of Democrats seek to implement. In other words, the "centrists" are not really Democrats at all but politicians who have aligned themselves much closer tothe interests of their major corporate donors than to their constituency back home.

The internal dynamicsof the Republican Party used to be somewhat similar to the situation found in the Democratic Parrty. However, since 1980, right wing Republicans have driven nearly every moderate voice in the party from office. I had dinner with Sen. Charles Mathias, a famous and well regarded Republican Senator back in the mid 80's prior to his retirement. I was in graduate school and he was a dinner guest of our program. He stated quite unequivocally that the right wing extremists, then called "the new right" were blunt in communicating their message to Republicans like him and the message was "we don't have room for you in our party any longer: get out!" Their efforts have been quite successful.

Because there is really no fundamental disagreement within the Republican Party on issues, the idea that Democrats could help open up a split and exploit for anything other than this one moment of division is a nice, but impractical notion. The only way to defeatthe Republicans is to fight them, take them head on, denounce them as the extremists they are and for Democrats to start standing for something other than their own re-election.

Democrats in Washington from Obama on down are so craven, calculating and unprincipled that they repel voters as much as the Republicans do albeit in very different ways. But there's no way they can either fight them or divide them if Democrats don't start standing for something. It used to be that one knew that when all was said and done you could count on Democrats to defend Social Security, Medicare, and the interests of the common people. Now with Obama's assault on Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid he has made the message to America very clear that the people can no longer count on Democrats to be the guardians of their interests, thus making the Republicans' point for them and severely weakening every Democrat running for office in America no matter how high or low.

I can think of a few folks

AmericanDreamer — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 03:37:52 +0000

In reply to Just a note from a confirmed

I can think of a few folks around here who would be surprised, and pleasantly so, to hear of this. Of course they might just think you're cheap.

Bernie: http://www.youtube.co

Dan Kervick — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 00:15:09 +0000

In reply to Likewise, thanks for sharing

Bernie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=If_1T4Os270&feature=player_profilepage

I love this blog and agree

tmccarthy0 — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 17:44:44 +0000

In reply to Advice to Democrats: Divide and Conquer

I love this blog and agree with yor sentiment 100%.