dagblog - Comments for "What Would An Authoritarian United States Actually Look Like?"

If it happens here, it won't

moat — Mon, 30 May 2016 01:15:06 +0000

In reply to Germany was and is one of the

If it happens here, it won't happen in a place consumed by a crisis of self identity but a place filled with groups who have been fighting for their rights for generations.

The militia you linked to are not the instruments of our state power. Germany had Brownshirts who were purged by the Nazis. Mussolini had Syndacists who were purged by the Fascists. Try this move in our military and I bet you will get nothing but civil war. You didn't mention what happened in Russia but that sort of thing.

Anyway, by bringing up factors that argue against your thesis, I wasn't hoping to put your argument to an end. On the other hand, it is not like your response addressed any of the objections I raised.

Germany was and is one of the

Orion — Sun, 29 May 2016 23:36:51 +0000

In reply to One piece missing from your

Germany was and is one of the most intellectually accomplished countries on earth. Many Jews lived there because, before the Shoa, it was better an environment for Jews than many other places in Europe. Likewise, Mussolini got executed in the streets - there were plenty of people who hated him but that didn't stop him from ruling over Italy.

I think alot of people thought they never would see a candidacy like Trump's at all but there it is, in the midst of a river of racially motivated shootings. I would consider it possible.

You have people like this in this country. Just imagine them when the president of the United States says "go ahead." It seems they already have the instruments for it and can't wait to use them.

It can happen here.

My purely personal ¨gut

Michael Maiello — Sun, 29 May 2016 20:26:15 +0000

In reply to Thanks.

My purely personal ¨gut feeling¨ is that won´t happen if for no other reason than because there are a sufficient number of us with an ingrown anti authoritarian streak to permit a slide into authoritarian darkness.

I think this is correct. It won't happen. We're not that fr gone. I also think, even if Trump wins the election, that he will find himself a weak president, unable to do most of what he claims he will. It's kind of funny that on the left we have been so hard on Sanders for this when a President Trump faces much higher legal and institutional barriers than a President Sanders would.

One piece missing from your

moat — Sun, 29 May 2016 20:01:17 +0000

In reply to What Would An Authoritarian United States Actually Look Like?

One piece missing from your picture of government authorized race war is an appreciation for the instrument that would carry it out. What all authoritarian regimes have in common is a deep involvement with the military to the point where one command structure is superseded by another. In that regard, consider the following:

The U.S. military was racially integrated well in advance of the rest of the country. They still make the rest of us look bad.
The doctrine of illegal orders is not confined to decisions made by top commanders but applies to every rank that can tell somebody else to do something.
If you think the National Guard forgot the heap of manure that was piled onto them when they have responded badly to civic unrest in the past, you would be wrong.

Thanks.

Flavius — Sun, 29 May 2016 02:18:30 +0000

In reply to What Would An Authoritarian United States Actually Look Like?

Thanks.

I'ḿ disappointed that your thoughtful post has not been greeted by more attempts at refutation.

It would worry me if I concluded that was evidence of wide spread agreement with your forecast. You could possibly be right of course and your warning is appropriate and useful. But I don' t want to believe that we ´ll go ¨gently into that good night¨.

My purely personal ¨gut feeling¨ is that won´t happen if for no other reason than because there are a sufficient number of us with an ingrown anti authoritarian streak to permit a slide into authoritarian darkness.

It ´s a cliche that if a husband and wife are arguing and a third party tries to intervene the married pair will jointly turn against the would be intervenor. It´s more than a cliche, that sequence of events occurred in exactly that fashion to a friend of mine. I think (perhaps because I want to ) that an authoritarian president Trump would quickly be opposed by the united forces of Cornell West and David Brooks and millions of others of their disparate followers.

:)

Orion — Sat, 28 May 2016 11:16:37 +0000

In reply to Nice to see to back, Orion.

:) Dagblog was a place I got to write when I was working serious life stuff out. I'm here as long as you want me - but there may be breaks every once in a while.

And as for Trump, they won't. This country wants a dictator and will fall in line. I think some of my rough experiences a couple years ago were a way of cluing me in to the reality of what may happen. I'm gonna survive it.

Nice to see to back, Orion.

Michael Maiello — Sat, 28 May 2016 04:12:34 +0000

In reply to What Would An Authoritarian United States Actually Look Like?

Nice to see to back, Orion. Great post. I only hope that, if Trump is elected, that our checks and balances system (which still seems to work) prevents him from doing his worst.