dagblog - Comments for "Fooling Ourselves"

I think the analogy is off,

Orion — Wed, 23 Jan 2013 04:39:59 +0000

I think the analogy is off, Peracles. A play on the life of Ceasar is analogous to a movie about Abraham Lincoln. Most people wouldn't watch a movie about Lincoln because they are getting off on seeing Honest Abe get his head blown off.

Grand Theft Auto and Bloodrayne - those games feed antisocial tendencies. I'm not saying they should be banned. I played alot of them, they were fun, but at least look at them for what they obviously are.

The swords and daggers in

PeraclesPlease — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:24:51 +0000

In reply to The pornography bit is a very

The swords and daggers in Julius Caesar weren't for show or a sign of nobility - they were to kill Caesar. Though like in real life, many times weapons are used for suicide, not just murder. But most time they're used to terrorize and kill.

Banquo (Macbeth)
Out horseback riding with his son, Fleance, Banquo is cornered by three murderers hired by Macbeth. Banquo is slain but Fleance escapes.

Lady Macduff (Macbeth)
Lady Macduff is chased down and slaughtered offstage by Macbeth's henchmen. Her son is also killed by the murderers.

Polonius (Hamlet)
Acting as a spy for King Claudius, Polonius hides behind a curtain in Gertrude's chamber to listen to her conversation with Hamlet. Hearing a noise, Hamlet stabs through the curtain and kills the old eavesdropper.

Cordelia (King Lear)
A murderer hired by the evil Edmund hangs Cordelia in her cell.

Emilia (Othello)
Emilia is stabbed by her husband, Iago, when she reveals his role in the plot against Desdemona and Cassio.

Lavinia (Titus Andronicus)
After being raped and mutilated by Tamora's two sons, Chiron and Demetrius, Lavinia is murdered by her own father, Titus, to spare her further shame.

Gertrude (Hamlet)
The Queen drinks from the poisoned chalice of wine intended for Hamlet. She dies exclaiming, "The drink, the drink! I am poison'd" (5.2.320).

Claudius (Hamlet)
Hamlet stabs Claudius with the poisoned rapier and then forces him to drink from the poisoned goblet.

Titus Andronicus (Titus Andronicus)
Saturninus kills Titus Andronicus after Titus reveals that he has baked Tamora's two sons in the meat pie that Saturninus and Tamora are eating.

Tamora (Titus Andronicus)
Tamora is stabbed to death with a butcher's knife by her arch nemesis, Titus Andronicus, at the gruesome dinner party arranged for the Emperor.

Regan (King Lear)
Regan is poisoned by her sister, Goneril, after she sets her sights on Goneril's lover, Edmund.

Assassination and Execution
There is no sure foundation set on blood,
No certain life achieved by other's death.
King John (4.2.104-5)

Hamlet's Father (Hamlet)
Claudius, Hamlet's uncle, assassinated Hamlet's father by pouring the "juice of cursed hebenon" (1.5.63) in his ear while he slept in his orchard. Hebenon is a folk name for Henbane, the expressed juice of the fresh plant, Hyoscyamus niger. Other folk names for Henbane include Black Nightshade, Cassilago, Devil's Eye, and Jupiter's Bean. The death of Hamlet's father was inspired by a real event in 1538, when the Duke of Urbino was killed by a poisoned lotion rubbed into his ears by his barber.

Duke of Clarence (Richard III)
The pitiful Clarence is wrongfully arrested and jailed in the Tower by his brother, Richard. One night as he awakens from a terrifying nightmare, two henchmen sent by Richard burst into his cell. Clarence pleads for his life but one of the assassins stabs him. To ensure Clarence is dead, the first murderer drowns him in a "malmsey-butt", a cask of sweet wine also containing the severed heads of two hogs.

