dagblog - Comments for "Pushed Out Of The Tent?"

The Revolution was televised.

rmrd0000 — Wed, 01 Feb 2017 05:16:46 +0000

In reply to When I use the term "class

The Revolution was televised. Black Lives Matter events are multiracial. The Fight for Fifteen was multiracial. The Women's March was multiracial. The airport detainee protests seem diverse. Progressives are getting better at addressing issues as a group.

I think your focus on the working class is on those white working class voters who supported Trump. They seem happy with what Trump is doing.

Trump supporters happy with his first moves

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/27/us/trump-backers-like-his-first-draft...

Trump supporters are happy with immigration ban.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/30/us/migrants-ban-trump-supporters.html

Working class voters who support Trump are not going to be easily swayed to support Democrats. They rejoice when Trump bashes immigrants and the media. They don't care about a white supremacist in the security apparatus. They are willing to accept Putin as a friend. They get their enjoyment out of seeing people who don't look like them suffer. They agree with Trump that others are their enemies. We already have the majority of available voters.

Edit to add:

Here is more comments from coal country. They love the immigration ban.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-supporters-refugee-ban-west-vi...

So, nothing I said is a

moat — Wed, 01 Feb 2017 01:11:00 +0000

In reply to When I use the term "class

I am not confused about your intentions or what you have said before.

I am a child of the middle of the twentieth century. The topics you have raised have come up before. Wars have been fought over these ideas. It is hard to talk about any of this without thinking about the suffering of untold numbers of people who suffered their parts of the argument.

I did not bring up the distinctions I made to undermine your point of view but to show how I see them connected to other points of view.

When I use the term "class

HSG — Wed, 01 Feb 2017 00:32:26 +0000

In reply to I agree that we need to move

When I use the term "class war," I am referring to a political realignment whereby nearly all Americans who are not affluent recognize that their (and their children's) best interests lie in working together to, among many other things, raise taxes on the rich, tighten very securely the safety net, and bring jobs back to America. As I urged in a blog here, I also am calling for a recognition that economic, racial, gender, and environmental justice are indivisible. Without all, we will have none. More generally, I mean that all but the very affluent recognize that, with very few exceptions, their economic interests are diametrically opposed to those of the very affluent.

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class struggle

noun

Also called class conflict. conflict between different classes in a community resulting from different social or economic positions and reflecting opposed interests.

Also called class war, class warfare. (in Marxist thought) the struggle for political and economic power carried on between capitalists and workers.

I agree that we need to move

moat — Wed, 01 Feb 2017 00:10:10 +0000

In reply to The working-class in America

I agree that we need to move to being a society where all the power is not concentrated in the hands of the most wealthy. I understand the arguments that declare that only a class war can achieve that goal. My remark was not given as an argument against the idea, only as an observation that class war has a logic of its own.

I am unconvinced that you can invoke its methods and then suddenly opt out when things go places not intended. The "class war" logic certainly doesn't have much room for bargaining for the "Americans" you speak of. It goes something like this:

Groupings like nations where people are citizens are just artifacts of power where the people are kept numb by the illusion of participation through systems designed to exploit the aforesaid fools.

On topic, analysis of data,

artappraiser — Tue, 31 Jan 2017 10:23:00 +0000

In reply to Pushed Out Of The Tent?

On topic, analysis of data, by the same blogger who just did a gotcha on Sessions (found video of A.G.

Sally Yates' confirmation hearing, where Sessions asks her if she'd say no the the President)

2016 Election: White Working Class and Trump Support

The working-class in America

HSG — Tue, 31 Jan 2017 02:48:00 +0000

In reply to There is a contradiction

The working-class in America is being strangled right now but the only oxygen they are surrendering that is going to the poor in Asia and Latin America is the amount necessary to keep the latter grinding away for 12-15 hours daily. Nearly all the wealth that is being siphoned from American workers is going to a few million wealthy families. If you think, as I do, that Americans need to to give up a little (or a lot) because we have so much and others have so little then you need to demand that the Americans with the most surrender some of their privileges. It is both wrong and political suicide to insist that those who have scratched and clawed to achieve a middle-class lifestyle need to suffer so that subsistence agricultural workers can have the opportunity to slave away in sweatshops.

There is a contradiction

moat — Mon, 30 Jan 2017 00:20:01 +0000

In reply to Donal's post is very

There is a contradiction between the idea of class war that you encourage and the idea of closing the American market from global deals. You would have your cake and eat it too: Unify the proletariat in one country and leave the others to rot.

You are using an ala cartre menu in a restaurant that only serves full meals. Or as they say in Brooklyn:
No Slices.

While you wait for Trump to

rmrd0000 — Sat, 28 Jan 2017 15:42:06 +0000

In reply to Give Trump enough rope and he

While you wait for Trump to hang himself, how many people served by HUD are you willing to see hurt?

Edit to add:

We are in a place where we cannot trust Trump's cabinet nominees to tell the truth. Trump's OMB nominee did not give a direct "no" reply when the question of lying was posed at his hearing.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/watch-live-mick-mulvaney-second-confirma...

Democrats need to oppose everybody.

Trump supporters are very

rmrd0000 — Sat, 28 Jan 2017 15:14:02 +0000

In reply to Pushed Out Of The Tent?

Trump supporters are very happy with his performance so far.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/27/us/trump-backers-like-his-first-draft...

Give Trump enough rope and he

Flavius — Sat, 28 Jan 2017 14:52:21 +0000

In reply to I'm with you. After the GOP

Give Trump enough rope and he'll hang himself.

Franken and Warren are properly distinguishing between appointments /policies which are evil and those that are merely dumb..Carson's appointment falls into the second category.

The defunding of Planned Parenthood is an example of the first.