dagblog - Comments for "It's time to tax God"

In a world where Karl Rove's

kgb999 — Tue, 26 Oct 2010 05:43:05 +0000

In reply to The continued existence of

In a world where Karl Rove's mega-money machine is collecting millions and millions of tax-free dollars to dump into our political arena every month, I am having a difficult time working up even a sliver of indignation here. I just see this another example of us eating each other instead of focusing on the ones who are really sucking the lifeblood from our nation and our economy.

Check this:

Every 34th wage earner in America in 2008 went all of 2009 without earning a single dollar, new data from the Social Security Administration show.
[...]
The number of Americans making $50 million or more, the top income category in the data, fell from 131 in 2008 to 74 last year. But that’s only part of the story.

The average wage in this top category increased from $91.2 million in 2008 to an astonishing $518.8 million in 2009. That’s nearly $10 million in weekly pay!

Taxing just the earnings of those 74 people who combined pocketed an untaxed $38 billion at the same rate you or I pay on our income would likely do as much for our liquidity as taxing all the churches in America by the time charitable donations and everything else is factored in to their "profits" ... while putting a huge collection strain on the IRS when we really want them addressing those at the top of the economic food chain.

It is equally short-sighted to demand earmarks be eliminated as a way to fix the deficit as well, IMO. Just seems a one-size-fits-all excuse for people to attack things they've always had a problem with to me - while ignoring those who are really being economically abusive. I say focus where we'll get the biggest bang for our buck

Hi there Progressive

Mike — Tue, 26 Oct 2010 04:17:19 +0000

In reply to This is quite the interesting

Hi there Progressive Atheist,

some good points. There are churches that do not have mega projection screens, rock bands, thousands of attendees, latte shops, or in the case of my church, even a electronic sound system (the apses work quite well as they have for thousands of years and it keeps the electricity bill down).

Our pastor is paid somewhat above the poverty rate, so not getting into the top 2% soon.

One final point. In the Orthodox Church, 'The Word of God" is Jesus Christ. The Bible only points to Him. It was in the radical reformation that the combo of the OT and NT became the Word of God since this reformation emphasized book knowledge over direct spiritual experience. But that is a detail for another time.

Now if we could only get this economy going again instead by all of us buying things made by American from companies that pay Americans decent wages and if our politicians would give tax incentives only to companies to build here and hire here and pay good wages and benefits to folks here, then we could solve a lot of issues. What I like to call trickle up economics!!!

Regards,

Mike

William,it's really kind of

Mike — Tue, 26 Oct 2010 04:07:19 +0000

In reply to It's time to tax God

William,

it's really kind of hard to figure out the effectiveness of your interesting proposal.

As an income generation device, it may be less than thought. Sure there are those mega-churches with multi-million dollar budgets. They would ring the cash registers like the taxes on well paid folks that don't cheat (there are some). However, numerically most churches have relatively modest to small budgets and since taxes are a percentage (and our system is a progressive system - so lower incomes result in lower taxes) this wouldn't put them 'out of business' but would also result in minimal tax revenue. So probably not a major factor to 'save' the national budget.

If this a proposal to somehow lower the effect of the Church, this is also very modest compared to historical attempts. Roman Emperors Nero and Hadrian gave it a shot but didn't do too well. Now Diocletian really worked hard to get rid of all clergy and non recanting Christians (turning Christians into torches, put into tin and tar furnaces, beheading, etc.), but that ended without success either.

In the 600's an Arabian ruler took over a city of Christians and first set a fire and put in all the clergy (about 124) and then killed the rest of the inhabitants (old and young) by the sword. Slowed things down there for a while but didn't really work either.

We'll skip the various Muslim attempts to get rid of Christianity and move right on to the more recent pros like Lenin, Stalin, Mao and the Albanians. You know, people who killed 10;s of millions of their own folks, Lenin basically rounded up most of the bishops and clergy and shot them all. Stalin, until WW II, left a few around to show he was all okay with Mother Russia, but basically shut down all churches, seminaries and monasteries and killed a good many more or sent them off to the Gulag to die.

Now in Albania, they killed all the clergy and got rid of all the churches. Very efficient and complete. Why mess around?

All these actions make your proposal, which is already a weak revenue generator, seem a really wimpy church slow down program compared to the really dedicated 'gentlemen' I have listed above.

Today the Church is as strong as ever in Russia, growing in Albania, reestablishing in China, etc.

So in closing, I'm not sure what your proposal intends but it seems rather impotent from several angles. Perhaps some more thought would help.

Regards,

Mike

The continued existence of

CVille Dem — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 23:27:53 +0000

In reply to Wolfrum brings up a very good

The continued existence of churches should not be the "government's problem," (meaning that they should not get a free ride for public services) If a church catches fire, doesn't the fire department come and put the fire out? If it is robbed, don't the police investigate? Don't roads, that are paid for by all of us allow the worshipers to get to church just as those roads allow people to get into a shopping mall? And none of this even addresses the tax write-offs that donations to churches deprive the country of.

The pious freeloaders were just fine until the "others" wanted in. The actual others: UNBELIEVERS are the ones who have really been had.

Wolfrum brings up a very good

kgb999 — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 19:58:13 +0000

In reply to This is quite the interesting

Wolfrum brings up a very good point ... if all religions were Christian.

Let's start with the super-rich. See how that goes. Then move on to putting churches out of business because Wolfrum doesn't see their continued existence as "his problem."

When did a church become a

Beetlejuice — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 19:17:18 +0000

In reply to You assume, as many do, that

When did a church become a business? If your budget isn't enough to run a school, then you shouldn't be in the business. If you must have one, then it's on the parents to pay for it. If they can't then they have no choice but public schools. Very simple business decision. As for social services, your city, county, state and federal government run social programs, so there's no need for you to run one by yourself. Perhaps, you should donate your church services to the local social services. It would save you money and doing God's work for free is what religion is really all about, isn't it?

It all goes back to what I was taught about God as a child...he resides in the Temple in my mind. He doesn't require elobrate settings, houses or adornments. All he wants is a piece of my mind he can call home. He doesn't pay rent and I don't ask him for any.

Happy days are here

Richard Day — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 19:09:39 +0000

In reply to Coincidentally I recently

Happy days are here again?

Damn I am going to google this.

that's because they are

Beetlejuice — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 19:03:24 +0000

In reply to your pic looks like a

that's because they are

Coincidentally I recently

Donal — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 18:46:07 +0000

In reply to It's time to tax God

Coincidentally I recently read that the Crystal Cathedral, the drive-in church designed by Philip Johnson for Robert Schuller, has gone bankrupt.

I couldn't have said it

CVille Dem — Mon, 25 Oct 2010 18:43:50 +0000

In reply to It's time to tax God

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Now, on a scale of 1 - 10, with 1 being a snowball in hell, how likely do you think your sensible and moral suggestion will even be suggested where it counts? Churches have stranglehold on the neck of this country, and they will never give up. Too much money at stake, you know?