The Bishop and the Butterfly: Murder, Politics, and the End of the Jazz Age

    The Want of the “Why.”

    By JoanOfArc on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 10:36am |

    One over-thinking girl’s thoughts as to why she wishes dating was more like auditioning.

    The other day, I was talking to one of my platonic male friends of about 7 years, let’s call him Chris*. We were talking about lots of things I guess, politics, pursuing our dreams (we both just quit our jobs to pursue less lucrative, but more fulfilling ventures), and then the subject came to members of the opposite sex and dating. We got on to the subject of a mutual friends’ party earlier that week. It was relaxed, a local pub on the lower east side, where friends and friends-of-friends had gathered.

    Apparently, our mutual friend’s gal pal had taken interest in him. I asked him if he was interested and he answered with a sigh (not the good kind), “She’s cute, he said, but not super-cute. You know? Not long-term hot enough, not girlfriend-hot.” Ok.

    Let me say now this is not going to be one of those male-bashing-why-won’t-anyone-love-me articles. More like I get it. As a female here in NYC, going on plenty of dates myself, have certainly been in situations where I have not found the gentlemen to be exactly er… Brad. Of course I give it a shot, but in the end, if there’s still no spark - I get it, looks are important, and completely understand. It’s nature. And one person’s definition of attractive is not necessarily the other person’s – which is why one girl will find Robert Downey Jr. downright sexy (me) and the other will find him an overrated mess and choose a Ryan Gosling instead (no thanks, I couldn’t see him saving the world.) I’ve read the National Geographic articles. We want to make babies with someone we find physically stimulating and be a good provider, (though I don’t plan to make any soon.) But it’s evolution and theory and all those things and you have to be attracted and I get it. On a basic scale 9’s rarely get with 5’s unless someone has something real good to offer.

    That being said, Chris went out with cute-not-so-cute one time, and after did not call her. Not shockingly, when some girls met up for happy hour drinks, she was at a loss as to why she had not heard.

    Sigh.

    I would like to say now as someone who is newly pursuing a career as an actor, I have been on plenty casting calls– some of which I haven’t got, some of which I have. The greatest thing about them? Honesty. Brutal, God-love-it honesty. If you’re an actor you know, you get everything. They said you were one inch too tall. One inch too short. They didn’t like your read, they loved your read, they wanted to go with a name and frankly my dear you don’t have one yet. They wanted someone less urban, more urban. You’re too thin, you’re too heavy, your voice was too high, low, gotcha. Yay yay yay. What do they have in common, the one thing that makes me so happy? They have a freaking reason. You’re given a reason, you can say sayonara, thanks so much, bye, and move on.

    So you can imagine how I had to bite my tongue as cute-not-cute-girl pressed on, wondering why she had not heard back from dreamboat Chris. I just kept on biting that tongue. It had nothing to do with her personality, her wit, her charm because honestly she’s a great girl. This guy just didn’t think she was exactly America’s Next Top Model, she didn’t make his Miss Tyra cut or whatever it was, and that’s his loss frankly. (It’s not like he’s all that btw. I mean, I’ve been friends with him 7 years, and I’ve managed to keep my panties on.) But there I was sitting, stuck between very strong margaritas and extra-cheesy nachos, wanting to say something so badly, to just put it out there, “He doesn’t think you’re hot. Get over it.”

    Gah! I am terrible.

    I felt so masochistic thinking this. Not just for thinking this, but because I wish my friends would be this brutally honest with me. No, really sometimes I wish they would. Some I feel would find this catty behavior. I have news for you. It is. But I would rather have a freaking painful short-lived catty scratch than the lingering pain of a why-didn’t-he-call boa slowly digesting my overactive imagination any day. I put myself in her shoes for a moment, if someone wasn’t interested in me because they did not think I was good-looking enough, the overwhelmingly enormous “FUCK YOU” that would fly out of my mouth toward them would be earth-shattering. How easy it would be to move on from there, and not over think it. Hence the want of the why. I know I am attractive, intelligent, and sophisticated and can get a ton of others, so I wouldn’t waste any more time on that person for some mystery reason that is eating at me. Like a boa. A BOA.

    See? This is the want of the why.

    Case study 2: The other day my girlfriend went in for a role for a popular TV show, she’s a (working) model, she had a great read, and she didn’t get it. Why? They told her agent later she wasn’t “every guy’s dream.” And she is a knockout! When she told me that we started laughing, parted ways, and moved on to our next auditions. Done. She was out of there and she has a ton of other offers. And plus we had a great case of the ‘they-are-crazy’ giggles.

    I couldn’t help but wonder how great it would be if dating were more like auditions. He’s not funny enough? Done. She’s too dependent? Bye. He’s funny and he’s not always talking about how much he makes? My number is 212-273-2….

    So, instead of saying anything, I just bit that tongue as my other female cohorts sugar-coated to make our friend ‘feel better’. Mollycoddling while I was thinking, “What’s wrong with the truth? Isn’t it what will set you free? Casting directors will tell you, why can’t a date tell you? Is it a confrontation, or ‘looking-like-a-jerk that is the reason most people won’t say anything? Who cares, you’re thinking it anyway, let’s get it out in the open and move on. Piece of cake.”

    I guess this is the part where I should admit I am an over-analyzer. Sometimes a blessing, sometimes a curse. But like you guessed about the happy hour madness, I just kept that tongue held with the help of some tequila. Just wishing I could sprinkle those nachos with all the reasons ‘why’.

