dagblog - Comments for "The Price"

I wrote about corporatism

Dan Bandekow — Fri, 05 Nov 2010 20:34:36 +0000

In reply to The Price

I wrote about corporatism recently on my website.

It all started to go down hill when Corporations became protected under the Bill of Rights and the 14th amendment as “Natural Born Citizens” this gives them the right the petition the government and all other rights of an individual citizen.

It was not always like this, i go into much more detail in my article here: http://www.upfordebate.us/story.php?title=corporate-america-the-real-ene...

I take an early look at the history of corporations in America and give a few different examples from the modern era. I thought you might want to take a look at this. Thanks for the good read.

I think the last time a

Ramona — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:34:10 +0000

In reply to Yes, the concept of shared

I think the last time a president even hinted at the concept of self-sacrifice was when Jimmy Carter asked us to go easy on the gas consumption, and look where that got him. Bush told people to go shopping after 9/11 and, aside from a few jokes made about it, nobody was outraged by the suggestion.

Even now, after the country has nearly been destroyed by corporate shenanigans and the most blatant greed since the 1920s, their assets are being protected by ordinary citizens who think the very idea of asking them to pay their fair share in taxes is some sort of evil plot.

I think Peggy knows that the rich elite have given up on this country because there's barely a country left to waste time marauding anymore. They're finding their riches overseas and are probably a little astonished that they can get away with it and still call their corporations American. They can take advantage of whatever's left here without having to give anything back.

Buffett and the Gateses are good examples of responsible behavior, but even their strong voices aren't powerful enough. The RWNJs and the Tea Party shout loudest and longest and that's the way it's going to be now that they see how easy it was to sway the country to vote their way.

Yes, the concept of shared

AmericanDreamer — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 03:20:15 +0000

In reply to Really, really well

Yes, the concept of shared sacrifice, in fact sacrifice of any sort as a subject of public discussion, seems to have disappeared. When was the last time a President asked that? Who else can ask that? We used to be asked to share sacrifice during wartime but we don't do that any more. The thing that maybe depresses me more than anything is when Peggy Noonan wrote maybe 3 years ago, late Bush Admin, that the elites, and I'm sure she has occasion to speak with a goodly number of them, appear to have given up on the country.

Come again? Our elites have more, in material terms, in privileges, in the power that goes with fearful politicians falling all over themselves to give them whatever they want, than elites anywhere in the world, it would seem. The very top 1 or 2% are just about the only part of the income distribution that has done better in material terms over the past three decades, and they have done *much* better.

So what exactly is it that they want? Do they feel unloved and unappreciated? Boo hoo. How self-absorbed can you get? Privilege as entailing greater responsibility, including the responsibility to accept a greater tax burden than people with far less? Accepting the need for greater regulation of some of the enterprises they run? Standing up publicly to tell those who have been undermining the government for 30 years in pursuit of a self-aggrandizing agenda that they're wrong and way out of line, that we need a strong, well-functioning government to have a strong, well-functioning society? Ha! What outmoded notions!

There are a few I admire for stepping up. Buffett and Gates Sr. come to mind. Not nearly enough.

Really, really well

Ramona — Sun, 31 Oct 2010 01:24:09 +0000

In reply to The Price

Really, really well done,Wolfrum. Enlightening and uplifting--so why do I feel so depressed? Could be because in too many circles this is just crazy talk. Give up something? Stop buying? Shun the corporations? Go back to a simpler life? I thought it would take something really drastic to finally get through to us that sacrifices must be made, that we have met the enemy and the enemy has "corporate" written all over them, that our only hope (besides the measures you outline) is MORE government intervention, not less. I thought what is happening to us today is about as drastic as it could get, and we would see it as an emergency worthy of some real attention. Boy, was I wrong. But, Bill, I thank you for trying once again. I will pass your piece around and try and get it the attention it deserves. Wish I didn't feel so depressed about this. . .

Bravo! Great!!

MrSmith1 — Fri, 29 Oct 2010 03:29:48 +0000

In reply to The Price

Bravo! Great!! Unfortunately, you offer a very tough solution. One, that would take enormous sacrifice from the public. I'm not sure that enough people would have the strength and determination to stick to your plan, even if they totally agree with it in principle. We need to find a way to either short cut the process itself, or sweeten the incentive for people. Perhaps you should mention that doing your plan would allow them all the Ben & Jerrys ice cream they can eat ...

Seriously, ... I think the first thing we need to work on is reversing the corporate personhood precedents, so we can strip corporations of that 'right' once and for all ... And perhaps, if we bide our time, the tea-partiers coming disillusionment with their candidates (Oh yes, it's coming), can be re-directed to the fight against corporate personhood.

