dagblog - Comments for "When You're Famous, They Let You Get Away with It"

Lawsuit May Allow Female

artappraiser — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 04:31:31 +0000

In reply to When You're Famous, They Let You Get Away with It

Lawsuit May Allow Female Accusers to Challenge Trump

@ NYTimes.com, 55 minutes ago

During his campaign, Mr. Trump said the women who accused him of sexual misconduct were liars. A defamation suit could give them a chance to confront him again.

Some of it is cultural too.

CVille Dem — Tue, 31 Oct 2017 17:19:21 +0000

In reply to I know. And complicating that

Some of it is cultural too. Some Italian would-be Romeo told me that only when a woman looks sternly and says, “I MEAN IT!” ...is she really serious. He and many men think that it is always a game, and only the cleverest men win.

When I worked in College Health I talked to many young women who wanted to be cajoled into sex so they wouldn’t seem “easy.” No matter what I said about having sex needs to be a conscious and mutual decision seemed to make a difference with that subset of young women. I’m hoping that they all managed to grow up and stop playing those games.

Not sure - a good Ice Queen

PeraclesPlease — Tue, 31 Oct 2017 13:22:09 +0000

In reply to I know. And complicating that

Not sure - a good Ice Queen wielding barbed putdowns is also something to cherish - thing is, even that's desirable, so you get the opposite effect. These lads just can't be put off - they're oblivious to reason.

I know. And complicating that

Orlando — Tue, 31 Oct 2017 12:02:08 +0000

In reply to Hey Orlando, saw Lacoste won

I know. And complicating that is that we women are taught that we shouldn't be rude and we shouldn't hurt feelings and so we are probably naturally reticent to reject approaches which is then probably sometimes misinterpreted as "She doesn't really mean no."

It sucks that it's so freaking complicated.

Hey Orlando, saw Lacoste won

PeraclesPlease — Tue, 31 Oct 2017 06:43:41 +0000

In reply to You're absolutely right that

Hey Orlando, saw Lacoste won best prize for this ad, thought of your "why can't I just say no?" Because half of our society's messaging is "don't take no for an answer", with a rather weak "no means no (or maybe)" as a response.

https://youtu.be/IZC02EQqcXc

A bit too clinical for me. I

PeraclesPlease — Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:58:22 +0000

In reply to I am sure your story will be

A bit too clinical for me. I don't even like ordering food by phone - I just like going out, feel the noize. What some call "sluttish", others might refer to as a smörgåsbord. I guess I liked it better in the days when sleeping with the wrong person wasn't considered the end of the world, just as a bad dinner wouldn't scar you for life. OK, there's more to it than that, but this penis-exposing/sexting bit seems so American - if we just had more nude beaches from an early age, wouldn't this stupid shyness and repression disappear a lot quicker? "Sex" in American society is largely exemplified by seeing some actress' tits for 20 seconds in whatever film, while the society around in real life keeps things buttoned up pretty well. Not too surprising a lot of people think of sex & relationships as a peep show or an abduction.

No regrets, Stilli - we all

PeraclesPlease — Mon, 30 Oct 2017 09:00:24 +0000

In reply to In high school, the boys

No regrets, Stilli - we all did what we needed to to survive & scratch our various itches and survive - sexual, companionship/not being alone, intellectual, etc. Times they are a changin',but then again not so much. Your grandgals will cherish your advice, I'm sure, but still, they'll be down in the trenches while you can sit back bemused and horrified. Hopefully this latest scandal will grow wings & offer up some changes, but then again, we thought PussyGate's backlash would last longer than 2 weeks.

I am sure your story will be

artappraiser — Sun, 29 Oct 2017 23:42:14 +0000

In reply to In high school, the boys

I am sure your story will be helpful to many, stillidealistic. And I think your grandkids are very lucky to have the wisdom of your experience.

But I would like to add that I was grateful for a different kind of feminism where birth control meant freedom and I was allowed just as much "inappropriate behavior" as men were. I have zero regrets in that regard, rather, many fond memories. And I am grateful that I grew up, for the most part, in a time and a culture where it did not mark me as someone due less respect.

To take it to another level, I still mourn the loss of the free-lovin' lifestyle by many gay friends. It still saddens me that they now buy into the whole married with 2.5 kids and white picket fence thing that was the stuff of Betty Friedan's suicidal nightmares. Funny (not?) that they seem to have had to do that concurrent with gaining equal treatment in the workplace.

Also I have zero envy of the "Tinder" lifestyle where nearly passionless sex occurs by picking a partner via snapshot and then doing a "booty call". Great passion from actual human interaction of three-dimensional bodies, with smells, sounds,touches, mental game playing, etc., makes for the best sex, even if it ends up as illusions and a one-night stand. The impersonal robotic nature of the Tinder thing seems much much uglier to me than what is sometimes called "slutish" behavior on the one side or harassing behavior on the other.

In New York City these days, you virtually never see young people try to pick up each other on the street or at social events. They go around with their tribe to protect them, attend events with their tribe, and leave with their tribe. I think it terribly sad. It is less so in other towns, but I see it elsewhere, too.

Hi Mike! I was just thinking

Orlando — Sun, 29 Oct 2017 23:39:58 +0000

In reply to Orlando! It's wonderful to

Hi Mike! I was just thinking that it's akin to the financial crisis and how lobbyists are trying to get rid of consumer protections so they can behave badly again. We're more interested in the carnival aspect to these scandals than the problems at the root of them. *sigh*

You're absolutely right that

Orlando — Sun, 29 Oct 2017 23:38:11 +0000

In reply to [prelude to say this isn't a

You're absolutely right that dating, courtship, mating, or whatever you want to call it is messy. In thinking over your comments and what I meant by "unwanted advances," I've been thinking about my own experiences where I've politely declined attention only to be cajoled, browbeaten, and sometimes even begged to reconsider, sometimes to the point at which I become very rude and am them called a bitch. It's always bothered me immensely when it's happened but it took me many years to land on the reason why a stranger can have such an impact on me. It's because the men who "won't take no for an answer" have decided (or been taught or internalized from societal messages) that their desires and needs are more important than my desires and needs. Or, that I don't really know what I want and they just need to wear me down. In turns, it's enraging and exhausting. On the low end of the spectrum where all these issues are concerned, but still on the spectrum.

I do get that men are expected to make the first move and that it's a difficult thing to do, which is why when I'm not interested I try to be really polite. Often times, I lie about the reason why so I don't hurt somebody's feelings. But why can't I just say "No, thank you" and be done with it?