dagblog - Comments for "When Society is Insane"

Actually I would "blame" it

Elusive Trope — Sat, 07 Jun 2014 14:34:49 +0000

In reply to Whatever - states with 145

Actually I would "blame" it on Europeans more secular on the whole than those in the United States. I am not trying to diminish the advancements for the LGTB agenda in this country, but we do have to recognize that in many places, including those places where gay marriage is recognized as legal, there are many who resist the idea. I believe we are progressing forward, such as the end of don't ask don't tell, etc. And just as race was less of an issue in the presidential race among the younger voters (and not just the twenty somethings, but thirty somethings, and forty somethings), the same goes with the issue of sexual orientation.

As I commented to Orion down at the bottom of the thread, I would argue that we are becoming more sane not just here but elsewhere in some broad overall way, in spite of the horrors we see on the television and internet.

Maybe really what I wanted to do with this blog was to point out that the murder spree committed by Rodger can be a learning moment, if we don't just see him as some insane person who in no way reflects some of the "insanity" which is our culture.

Whatever - states with 145

PeraclesPlease — Sat, 07 Jun 2014 13:44:36 +0000

In reply to While we are a de facto

Whatever - states with 145 million+. Blame it on Santa Claus if you want. And whatever Congress did, it was going to end in the courts - again, how the US system works - note ObamaCare etc.

While we are a de facto

Elusive Trope — Sat, 07 Jun 2014 13:31:27 +0000

In reply to "...on the LGBT front (via

While we are a de facto federal system (and it was generally the court system rather than popular votes from the people that legalized it at the state level), Congress and the what happens at the federal level is sometimes a reflection of the nation as whole - not exactly leading the way, and again it took the courts to step into to save the day:

The Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) …is a United States federal law that allows states to refuse to recognize same-sex marriages granted under the laws of other states. Until Section 3 of the Act was ruled unconstitutional in 2013, DOMA, in conjunction with other statutes, had barred same-sex married couples from being recognized as "spouses" for purposes of federal laws, effectively barring them from receiving federal marriage benefits. DOMA's passage did not prevent individual states from recognizing same-sex marriage, but it imposed constraints on the benefits received by all legally married same-sex couples.

Initially introduced in May 1996, DOMA passed both houses of Congress by large, veto-proof majorities and was signed into law by President Bill Clinton in September 1996. By defining "spouse" and its related terms to signify a heterosexual couple in a recognized marriage, Section 3 codified non-recognition of same-sex marriages for all federal purposes, including insurance benefits for government employees, social security survivors' benefits, immigration, bankruptcy, and the filing of joint tax returns, as well as excluding same-sex spouses from the scope of laws protecting families of federal officers (18 U. S. C. §115), laws evaluating financial aid eligibility, and federal ethics laws applicable to opposite-sex spouses.^[1]:23–24

Clinton – along with key legislators – later advocated for DOMA's repeal. The Obama administration announced in 2011 that it had concluded Section 3 was unconstitutional and that although the administration would continue to enforce the law while it existed, it would no longer defend the law in court. In United States v. Windsor (2013), the U.S. Supreme Court declared Section 3 of DOMA unconstitutional under the Due Process Clause of the Fifth Amendment.

"...on the LGBT front (via

PeraclesPlease — Sat, 07 Jun 2014 13:00:31 +0000

In reply to The idea I'm pushing back on

"...on the LGBT front (via Wiki), ten European countries legally recognize same-sex marriage... Can't say that about the US of A." Misleading - the US has a federal system.

Massachusetts, with a population bigger than Denmark, would have been the 3rd "country" to legalize in 2003 (though beaten by 3 Canadian provinces). California with a population of 38 million joined in 2008, though was delayed 5 years due to legal challenges

As of today, 20 US states + DC with gay marriage comprise 143 million people, or 45% of the US.

7 other states have rulings approving gay marriage but are awaiting final legal resolution. 2 states, Nevada and Colorado, allow gay unions significantly similar to marriage.

The UK law of which you speak doesn't apply in Northern Ireland or Scotland, though a Scottish law will take effect later this year.

Don't worry about highjacking

Elusive Trope — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 22:08:41 +0000

In reply to OT. I don't want to highjack

Don't worry about highjacking the thread.

It's Niwdog's Law - any

PeraclesPlease — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 21:10:29 +0000

In reply to I would not recognize Jon Bon

It's Niwdog's Law - any internet discussion that devolves into discussing Bon Jovi has ceased to be relevant to anything.

The sad fact is, like the

Orion — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 20:13:36 +0000

In reply to It is possible to say that

The sad fact is, like the individual, usually it takes great suffering (hitting the proverbial rock bottom) for societies to look at themselves and make improvements. Hitler, WWII and what the concentration camps represented was one such moment.

I think this is very true. Europeans are reluctant as hell to get involved in any military conflicts and looking at World War II is a good reason why. It took that extreme to make them pacifist - they had been doing the constant war thing for centuries and the horrors were worse than anything ever seen in this country.

It's taking this extreme for us to really reconsider the Second Amendment, which has stood for two centuries. Even if it still stands, it has taken more hits than I think it ever has in recent years.

It is possible to say that

Elusive Trope — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 20:01:48 +0000

In reply to The most disturbing

It is possible to say that overall, our world has become more sane when compared with the past, in fact I would say that it is more likely it is. The sad fact is, like the individual, usually it takes great suffering (hitting the proverbial rock bottom) for societies to look at themselves and make improvements. Hitler, WWII and what the concentration camps represented was one such moment. And it is true that today we get to see what is happening in places where old traditional values, like "honor killings," have been happening for long, long time.

But if it is the case that we are overall becoming more sane than say 50 years ago, then that is something which should provide some sense of hope that with continued work, while the suffering continues, there can be a moving of the needle.

The most disturbing

Orion — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 19:51:20 +0000

In reply to When Society is Insane

The most disturbing possibility is that the world is as sane or even saner than it was before but the level of information we have makes us see things in high definition when we only had the grainy VHS version of reality before.

Well I'm just a modern guy.

PeraclesPlease — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 19:51:11 +0000

In reply to Maybe you should look at why

Well I'm just a modern guy. And I've been known to have it in the ear before. With a lust for life. Eat or be eaten.