Wolf, thanks for the

Oxy Mora — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 20:14:49 +0000

In reply to The Price

Wolf, thanks for the outrage. We're going to need a lot more of it. It's going to be a very long road back.

"Facism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power.

--Benito Mussolini.

It takes a Congress with the

Beetlejuice — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 19:33:01 +0000

In reply to The Price

It takes a Congress with the balls to stand up and confront the Corporate State. We'll have to wait for a 60 seat Democrat majority, minus independents, blue dogs and Liberman for that to happen.

I am glad to see that someone

Progressive Athiest — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 19:12:05 +0000

In reply to The Price

I am glad to see that someone in this world is as outraged at the Citizen's United legislation as I have been. When I heard about this back in July I attempted to bring this to the attention of some of my fellow co-workers, friends, family and so on, and people thought that I was being a conspiracy theorist. If this type of legislation would have been tried in a time before television, 15 second ads, the internet, and pop culture I feel there would be blood flowing in the streets. Remember a time at the turn of the 20th C when our government was actively prosecuting corporations for monopolies via the Sherman Anti-Trust Act? It was widely known then that corporations were only about the bottom line, PROFIT. Controlling the industry in which they operated with an iron fist via monopolies is the SAME THING as controlling politics via campaign spending. Corporations , in order to spend money on candidates in elections, want the American public to think that they are just one of us, that just because they have more money than us to donate to candidates doesn't mean that their voice is any bigger than any individuals. EXCEPT THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT IT MEANS. Let's go over a few FACTS about Corporations:

1. Corporations are NOT AMERICAN. The development of international business and trade negates this notion. I would like to see where the corporate offices are for all corporations that donated to our elections. I would venture to bet taht 75% of them are in the Cayman Islands. Last time I checked these islands are a haven for corporate wealth.

2. Money Talks. If someone doesn't believe me, then look at all of the reality television programs like Fear factor and such. If you cannot connect these two dots, you might as well stop reading now.

3. All business is International. How would the American public feel if a "Japanese" corporation donated money toward an American election. Peaved to say the least. But since all business is international, this is precisely the type of thing that is happening, allbeit the Am. public is a very ignorant one.

4. Corporations are not Nationalized. They have more interests all over the globe than just those that are in America. What's to say one corporation that is donating money towards one cause in America isn't doing the exact opposite in a third world country (kind of like railing against Alcoholism in a MADD meeting and then going out and buying an entire bar drinks.) Corporations do not have just National interests, they also have international ones as well.

And most importantly....

5. CORPORATIONS ARE NOT CONCERNED WITH WHAT IS GOOD FOR YOU, ONLY ABOUT WHAT IS GOOD FOR THEIR BOTTOM LINE PROFIT. And donating with no limit to political elections is exactly that...best for their bottom line.

If we need evidence for this, look at how much more they have spent this year on campaigns in a MID TERM election. $3 billion dollars!!!!!!!!!!! For those of you who like visual displays, thats a 3 with 9 Zeros behind it. 3,000,000,000 dollars spent to buy political officials to get them to keep things the way it is. If Corprations are willing to spend that much money on keeping the status quo, then one only needs ask themselves...How much do you think they stood to lose if they are wiling to spend that much to keep the status quo chugging down the tracks to a Plutonomy?

Any living, breathing organism will do what it must to survive...Are Corporations Alive?...kinda scary to think about it.

Provocative, well written and

AmericanDreamer — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 18:05:13 +0000

In reply to The Price

Provocative, well written and terrific post, William. Modeled, I have learned, on Machiavelli's The Prince, which I might have known if I'd gotten myself to read it by now. :<)

The strategy your piece recommends has the enormous advantage of leaving the reader knowing of specific things s/he can do that will have an immediate impact, however small in each individual case. That is empowering, always important for a successful strategy, and the more so because so many now feel as though they can have no impact whatsoever through "normal politics". I've got Thom Hartmann's Unequal Protection: How Corporations Became "People"--and How You Can Fight Back, revised, post-Citizens United edition, nearing my on deck circle of reading material (perhaps I should read The Prince first)--in particular I want to know what strategies and actions he is recommending for correcting the overwhelming tilt to the playing field we have at this point. He's been all over this issue since long before CU.

Thank you, Richard. And great

William K. Wolfrum — Thu, 28 Oct 2010 17:33:38 +0000

In reply to This is the best blog I have

Thank you, Richard. And great points.