Richard II (Richard II)
King Richard II, usurped by Bolingbroke, later Henry IV, is taken to the Tower of London. Contemplating remarks made by Bolingbroke, a nobleman named Exton mistakenly believes that Bolingbroke desires Richard dead, and he takes his henchmen to Richard's cell and kills him.

Henry VI (3 Henry VI)
The pious but ineffectual Henry VI is stabbed to death in his Tower of London cell. His assassin is the villainous Richard, Duke of Gloucester, soon to become Richard III.

Coriolanus (Coriolanus)
A group of merciless conspirators, spurred on by the leader of the Volscians, Aufidius, surround and stab Coriolanus in the play's final scene.

Julius Caesar (Julius Caesar)
Conspirators fearing a return to tyranny close in on Caesar and stab him to death.

Duncan (Macbeth)
The noble King of Scotland is murdered in his sleep by Macbeth during his visit to Macbeth's castle, Dunsinane.

Aaron (Titus Andronicus)
Aaron, sentenced to death by the new emperor, Lucius, is to be buried up to his neck in the sand and starved to death.

Killed in Combat
I have no words;
My voice is in my sword.
Macbeth (5.8.6-7)

Macbeth (Macbeth)
Macduff and Macbeth fight ferociously in hand-to-hand combat, before Macduff appears holding Macbeth's severed head.

Mercutio (Romeo and Juliet)
Romeo refuses to fight Tybalt, the cousin of his darling Juliet. Enraged that Romeo will not defend his honor, Mercutio challenges Tybalt to a duel. Romeo attempts to separate the two, but Tybalt fatally wounds Mercutio. As he dies, Mercutio cries, "A plague o' both your houses!/They have made worms' meat of me." (3.1.108-9).

Tybalt (Romeo and Juliet)
Romeo challenges Tybalt to a duel after Tybalt kills Romeo's cousin, Mercutio. The fight is short and Romeo leaves Tybalt dead on the ground.

Richard III (Richard III)
The Earl of Richmond, later Henry VII, slays the outrageous villain on Bosworth field.

Hamlet (Hamlet)
Hamlet is stabbed with the end of Laertes' poisoned rapier.

Laertes (Hamlet)
During the final climatic fencing match, Laertes and Hamlet scuffle and their rapiers are accidentally exchanged. Hamlet grabs Laertes poisoned rapier and wounds Laertes. Laertes soon dies from the injury.

Hotspur (1 Henry IV)
Young Prince Hal duels and mortally wounds the honor-driven Hotspur on the battlefield. Hotspur manages to render a final speech, but dies before he can finish his last thoughts.

Edmund (King Lear)
The malicious villain is mortally wounded in a duel with Edgar.

Paris (Romeo and Juliet)
Romeo kills Paris in a duel before Juliet's tomb. Romeo promises the dying Paris that he will lay him beside Juliet.

Sheez, we've had these

PeraclesPlease — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:11:37 +0000

In reply to Darn it Peracles, you would

Sheez, we've had these debates since pre-history. I liked the 3 Stooges, but never hit my brothers in the head with a hammer. A war game is a war game - fantasy, whether we like shooting and bodies exploding, what not. Real war is something different. Trying to keep kids from viewing violence and loving it? some do, some don't - but it's like trying to eviscerate the sexual urge or telling people not to laugh.

The pedophilia bit is unfounded as well. Photos aren't a gateway drug to real pedophilia or anything else, alas, or I'd be in a room with 13 buxom bimbo babes and an 8-ball right now getting a -adoodle. (Don't presume what I wouldn't be tempted to do - it's the nature of my game...).

Re: what's ruined many marriages, 1) it's off-topic, 2) marriages have been ruined by war, disaster, children, work, poverty, frigidity, gossip, in-laws, cheating, religion, illness and disease, hobbies, boredom, cruelty, coming out of the closet, ritual fetish, and what not. Please, let's just stick with 1 ridiculous conversation for the time being, or I'll launch into a lecture on the joys of auto-trepanation and how it can enhance your sex life.

