dagblog - Comments for "What was that about the Richmond P.D. being an evil occupying force of "the black community"?"

Rioting mobs don't just cause

artappraiser — Wed, 24 Feb 2021 20:43:58 +0000

In reply to What was that about the Richmond P.D. being an evil occupying force of "the black community"?

Rioting mobs don't just cause death, and that's why cops is tough on keeping street protests under control, to prevent them from becoming a mob:

MORE: Latest statement from US Capitol Police union updates injuries to officers:

"Officers with crushed spinal discs, broken kneecaps, and traumatic brain injuries. Some of these officers may never return to duty. Many more are experiencing signs of PTSD.”
— Scott MacFarlane (@MacFarlaneNews) February 23, 2021

that's why cops came to scare the group away from the parking lot in the original story here. Those people can practice their free speech in other ways. This is why police form lines and get rough with protesters who break their line. It's also why someone like Mayor Lance-Bottoms says "go home, this is not protest, go home and learn how to protest." It's not just to protect cops but also the protesters themselves, when mobs form, all kinds of people get hurt.

Mobs are the breakdown of norms and civilization itself.

So I've gone from Zuck Jr and

PeraclesPlease — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:19:53 +0000

In reply to (am reminded of my friend the

So I've gone from Zuck Jr and Master arch repressor of the Dag universe to "just another cop"? Pttht. I need coffee.

I keep forgetting to throw

artappraiser — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:13:13 +0000

In reply to Number of people shot to

I keep forgetting to throw this in with the above and I think it's highly related to the irrational factor here. There are a heckuva lot more bad doctors in this country than bad cops and they do kill and maim TONS more people than police do! Plus its's often: slowly and miserably torture them to death, rarely ever making them feel better than before, very often making them feel worse and never to feel well again. And it's too simplistic to call it malpractice, because lots of it is due to iatrogenic practice and the patient goes along with it because you like trust doctors to know what they doing, your mom taught you to. Plenty of them are evil lazy arrogant idiots, though one saving grace is that the younger generation is being taught to finally think more wholistically and listen to the patient's symptoms and not just treat tests

The third-leading cause of death in US most doctors don’t want you to know about

UPDATED WED, FEB 28 2018 Ray Sipherd, special to CNBC.com

A recent Johns Hopkins study claims more than 250,000 people in the U.S. die every year from medical errors. Other reports claim the numbers to be as high as 440,000.

Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.

Advocates are fighting back, pushing for greater legislation for patient safety [....]

Everyone just has more fear of "authoritarian" when it comes to cops, when actually they aren't seeing that there's a lot of similarity to the doctor job. If you wanna see authoritarian, they both should be seen that way. (And libertarians are actually more logical about this, they're often against both groups..)

P.S. Practice of medicine is most definitely an art more than a science, they don't know so little about how individual human bodies work, it's a joke to call it science. Again, policing not that different that way, you have to have a talent for certain things.

(am reminded of my friend the

artappraiser — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:48:36 +0000

In reply to And people are often more

(am reminded of my friend the lefty dyke on the popular bulletin board where I was a moderator in the Bush years. She was a cook who ending owning her own restaurant in Chicago, so she had to learn to tame her usual rough biker like nature for the customers but would still get it out fighting rough with Bush trolls. I was complaining how crummy the volunteer moderator job could get in a private message and how no one appreciated it. She said well, you just have to realize that nobody likes a cop, that's your problem and that's just the way things are.)

And people are often more

artappraiser — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:42:16 +0000

In reply to I mixed things and said where

And people are often more shocked by a single event than horrors that happen more frequently - see Kahnemann.

ain't arguing with you there, and is part and parcel of the whole truthiness issue of cell phones with cameras reporting every second with close ups of individual horrors. Where's the outrage? many such types then ask. well, I think someone who's looking to stoke some mob justice, is exactly the type of person who asks that. (And I don't just mean physical violence here of a mob that thinks libs stole the election from Trump or a mob that thinks cops are out to kill blacks, I also mean boycotts and foreign policy based on emotion, little tiny internet mobs can do a lot of damage, too...)

of righteousness and rage. Judge doesn't allow "outrage" i the courtroom, jury is supposed to sit with cool heads, not hot ones, and think and weigh the evidence.

The mobbing is one of our main problems. Lawr and order, like it or not (even on social media sites?) is the music that soothes the savage beasts...

And people are often more

artappraiser — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:40:58 +0000

In reply to I mixed things and said where

dupe deleted (meta note: I think it's happeing a lot with edits? even if you're careful. I just went back to fix a couple spellings)

Re: bail, i posted the

PeraclesPlease — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:23:00 +0000

In reply to you're mixing a whole lot of

Re: bail, i posted the comparison of "he screamed this!" argument that gets bail due to free speech, vs " he came premeditated to attack the function of government with these weapons/tools" that fails and leaves them detained. Even in the Tennessee decision to release, there was a smarter DA who tried to rephrase to invoke the seriousness, but the judge ruled it was too late - the first DA had already bungled it

And *then* there are the perps they want *outside*, yacking away, giving more evidence, tying in their circle of friends.

So bail isnt necessarily a fail, plus *some* protest really is free speech, and i appreciate the effort to distinguish. Saying "fuck the police" or worse is still allowed.

I mixed things and said where

PeraclesPlease — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:13:00 +0000

In reply to you're mixing a whole lot of

I mixed things and said where i mixed things, but the basic fact is we saw some racist murders - including some by police - but we didn't see left wing vote theft.

