dagblog - Comments for "Jobs, Jobs, Jobs (per AA anonymous)"

Perhaps art, but there's

ocean-kat — Tue, 06 Jun 2017 20:21:18 +0000

Perhaps art, but there's another possibility. There's an old saying, Hypocrisy is the homage vice pays to virtue. When ever someone says, I'm not racist but, I'm pretty sure that what follows will be racist. So clearly racist that even the person saying knows that the listeners will perceive it so.

It's not about jobs:

artappraiser — Tue, 06 Jun 2017 19:17:36 +0000

In reply to Jobs, Jobs, Jobs (per AA anonymous)

It's not about jobs:

The real reason working-class whites continue to support Trump

Op-ed (with additional podcast) by Jonathan Capehart @ WashingtonPost.com, June 6

[....] Unlike anyone I’ve read or talked to since the November election, Justin Gest has helped me to really understand why President Trump won white working-class voters and hasn’t thus far lost their support. In the latest episode of “Cape Up,” we discuss the George Mason University professor’s new book, “The New Minority: White Working Class Politics in an Age of Immigration and Inequality”

“So much of Donald Trump’s politics is symbolic,” Gest explained. “They’re symbolic in the sense that this is what people want to hear and if it doesn’t get done, it’s almost beside the point because he’s elevating the prerogatives of his constituents to the national stage after having been relegated to the fringes of American politics for decades.”

“When Donald Trump went up in Cleveland and said messianically,’I am your voice,’ that’s precisely what people heard,” Gest continued. “The sense of having a voice suddenly, after feeling voiceless for so long is powerful. It’s not in their cultural interests to vote against him, no matter how little he has delivered to actually help them in any kind of material way.”
Working-class whites feel not only voiceless, but also silenced, especially in matters involving race. “The way they understood racism is different from the way we understand racism,” said Gest. “For them, racism has become an instrument of silence. It is a way of invalidating people. By saying someone is a racist, it means they cease to matter. Don’t listen to them.” Gest spent three months in Youngstown, Ohio, and three months in East London, England, conducting interviews and researching his book. “So, when people said to me, ‘Now, I’m not a racist but …,’ what they were actually saying to me was, ‘Listen to what I’m about to tell you, and don’t dismiss me.’ ” [....]

DOH! scuse my ignorance, so

artappraiser — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 03:35:15 +0000

In reply to For Zuck you must build

DOH! scuse my ignorance, so many competing totalitarian billionaires, in so little time! I'm back from the days when only Gates Microsoft was evil!

For Zuck you must build

NCD — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 03:02:33 +0000

In reply to just read Zuckerberg's speech

For Zuck you must build community on Facebook, its all the world you need.

just read Zuckerberg's speech

artappraiser — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 22:49:20 +0000

In reply to First, I want to add this big

just read Zuckerberg's speech again, want to pick out this part where he is talking the elite-to-elite stuff. I think this is true, this is the way most educated millenials think, it's how they've been taught to think:

Purpose doesn’t only come from work. The third way we can create a sense of purpose for everyone is by building community. And when our generation says “everyone”, we mean everyone in the world.

Quick show of hands: how many of you are from another country? Now, how many of you are friends with one of these folks? Now we’re talking. We have grown up connected.

In a survey asking millennials around the world what defines our identity, the most popular answer wasn’t nationality, religion or ethnicity, it was “citizen of the world”. That’s a big deal.

So you are going to have conflict between this globalist attitude in the leaders of tomorrow, and not just with the America firsters of Trump, but also with my-local-community firsters, or my-people-in-my-hood firsters, my street gang, my coal mining country folk, whites v. blacks, Latinos v. blacks, black v. Asians. etc.. Yes, Zuckerberg using the term "community" here, it's a ridiculous misuse of the word "community", but there it is. Dare I say, Obama would be all for this, he lived it before he even got to the presidency? "Localists", they are not equipped to be the leaders of tomorrow, nor the winners of any game, unless it's about growing and buying produce.....

everything hunky dory

artappraiser — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 22:29:21 +0000

In reply to To be clear, it's not my site

everything hunky dory, not irritated

To be clear, it's not my site

PeraclesPlease — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 22:06:04 +0000

In reply to First, I want to add this big

To be clear, it's not my site either, and I posted your piece based on Obey's comment not to force you to "debate", but to capture some of your good unique ideas for longer than a newsblip lasts. Hope not irritated. And it seems to be working, "unthought out" or not. I spent yesterday on the train talking for hours over a wide turf, and it wasn't debate - it was trading observations, not trying to win something. We're all trying to get a grasp on the next step, and anyone who says they know is probably deluded anyway.

