dagblog - Comments for "This is how Democrats win"

Wrap up:

HSG — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 13:15:49 +0000

Wrap up:

1) Spirited yes, but I thought there was a lot of worthwhile back and forth here.

2) In rereading one of my comments above, I was aghast at my claim that President Obama did not run as an economic populist. He absolutely did - especially in 2008. He criticized the trade deals. His health care proposal did not include the individual mandate. He spoke about stagnant middle class wages and the need for a living wage. He ran a very smart focused campaign that included recognizing the economic harm to non-elites caused by neoliberalism and he won.

3) I concede that some of Bernie's youthful scribblings probably would have caused him agita on the campaign trail if he had been the Democratic nominee. I do not believe they would have cost him the election.

4) I agree with those here who decry the seemingly endless regurgitation of Bernie v Hillary. Since I am as responsible for this dynamic as anybody, I promise to do my utmost not to rehash the history. I do not promise, of course, to ignore post-election news about these figures.

Yes Trump is really bad. I

HSG — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 11:27:16 +0000

In reply to Trump is in the white house

Yes Trump is really bad. I have proposed the way that I believe that Democrats can beat him and in fact have shown in this post how one Democratic winner in a deep red district followed a script similar to the one that I have argued Dems should follow.

So let's discuss your

Flavius — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 05:07:28 +0000

In reply to This is how Democrats win

So let's discuss your prescription for winning.

1) "Support public education" over charter schools.

2) "Defend the rights of working people" and oppose right to work which he calls a "bad idea pushed by corporations to lower wages."

He also lists opposition to "cuts to health care and senior services" and attracting "more jobs to Missouri" as priorities. In order to win, Democrats must adopt strong support for economic justice, i.e., pro-union, anti-trade, pro-Medicare-for-all, as a litmus test.

In the order of appearance

o support public education. What we used to call a "Motherhood and God" policy. Let's move on.

o over charter schools.Always? How to deal with cases where blacks are underserved because of the racism of the (liberal ) educational system hierarchy?

o "Defend the rights etc." Mh & G o oppose right to work. Why? Don't the RTW laws sometimes equip Joe Lunchpail with tools with which to resist corrupt unions? They exist. At one point I was involved in organizing a group of labor leaders in a very anti union town. One of the most effective and inspiring of whom was the President of the local Teamsters. "Inspiring" because he took the position when vacant when his predecessor occupant was dredged up from the bottom of the Ohio. . With his feet in concrete.

In fact , personally I agree but do all the Dagbpoggers. . A far useful topic than the tired old Hillary and the emails.

o opposition to cuts to health care and senior services Mh&G

o strong support for eonomic etc Mh&G

o anti trade.Yes , important. But too important to be reduced to a slogan.Should we become another UK clinging to dying industries while the professions with a future are growing elsewhere?

Take this negative tirade cum granum saltum. We should be discussing these issues On maybe rejecting my suggestion Serve me right!.

You're on the right track but we all have to guard against the temptation to slip into a comfy chair and enjoy one more rerun of the 2016 Follies.

Cheers

You could be right.

ocean-kat — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:46:25 +0000

In reply to I feel more strongly than you

You could be right. Landslides do happen and Sanders could have gone down in flames. Look at what happened to McGovern.

I have answered this question

rmrd0000 — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:37:51 +0000

In reply to What is the purpose of your

I have answered this question in the past. In a world where it is the Democrats vs. Republicans, I choose Democrats. I don’t expect to win every election. Sometimes you lose, just like Bernie Sanders lost.

I feel more strongly than you

artappraiser — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:32:32 +0000

In reply to I don't think any of this

I feel more strongly than you do about the effect of the socialist thing. When he really started talking and when challenged by a GOP candidate, he could scare a lot of exactly the type of swing voters Hal is figuring he could get.in order to win. I.E., There's plenty out there that wouldn't like turning the college system upside down right after you turn the health care system upside down and install a much higher tax rate on this that and the other entity that supposedly needs to pay more or is to be considered bad for society. All you'd need is a Romney type skill level to raise all kinds of doubts, you wouldn't need a genius.

You're forgetting what you

artappraiser — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:23:06 +0000

In reply to Barack Obama and Hillary

You're forgetting what you were even arguing about now: how to win elections. Barack Obama surely won two of them. You trying to say he too was a loser? This is exactly the ideology" uber alles" type thing that makes an American reader mistrust. You've moved from arguing "what wins" to: this is the right religion that everyone should be preaching whether it helps them win or not.

I agree with barefooted that you are also again doing the same thing I questioned about from Rivlas' website. From standard centrist Dem type platform, you are picking out things that you think caused the win and leaving behind things that don't fit your narrative.. Certainly not the type of non-partisan analyst I would hire to work on a campaign if I was running, that's for sure!

Okay, Hal, what does

barefooted — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:08:02 +0000

In reply to This is how Democrats win

Okay, Hal, what does "Astounding," "loony," "accurate." mean? I wrote "astounding", AA wrote "loony" ... I guess you're authoring "accurate"? I'm not being rude here, I'm not beating up on you. I'm disagreeing - as many of us are in our own ways. You invite disagreement - so what gives?

I don't think any of this

ocean-kat — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:05:31 +0000

In reply to I do too and I think it would

I don't think any of this would cause voters to abandon Sanders in droves but it wouldn't need to. It just needs to move the needle a bit with enough people. When Comey announced he was reopening the email investigation eleven days before the election people didn't abandon Hillary in droves but both Ezra Klein and Nate Silver, both who are very good analysts, claim that if he hadn't Hillary would have won.

?

barefooted — Fri, 09 Feb 2018 03:01:34 +0000

In reply to "Astounding," "loony,"

? See below ... running into toilet paper territory.