And people are often more shocked by a single event than horrors that happen more frequently - see Kahnemann.

you're mixing a whole lot of

artappraiser — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 06:10:31 +0000

In reply to Let's be real - there were

you're mixing a whole lot of stuff in there that has to do with racism problems but doesn't have a whole lot to do with policing, like voting lines. Tons of destruction over the summer in riots, tons. Lots of downtowns, lots of burning. Concurrent with huge rise in violent crime.

Horrific murder of Arbery was about racism, and lack of prosecution of it, dare we say tolerance of it, not policing.

Apples and oranges: higher percentage of black people are poor than whites and also crowded into living in urban ghettoes where high violent crime naturally occurs, especially in a pandemic.

Still more white people are shot by police than blacks.

I'm with Yglesias and Biden and even more so with Keisha Lance Bottoms: more police not less have a better chance of helping the situation even with the media stoking individual horror stories.

People can start businesses, go to work safely, study for college if criminals are not on their streets all the time shooting each other and protesters are not burning their own police cars, police stations and gas stations, attacking CNN and wrecking historic courthouses and preventing people going to court, burning black retired cops alive while they are working as guards.cheering on boogaloo shooters of cops, looting the few decent shops left for people to buy stuff in the hood,

in the end chasing everybody out but the poorest who can't afford to leave and are mostly black.

just because there were huge peaceful mixed crowds protesting, turn a blind eye to what people in those cities saw with their own eyes: the fact the the violence all summer really really did a ton of destruction. Things, and less death yeah sure, not symbolic as the Capitol, but an awful lot of things that people, including many immigrant people, built with blood sweat and tears. Not much happened in the Bronx and Washington Heights that way only because Dominican and Puerto Rican business owners discouraged every evening with baseball bats. Macy's and Manhattan took the brunt of it.

Rule of law across the board against criminal behavior and excuses for it. Including Abery type thug murderers. So we can have civilized democracy,

I'm not thrilled with the new lax bail laws at all. Lots of BLM type activists fought for them and now guess who is getting the benefit? Goose meet gander. How about rather keeping the accused perps off the streets until tried and shaping up the courts and jails and prison systems so they are more rehabilitative and less punitive and less places for homies to get even more tribal and learn mo better crime?

as as the fear and terror factor goes, you don't think it scares a fucking lot of people when protesters start burning police cars in front of CNN, lefty lawyers throw Molotov cocktails into them in NYC, a nightly hipster mob is given run over a section of the expressway, all of down Kenosha wrecked and it was just starting to make a comeback, now it may never.

The actual story is about Kenosha, you know. He deserves major kudos for owning up that he actually was reaching for a knife!

Back to your mixing a whole lot of racial problems into the issue of policing. I think just the opposite, I think policing a better life for poor people, getting danger off their streets, is a smarter way to get somewhere on that front.

Hey, we had it in NYC, for decades, I know. A low crime rate and little tolerance for violence and respect for property helps nearly everyone, lifts all boats. Even if the cops are mostly snotty arrogant white people who don't actually live there. Cause then tourists come from allover the world and do things like take tours of Harlem without a scintilla of fear. And young black kids in segregated nabes learn there are better ways of making money than shouting another dude for his cell phone and get to meet people like tourists from France and China and oh look there's President Bill Clinton stopping to talk before going to his office...POLICING IS WHAT DONE that. And now the 80's are creeping back.

Let's be real - there were

PeraclesPlease — Thu, 28 Jan 2021 05:19:00 +0000

In reply to This is right (). There were

Let's be real - there were some atrocious cases of killing blacks, including 2 trucks (not police) chasing down a jogger, a cop slowly suffocating a black guy with his knee, a no-knock warrant in the middle of the night that resulted in the death of the woman whose flat it was (yes, her boyfriend fired 1 shot), a female cop who wandered into the wrong apartment after work (by mistake?) and killed the owner, a cop spraying a load of bullets into a driver in front of his kids.

It may not happen oh so "often", but it sure as fuck makes for some horrific encitement and feelings of being attacked, whatever the statistics (humans don't respond by statistics). Many whites as well as most blacks were extremely upset. The protests and complaints and demands were largely reasonable - e.g. "do better" (though in the beginning as is usual more got out of hand), but a relatively few BLM protesters and associates kept the vandalism and intimidation going much longer).

Counter this with "steal the vote" where there was *zero* evidence of significant steal after months of promoting this (and Roger Stone had previously promoted Stop the Steal in 2016, when the only real evidence was the other way) - and there were *massive* recounts in several states, whereas in 2016 there was no mechanism for a serious recount in PA, MI, WI, and once again it was completely out of bounds for a Democrat to even think about recounts - it took Jill Stone to do it in 1 state and the courts shut that down quick. But the Republicans equate "thinking about a recount" with actually recounting at least 4 states. In 2016, only about 87% of ballots we're under some kind of audit/validation, whereas by 2020 it was over 95%, yay - but there remain some questions re ES&S machines that have never been answered *20 years*, unlike Dominion.

So please, enough both sides do it. Yes, left-wing protesters out if hand should be arrested. But mobbing a gentrified section of Portland to disrupt dinner and break into stores is not the same as mobbing Congress and trying to overturn a presidential election. Add the visuals of long lines of blacks in pandemic 2020 and other elections waiting to vote, while whites get short lines thanks to deliberate short placement does not help the comparison.