dagblog - Comments for "Moscow's Voice of Truth"

Great Britain has 1.85

NCD — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 15:46:30 +0000

In reply to Those who are "shocked" by

Great Britain has 1.85 million CCTV surveillance cameras, one for every 32 people in the UK. That is 'pathetic' compared to the NSA?

Would you feel more 'free' and less 'under surveillance' in Great Britain, Russia, China, Singapore, Saudi Arabia or say North or even South Korea than in the US?

The NSA undoubtedly has the largest digital cache of useless metadata in the world. I am also convinced they are wasting their time, billions of dollars, damaging the nation's reputation and actually reducing their capability to separate out the important information/data in recording all this clappertrap.

While also, ironically, scaring, among others, Facebookers (who personally record their lives online for every corporation on earth to exploit).

The initial lawsuit on phone

rmrd0000 — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 14:46:13 +0000

In reply to The courts continually say

The initial lawsuit on phone surveillance was dismissed because organizations filing the suit could not prove that they had been directly injured.Once the data regarding Verizon was made public, suits could be filed by groups that used Verizon, the Electronic Frontier Foundation is leading some of the suits.

I think this also parallels

Verified Atheist — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 13:14:59 +0000

In reply to Because the truth is

I think this also parallels why the US government created the clemency claim in the first place. It's easy for me to understand why Greenwald/Snowden find it important to set the record straight. It's harder for me to understand why our government would make such a claim that could easily be revealed as inaccurate, at best. That difficulty isn't stemming from a naïvety of faith in our government, unless it's a naïve faith that our government isn't run by complete idiots.

Because the truth is

acanuck — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 00:11:00 +0000

In reply to I found it interesting, but

Because the truth is important, art. That's why Greenwald is making a big issue of whether or not Snowden pleaded for clemency. Saying he did is a lie. The New York Times and AP are both lying.

Here's AP: "Snowden made the plea in a letter given to a German politician and released Friday. In his one-page typed letter, he asks for clemency for charges over allegedly leaking classified information about the NSA to the news media. 'Speaking the truth is not a crime,' Snowden wrote." That's a declaration of innocence, not a request for pardon.

And here's the New York Times: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/02/world/europe/snowden-appeals-to-us-for....

There's a link in NCD's post to the actual text of Snowden's short, succinct Der Spiegel letter/op-ed. The words "pardon" or "clemency" do not appear.

There is a petition for a Snowden pardon that has garnered 140,000 signatures on the whitehouse.gov website. I suppose that's what U.S. politicians are rejecting. If so, they should make that clear.

The courts continually say

Anonymous PP — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 20:16:37 +0000

In reply to I have maintained that the

The courts continually say they don't have jurisdiction - how can this be handled through the courts?

I have maintained that the

rmrd0000 — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 17:40:35 +0000

In reply to Those who are "shocked" by

I have maintained that the NSA scandal is going to havre to be attacked through the courts. I also maintain that the countries complains about being surveilled are doing the same to the US. Pakistan was aiding the drone program. France and Germany shared data with NSA.Brazil spies on US citizens. Those facts are not small issues but part of the big picture. Syria has hacked the NYT. Russia gave gifts to foreign leaders that were bugged.

I want everyone to leave me alone on the Internet unless I agree to communicate with them. That's everybody including the Syrians who have probably had access to my NYT account.

The NSA has to solve the problem of keeping the wires that carry the data in their big open secret storage facility in Utah, then they have to figure how how the big snipe hunt they will go on as they sift through mega data will actually prevent something.

By, the way, Hoover used good old shoe leather and unauthorized listening devices to be able to suggest that MLK Jr should commit suicide .Low tech can present a much more direct threat. The laws restricting the NSA have to be broad. The encryption technology needed to secure internet communications has to take foreign threats as well as domestic.

Government eavesdroppers?

Anonymous pp — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 17:39:43 +0000

In reply to Works well, I like AA's

Government eavesdroppers?

Those who are "shocked" by

Peter — Tue, 05 Nov 2013 16:33:02 +0000

In reply to I think the debate between

Those who are "shocked" by these revelations either haven't been paying attention or are seeking attention, Rmrd, to it's best to ignore them. Anyone who is just " learning" that other countries try to spy on us is either been in a lifelong coma or is lying. This is a huge scandal and these latest revelations are but a small part of that scandal and should be viewed as such. Trying to minimize the bigger story by pecking at the smaller stories is not gaining much traction because it is a pitiful attempt at diversion. The " they do it too" meme is pathetic and weak when you try to compare the NSA's surveillance capabilities with those of any other country.

Why is it so important to

A Guy Called LULU — Tue, 05 Nov 2013 15:37:22 +0000

In reply to I found it interesting, but

Why is it so important to make clear that Snowden hasn't asked for clemency? Very strange.

It doesn't seem strange at all to me.

I do not know Snowden's mind on this for sure but I have a guess. It could well be that he understands that asking for clemency would be a fundamental change in his stance as to why his actions were correct and therefore defensible even though they broke arbitrary laws. Asking for clemency would be seen by many as him having reconsidered his actions and come to realize that what he did was wrong and so is now asking for forgiveness and to be pardoned.
His release of classified information was against the law but there are cases in which breaking an arbitrary law is more than simply justified but is actually called for by duty to over-riding law or principle. Snowden asking for clemency would be an admission that in his case Snowden himself believes that breaking the law was not, in fact, justified and so he wants forgiveness.
Snowden's defense, both in a court of law for his actions and of his character in the court of public opinion, is that what he did was right and necessary. Snowden maintains his ethical stance by asking people to look at the facts and then understand why his actions were honorable, but that is very different than asking them to look at the facts and then forgive him. If he thinks that the word is going around that he wants forgiveness then I can see why he would very much like to squelch that idea.

I said if Snowden gave the

NCD — Tue, 05 Nov 2013 15:24:31 +0000

In reply to It's important because they

I said if Snowden gave the files away he no longer controls them, or access to them.

Sending them to Jupiter might have aided his case for clemency.