dagblog - Comments for "Oklahoma officials prevent school massacre"

Senator Barbara F today on

trkingmomoe — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 17:24:13 +0000

In reply to Oklahoma officials prevent school massacre

Senator Barbara F today on MTP said she has been working on a bill since 2004 that covers a lot of what you explained on how they classify, sell and ship these weapons. The ban is going to include this. The bill will be introduced on the first day of the new Congress in both houses at the same time. It is a law that the NRA will not be able to.win in court to over turn. I guess we will have to wait and see how tough it will be on gun shows too. The tools and autherization for adding new weapons to be banned are in the 1968 gun ban act. Lives are worth more then the 29 million that the NRA spent on this last election.

Since the Newton massacre

NCD — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 14:26:05 +0000

In reply to Oklahoma officials prevent school massacre

Since the Newton massacre there were (2) killed in a shooting at the Excalibur Casino in Vegas, (3) killed in a shooting at a hospital in Alabama, and (50) shots fired outside a mall in southern California, causing no injuries but panic.

I checked online and it is legal to mail order a 100 round drum magazine for a Bushmaster assault weapon and ship it to Newton, Conn. No problem. The assault weapon itself is OK too "As long as they were either pre-ban, or are neutered (no bayonet lug or folding/collapsing stocks, and have either no flash hider or a permanently pinned one)." But, get this..... you might have to pick the gun up from a 'FFL' running guns from his pickup truck.

An FFL is a Federal firearm license, it allows the holder to buy and sell guns and military style weapons from the home or the pickup truck, Instructions for getting one are here. They have a package deal where you can get a regular FFL AND a 'Class 3' instruction packet for $54.99. The Class 3 allows you to legally own and sell machine guns, silencers, and make or modify fully auto weapons.

One online seller has a list of FFL holders who they can ship your gun to in states that don't allow you to get the assault weapon from Fed Ex or UPS. They ship it there, you pick it up, the FFL may even come by your house to drop it off.

Ables's 'Sporting Goods' explains how that works here.

States violating the Republican Party Platform on magazine size are:

States Prohibiting Large-Capacity Magazines:

California	10 round limit
Hawaii	10 round limit
Maryland	20 round limit
Massachusetts	20 round limit
New Jersey	15 round limit
New York	10 round limit

The other part of this

Richard Day — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 09:29:38 +0000

In reply to P.S. In the story there's a

The other part of this concerns the intelligence of the perpetrator/conspirator.

So let's say there is one psycho for every ten thousand young men (most of them white).

Okay, then there are one in a hundred psychos who are really really bright!

The one in Oklahoma was not that bright. I mean he 'reached out' to classmates.

Of course as soon as we hear 'Oklahoma' we are not thinking of the silly musical anymore.

The CT psycho trusted in no one; as far as we know.

The Aurora situation presented another 'lone gunner'.

The less people that know; the least likely anyone will find out, I suppose.

P.S. In the story there's a

artappraiser — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 08:47:40 +0000

In reply to It is very interesting. Like

P.S. In the story there's a suggestion that investigating police did a decent job. In that they went and corroborated the first accusation with separate data, like from a teacher who knew of the kid recently buying a gun and practicing with it. But what happens when the investigators/investigation is lousy? (As inevitably happens, as not all cops are good.) When the snitching is really a set up of someone nobody likes? A kid's life ruined?

What are we willing to risk for prevention? That's always the question. About civilization, how to maintain it. Without security, you got nothing.

It is very interesting. Like

artappraiser — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 08:39:41 +0000

In reply to Oklahoma officials prevent school massacre

It is very interesting.

Like the "if you see something, say something" campaign in NYC as regards terrorism, you have a situation here that some might call snitching; from the Tulsa World article:

Police were notified of the plot Thursday afternoon by school administrators who had been told of the alleged plan by another student, the affidavit states. Chavez had told the students he would place bombs by the auditorium doors and that when police arrived, he would detonate them.

As police conducted their investigation, officers learned that Chavez had told a teacher last week that he’d bought a Colt .45 gun and had spent the weekend shooting it, the affidavit says.

While no one wants our schools to end up like East Germany with everyone snitching on each other for ulterior motives, I don't see any of the other solutions suggested not impinging on some rights, or what many consider rights, either. (I.E., gun rights, rights of the mentally ill or mentally disturbed, rights of other people subjected to searches for security, etc)

When you're dealing with "terrorism," if you want to move to preventitive measures, something's got to give somewhere on the civil rights front.

Rampage killings are similar to what we call terrorism in several ways; two important ones as I see it: virtually all of them are planned, and successful ones are rare. I've seen many liberals/lefties make the argument about terrorism that because successful terrorist incidents are so rare, we shouldn't step over the line in prevention to impinging on rights, but just accept that they are going to happen, and prosecute afterwards. One problem is our legal system isn;'t made to venture well into conspiracy and thought crimes, it's focused on prosecuting actions, not talk.

Are people willing to see some kids unfairly prosecuted for school killing plots in order to make a dent in incidents and in order to make this kind of talk as unacceptable as joking about a bomb in an airport?

Story raises a lot of interesting questions.

It has been hard to wrap my

trkingmomoe — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 08:24:33 +0000

In reply to Oklahoma officials prevent school massacre

It has been hard to wrap my mind around all this. I have been raising kids for a long time and was a NCO in the Army National Guard with many young men under my responsibility. I do know one thing from my experience is that modern hand weapons of war needs to be reclassified as Title II weapons. Here is the link to wiki on the history of the 1968 Gun Control Act and the NFA firearms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Title_II_weapons

This law would not of happened but because of all the high profile assassinations. It was built on the New Deal Law that band Tommy Guns.

It is time for the Regan era to end because it is killing our children. Our kids are more important then the profits from gun sales. It is time to stop worshipping the gods of the rich and their money.