Worth adding:

Orion — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 08:47:16 +0000

In reply to The pornography bit is a very

Worth adding:

The pornography bit is a very

Orion — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 08:35:53 +0000

In reply to Darn it Peracles, you would

The pornography bit is a very good example, I think.

Swords in a Shakespearean play also represent something ... completely different. The swords were usually worn by people who represented some sort of nobility. They didn't aim to terrorize. Games like Grand Theft Auto or Max Payne or Bloodrayne - those are selling violence blatantly.

But those games really represent mental illness as opposed to the other way around. People like them because they want that violence on some level. They like to pretend to be a street thug who pulls people out of cars and shoots pedestrians. Drugs, social decay plus guns all result in what we are seeing now, I think.

Darn it Peracles, you would

Resistance — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:44:23 +0000

In reply to I've played DeathRace 2000

Darn it Peracles, you would have to throw a monkey wrench in the works.

The mentally ill and the slow-witted may have trouble processing this info, but the vast majority have no trouble with it.

You're correct the majority has no trouble, but it's the minority that is creating the havoc, shooting up the schools, because they were the mentally ill, the slow witted who fed on these games.

How do you prevent these kids from viewing violence and loving it?

To illustrate, another mind feeding problem

I would believe that investigators, who track pedophilia would say, the proliferation of photos feeds their lust for more; maybe no longer satisfied with pictures, they seek the real thing?

You and I wouldn't be tempted to view these abhorrent, disgusting things, but those who do, are ruined, and they look for prey, all because they viewed?

Another illustration: Internet pornography has ruined many marriages.

I've played DeathRace 2000

PeraclesPlease — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 07:14:46 +0000

In reply to We need to deal with this

I've played DeathRace 2000 till blue, loved movies from Blade Runner to Saw to whatever, blown up plenty of stuff in games, haven't been in a fight since I was 10. Games aren't violence, they're simulated violence. If I carry a sword in a Shakespearean play, I don't feel the need to carry my sword off-stage and smite people. Kids learn the difference between what-if and real life from the time they do their first peek-a-boo. The mentally ill and the slow-witted may have trouble processing this info, but the vast majority have no trouble with it.

Otherwise, why don't people who love roller coasters more often get on top of cliffs and just jump off, mistaking one kind of thrill for another? We be stoopid as a race?

(there's little correlation between playing a video game and actually condoning killing people as a political/military goal. If I know my DeathRace2000 car is actually guiding a real car running over real people, I take my hands off the controls. But if all of our society screams "revenge towards the Spanish/Indians/Germans/Muslims", then we put our hearts into actually killing. If people confuse political passion with a desire to physically eradicate the opposition, they've taken a jump to homicidal behavior - it's not just a slippery slope of gateway violence in video games)

I feel very strongly, that

Resistance — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 06:56:43 +0000

In reply to Whoa. I didn't expect that

I feel very strongly, that those who love civility and social well being, shouldn't have to make room and fill the desires of those who LOVE violence.

If not, we will have to continually find a way to defend against them, as they escalate and multiply in number.

It's like a house divided.

It would go a long ways in the prevention of these wicked, violent tendencies, displayed by these murderers, if we tried to eliminate what these lovers feed on.

GIGO Garbage In / Garbage Out ; Society really does, reap what it sows.

People fed on a steady diet of gun violence, and what should society expect?

Whoa. I didn't expect that

Orion — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 05:46:40 +0000

In reply to We need to deal with this

Whoa. I didn't expect that comment. LOL

We need to deal with this

Resistance — Tue, 22 Jan 2013 05:24:08 +0000

In reply to Fooling Ourselves

We need to deal with this epidemic of violence lovers, remove the affections of their hearts.

They who buy or rent these videos and games, loves violence.

We should not condone this

If God hates them, so should we

The LORD tests the righteous, but his soul hates the wicked and the one who loves violence.

(Psalm 11:5 ESV)