dagblog - Comments for "They Say We'll Have a Revolution......"

One thing I think that the

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 22:53:14 +0000

In reply to They Say We'll Have a Revolution......

One thing I think that the person wrote the WSJ article I cited in my post does not entirely get is the the next financial melt down will not spare as many as the last did. Something that I was reminded of, a while back in chat I think, was that most or a good number of these 1% wealthy people are wealthy mostly on paper (or rather in computers somewhere). That to try and and get to this virtual money by selling their stocks and bonds and what not, would cause a panic and precipitate the melt down. Kind of an economic Catch 22.

Those that do escape by having most of their money off shore may well face the kind of pursuit that the rich Russians did under Putin.

I don't think it's toast

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 20:50:37 +0000

In reply to And while it was economic

I don't think it's toast necessarily. But American Democracy release 1.x needs and update badly. But I would not do an installation until at least 2.3 or 2.4 is released myself though. New releases tend to be a bit buggy.

And while it was economic

Elusive Trope — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 19:12:53 +0000

In reply to The serfs throughout history

And while it was economic conditions that fueled the French Revolution, its focus was on the political institutions. The problem "revolutionaries" face in America is that most people have no problem with the political institutions per se, but rather the people in them who are corrupting the institutions. Elections thus provide the pressure valve where the people can throw the "bums" out. These days a lot of people just see all that is being offered as replacements is more bums. Yet that begs the question, given the population of this country, are there a few good men and women out there to run for office? Or is this experiment in democracy toast?

The revolutionaries in France had a government by the people to fuel their passions. What is going to fuel ours, seeing we already have that technically.

Get to know some Amish and

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 19:05:09 +0000

In reply to Interesting stuff to say the

Get to know some Amish and old order Mennonites and learn how to grow food without trips to the nursery or garden shop.

The serfs throughout history

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 18:43:35 +0000

In reply to The issue facing those in

The serfs throughout history have taken their lot and endured through it in large part because the alternatives looked pretty much the same or worse.

All it really takes is for enough people to be desperate and angry enough to believe that "Whatever they get has to be better than what they have now." And to have a group or single person to blame.

One need only study the French revolution to see this and to see that it does not always turn out well initially.

Actually they are pretty

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 18:39:09 +0000

In reply to The issue facing those in

Actually they are pretty ineffective against governments as well. You usually wind up trading one set of clowns for another.

The issue facing those in

Elusive Trope — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 18:27:30 +0000

In reply to They Say We'll Have a Revolution......

The issue facing those in America is that what is required is a economic revolution, not a political one. Which brings up the questions around "Stage 6: The Second American Revolution explodes into a brutal full-scale class war rebelling against the out-of-touch, out-of-control greedy conspiracy-of-the-rich now running America."

Just how the people going to rebel against these folks? Most people running into the streets will have to run quite awhile, and head to some other state for that matter, before they actually cross path with one these folks running America. And just what are they going to do once they meet them? While revolutions can be effective in tossing out those at governmental levers, they are pretty ineffective when it comes to changing the economic infrastructure and the people who are at the controls. In many cases these folks aren't even in this country (and definitely won't be if things start to look a little dicey). Unless of course the goal is to just burn it all down. In which case, in the short run, people will be experiencing even greater austerity than what drove them to burn it all down in the first place.

Which brings up the big question?: for those at the "bottom" who are joining the fight in this all-out class war, what is that they fighting for? What is going to replace the current system the revolution topples? Nothing undermines the passion for revolution faster than ambiguity, especially if it is going to require personal sacrifice. What purpose is there for me to get arrested? tear gassed? depossessed of my belongings? The serfs throughout history have taken their lot and endured through it in large part because the alternatives looked pretty much the same or worse.

Interesting Larry. One cannot

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 18:24:36 +0000

In reply to In other words, a paradigm

Interesting Larry. One cannot really put these people under one small umbrella that is for sure. There is another aspect of the Tea Party people that most on the left either choose to ignore or are just unaware of. That is the presence of the 1960s/70s live-off-the-land Abby Hoffman anti-government crowd in it. People who had no use for the Democrats because of the 1968 convention fiasco and don't really like the republicans but have an enemy of my enemy is my friend loose relationship with them.

Just listen to the current rhetoric vis-à-vis the budget. Theses are not your fathers conservatives by a long shot.

Now I could be all wet on

cmaukonen — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 18:11:13 +0000

In reply to Despite their

Now I could be all wet on this, but what it sounds to me like more than anything else is they want to be able to do this in their state/community if they so choose. The whole States Rights thing with out Washington interfering. This has been the issue for the south from the get go and to a small extent with central and some northern states as well.

But this is just one issue out of many IMHO.

Interesting stuff to say the

Beetlejuice — Tue, 05 Apr 2011 17:40:56 +0000

In reply to They Say We'll Have a Revolution......

Interesting stuff to say the least. Gonna have to take some time and parse every word. In the meantime, you're absolutely correct about austre lifestyles...one hard pill to swallow...but not too difficult to get accustom to. You have to live within your means and make every penny count as well as your food stocks being able to cover a missed pay period due to illness. Splurging means you have to sacrifice something else you might need latter so one has to be careful. What is interesting is a simple diet is less costly than an average diet especially if one can store the basics...rice, dried legumes and so forth...so the only daily necessities would be bread, milk and meat (chicken, fish [tuna/sardines], pork, beef).