dagblog - Comments for "The Want of the “Why.”"

That's a reply to Genghis and

Bluesplashy — Sun, 15 Feb 2009 02:08:23 +0000

That's a reply to Genghis and that means I agree with what he said. It looks confusing because of the placement and we don't have those little 'in response to ....' tags here.

Yeah, what you said.

Bluesplashy — Sun, 15 Feb 2009 02:06:36 +0000

In reply to Ah...dating. Just in case you

Yeah, what you said.

The old proverb goes, "A Man

Donal — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 19:05:06 +0000

In reply to You think men act like that

The old proverb goes, "A Man chases a Woman until she catches him."

That's a remnant of a tradition that the man must pursue, while the woman must flee, and only reluctantly let herself be caught. The problem for us Men is that there's no easy formula. Some women do like to be pursued while others mean it when they say No. Likewise, some men see rejection, even a current boyfriend, as a challenge, while others are easily rebuffed.

And our popular culture is full of men chasing and winning women, even forcibly:

Goldfinger later on tells Pussy to keep James entertained whilst he deals with removing the late Mr Solo from his gold. They walk into a barn where Bond wants to get to know her more closely. Pussy however is not interested and tells 007 that it would take a lot more than he has got to interest her. Bond and Pussy then try to use their Judo skills to get the better of one another until Bond gets the upper hand and succeeds in seducing her.

You think men act like that

Orlando — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:47:37 +0000

In reply to Ah...dating. Just in case you

You think men act like that when they're rejected because it's more socially acceptable for them to pursue women aggressively? I'll have to take your word for it. But I sort of always thought it was because it's easier for women to believe that they might not be worthy of someone's affection, which is no more and no less ridiculous.

From William Shakespeare's

DF — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:30:14 +0000

In reply to The Want of the “Why.”

Ah...dating. Just in case you

Michael Wolraich — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:21:22 +0000

In reply to I've tried the honest

Ah...dating. Just in case you attached people forgot what it's like and yearn to be single again.

O--I expect that this kind of response is much more common among men, since aggressive pursuit by women is less socially acceptable. Though why the behavior you describe is any more socially acceptable from men is beyond me.

But another more gender-neutral reason to hold back: some people can't handle the truth. They're less confident than JoanOfArc, and criticism, especially sexually-related criticism, is really upsetting to them. Actors have to develop thick skins or get out of the biz, but your average date never signed on to be an actor.

Conversely, saying mean things like "You're not girlfriend hot" makes the rejecters feel shitty too, even if the words are true. I didn't sign on to be a casting director any more than my date signed on to be an actor.

A date between an actor and casting directory, however: no holds barred.

I've been on dates that were

Donal — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:12:11 +0000

In reply to The Want of the “Why.”

I've been on dates that were a lot like auditions, but none of my auditions were like dates. The folks doing the casting can afford to be blunt and even cruel because the star system provides them a seemingly endless supply of talented, eager young hopefuls.

Imagine though, that you start rejecting people without even a modicum of face-saving courtesy: "Sorry, I want someone thinner." Unless you are one hell of a catch, word will spread in your social group, and you might find fewer and fewer people willing to run the gauntlet of your disdain.

I've tried the honest

Orlando — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:47:43 +0000

In reply to The Want of the “Why.”

I've tried the honest approach a couple of times, being polite, but direct. And now I know why people either don't call or make shit up to extricate themselves.

The first time was a few years ago. This guy wanted to go out and he called me up one night so we could talk a bit first. I asked him questions about things that are important to me. For example, when he said he liked to travel (a promising start), I asked the place that he had traveled that was furthest from home. He mentioned Chicago, which is an hour and a half away, and Lake Michigan, which is over the county line. He said he likes to shop, which I absolutely do not, so I made a joke about being allergic to the mall and he proceeded to regale me with hayfever stories, I kid you not.

So, when he asked me to dinner, I politely declined. It was a first for me. Normally, I would either agree, and then suffer through an excruciating date, or make up some excuse for why I couldn't and then just never answer my phone again. But in this case, something came over me, and I was honest. "No, thank you," I believe were my exact words. When he asked why, again, I was honest. "We don't have much in common so I don't think we'd have a good time." (By the way, the conversation was longer than Lake Michigan and the mall. I'm not that shallow.) What proceeded was another hour of him basically begging me to change my mind and me being too nice at first to just tell him to fuck off. I felt like asking him if he thought desperation made him more attractive. In the end, I didn't, but I did have to be pretty mean to get him off the phone, after which I got an email screed about what a bad person I was.

Last summer, I went out with a guy a couple of times and thought he was actually ok. But after the second date, he started calling, emailing, and texting constantly, not to share any important information, but to ask stupid ass questions like, "How's work?" or "How are you feeling today?" I communicated to him that I didn't feel the need to be in contact 78 times a day and asked him to cool it. He agreed, said he totally understood, and continued the behavior. I have a somewhat pathalogical overreaction to feeling smothered, so I told him I didn't want to see him again and it led to--guess what--an hour long conversation where he basically begged me to give him another chance. His last attempt at persuasion was, "Maybe you're just not in the right place right now, but if we wait a couple of months, you'll feel differently" To which I replied honestly, "I could tell you that was true to make you feel better today but then you'd have your hopes up for two months and I wouldn't feel any differently, and I think that would be a really crappy thing for me to do." He got mad.

When there's no attraction for either side, it's easy. He doesn't call and you're glad he didn't. But when there's some sort of desperation or confidence that if she/he would only get to know me better, we'd fall madly in love, honesty is a lost cause. Because the person on the receiving end isn't listening.

So, although I think it's as annoying as you do when you don't get the reason or the closure you want, maybe it's because the dater can never be sure the datee is a rational person or a desperate one until the honesty is on the table. And sometimes the risk just isn't worth it.