Ok so cross out Fox News and

artappraiser — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 17:22:13 +0000

In reply to Forget Fox News, conservative

Ok so cross out Fox News and insert Breitbart and Macedonian teens. Just make sure you look at what demographic they are serving when you get all het up about a media source. If it's over 60, it's not worth the time of day.

First, I want to add this big

artappraiser — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 17:19:45 +0000

In reply to Jobs, Jobs, Jobs (per AA anonymous)

First, I want to add this big cavaet: I did not post this as a blog, someone at Dag split it out from a comment on a news thread. Which is fine, it's their site and I am just a guest. I just want it to be known that I would NEVER post such a unthought out and unedited comment as a blog post. Because anything I have to say that I feel strongly enough about to defend is going to be written a lot more carefully. Not random thoughts like I was doing here.

So don't expect me to defend this, OK? If there are comments that are challenging things I said to get me to debate where I don't think it's going to be fruitful, I'm just going to ignore them. In particular, I don't do blog posts because I don't have time to write thought-out ones and I don't enjoy debate. I was just brainstorming here. On to more brainstorming for those who like it, ideologues and those with axes to grind, shouldn't bother:

Don't laugh. I suggest everyone read Zuckerberg's recent commencement speech. He gets it, he knows where his generation is at, and all economic classes of them, not just the Harvard elite:

http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/05/mark-zuckerbergs-speech-as-written-for-harvards-class-of-2017/

The little cohort that Trump targeted in certain precincts, of working class white male Fox-news watching rust belt are goners, ok? Political parties should LET GO OF THEM. It's over now. I mean really goners, they are not long for this world, stop wasting your time on them, they are of my generation. (Of particular interest to me: with all the stuff they bought and the McMansions they built, which their kids don't want to have anything to do with.)

The incoming generation already accepts that that those jobs are gone, never to come back, and also accept that their old cranky uncle that used to work the line at an auto factory is going to die soon. Yes, even the ones without a college education. They are not expecting to work in factories. Some are not even expecting to own cars.

Like it or not, they are going to create their own narratives, they are going to pick and chose what media and news they listen to and what narratives they subscribe to. So yes, you will have tribalism, but not by the old paradigms nor by racial factors, by beliefs coming from charismatic writers and speakers and leaders.

They want what they call "opportunity," not "a job."

Even if you think that's because they've been spoiled by doting helicopter boomer parents to expect too much from life, that's the reality. if you want to make a political party that wins in the future, that's where you've got to go: "opportunity".

What struck me the most is when I read this New Yorker article about the opioid crisis in West Viriginia:: lack of opportunity and hope, lack of purpose, lack of meaning, sense of emptiness, that's the same thing causing the opoid crisis. If they get out in time to college or job training or just a more vibrant geographical area, they don't succumb to what's happening to their parents and neighbors.

Wonkishness is not going to cut it. They didn't come out in enough numbers to re-elect Obama because his wonk side was revealed in the first term, the inspirational bi-partisan post-racial phantom they saw went "poof".

Manufacturing, not to mention retailing, except for luxury goods, is disappearing faster than the parties are talking about it. The robots are coming. Not far in the future, tomorrow. Health care jobs in caring for the aging boomers is coming fast, going to be crisis level.. Driverless cars are coming. People who think all the world's information is online are what pols will be dealing with. In years, not decades. This is a time of radical change and.Trump shock just accelerated it. Look at the revolt against Trump's decision on the Paris accords: for where political parties should go for voters: a coalition that includes Michael Bloomberg and Jerry Brown, Apple and Elan Musk, 30 governors, the mayor of Pittsburgh cited in Trump's speech, not to mention Pope Francis and millenials of all persuasions. Literally formed overnight. While the DNC argues about some rust belt troglodyte votes in 3 states and the GOP tries to figure out how to payback a few voters who still want to "appeal Obamacare" without alienating the majority who now want something better than Obamacare.

My main point: both parties, if they keep going where they are going, are going to lose next time. Sanders does have a small clue. But he's too old and too focused on old memes, too. The thing he most has a clue about is not what voters to target but how neither political party gets it.

Forget Fox News, conservative

NCD — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 15:12:57 +0000

In reply to Jobs, Jobs, Jobs (per AA anonymous)

Forget Fox News, conservative talk, it's dying. I repeat: it's dying, with the boomers as they die if not sooner. (For chrissake, broadcast TV and radio are dying!)

Manipulation and exploitation of a low information low education population will never 'die'. The guy who went gun blazing into Comet Ping Pong Pizza was not a boomer. The Macedonian teens making tens of thousands of Euros with sites dedicated to right wing fake news were not Fox News.

The GOP wants to fragment or degrade the public education system with vouchers to further advance ethnic/religious separation/divisiveness. While pushing intolerance, and replacing critical thinking with ideological conformity.

We have a militant incompetent autocrat in the White House, and total GOP control of national government. Now is not the time for complacency.