    Cut to me a few days later with another group of girls, my girlfriend introduced me to one of her guy friends. Later, she nudged me and said, “This is the guy I was telling you about, what do you think?” I looked over. Nope. I smiled, and politely told her I was not interested in a relationship. She was rather surprised, and try I might to change the subject she couldn’t let it go. When she pressed for why, I told her the truth.

    Comments

    I've tried the honest approach a couple of times, being polite, but direct. And now I know why people either don't call or make shit up to extricate themselves.

    The first time was a few years ago. This guy wanted to go out and he called me up one night so we could talk a bit first. I asked him questions about things that are important to me. For example, when he said he liked to travel (a promising start), I asked the place that he had traveled that was furthest from home. He mentioned Chicago, which is an hour and a half away, and Lake Michigan, which is over the county line. He said he likes to shop, which I absolutely do not, so I made a joke about being allergic to the mall and he proceeded to regale me with hayfever stories, I kid you not.

    So, when he asked me to dinner, I politely declined. It was a first for me. Normally, I would either agree, and then suffer through an excruciating date, or make up some excuse for why I couldn't and then just never answer my phone again. But in this case, something came over me, and I was honest. "No, thank you," I believe were my exact words. When he asked why, again, I was honest. "We don't have much in common so I don't think we'd have a good time." (By the way, the conversation was longer than Lake Michigan and the mall. I'm not that shallow.) What proceeded was another hour of him basically begging me to change my mind and me being too nice at first to just tell him to fuck off. I felt like asking him if he thought desperation made him more attractive. In the end, I didn't, but I did have to be pretty mean to get him off the phone, after which I got an email screed about what a bad person I was. 

    Last summer, I went out with a guy a couple of times and thought he was actually ok. But after the second date, he started calling, emailing, and texting constantly, not to share any important information, but to ask stupid ass questions like, "How's work?" or "How are you feeling today?" I communicated to him that I didn't feel the need to be in contact 78 times a day and asked him to cool it. He agreed, said he totally understood, and continued the behavior. I have a somewhat pathalogical overreaction to feeling smothered, so I told him I didn't want to see him again and it led to--guess what--an hour long conversation where he basically begged me to give him another chance. His last attempt at persuasion was, "Maybe you're just not in the right place right now, but if we wait a couple of months, you'll feel differently" To which I replied honestly, "I could tell you that was true to make you feel better today but then you'd have your hopes up for two months and I wouldn't feel any differently, and I think that would be a really crappy thing for me to do." He got mad.

    When there's no attraction for either side, it's easy. He doesn't call and you're glad he didn't. But when there's some sort of desperation or confidence that if she/he would only get to know me better, we'd fall madly in love, honesty is a lost cause. Because the person on the receiving end isn't listening.

    So, although I think it's as annoying as you do when you don't get the reason or the closure you want, maybe it's because the dater can never be sure the datee is a rational person or a desperate one until the honesty is on the table. And sometimes the risk just isn't worth it.


    by Orlando on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 11:47am

    Ah...dating. Just in case you attached people forgot what it's like and yearn to be single again.

    O--I expect that this kind of response is much more common among men, since aggressive pursuit by women is less socially acceptable. Though why the behavior you describe is any more socially acceptable from men is beyond me.

    But another more gender-neutral reason to hold back: some people can't handle the truth. They're less confident than JoanOfArc, and criticism, especially sexually-related criticism, is really upsetting to them. Actors have to develop thick skins or get out of the biz, but your average date never signed on to be an actor.

    Conversely, saying mean things like "You're not girlfriend hot" makes the rejecters feel shitty too, even if the words are true. I didn't sign on to be a casting director any more than my date signed on to be an actor.

    A date between an actor and casting directory, however: no holds barred.


    by Michael Wolraich on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 12:21pm

    You think men act like that when they're rejected because it's more socially acceptable for them to pursue women aggressively? I'll have to take your word for it. But I sort of always thought it was because it's easier for women to believe that they might not be worthy of someone's affection, which is no more and no less ridiculous.


    by Orlando on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 1:47pm

    The old proverb goes, "A Man chases a Woman until she catches him."

    That's a remnant of a tradition that the man must pursue, while the woman must flee, and only reluctantly let herself be caught. The problem for us Men is that there's no easy formula. Some women do like to be pursued while others mean it when they say No. Likewise, some men see rejection, even a current boyfriend, as a challenge, while others are easily rebuffed.

    And our popular culture is full of men chasing and winning women, even forcibly:

    Goldfinger later on tells Pussy to keep James entertained whilst he deals with removing the late Mr Solo from his gold. They walk into a barn where Bond wants to get to know her more closely. Pussy however is not interested and tells 007 that it would take a lot more than he has got to interest her. Bond and Pussy then try to use their Judo skills to get the better of one another until Bond gets the upper hand and succeeds in seducing her.

     


    by Donal on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 2:05pm

    Yeah, what you said.


    by Bluesplashy on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 9:06pm

    That's a reply to Genghis and that means I agree with what he said.  It looks confusing because of the placement and we don't have those little 'in response to ....' tags here.


    by Bluesplashy on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 9:08pm

    I've been on dates that were a lot like auditions, but none of my auditions were like dates. The folks doing the casting can afford to be blunt and even cruel because the star system provides them a seemingly endless supply of talented, eager young hopefuls.

    Imagine though, that you start rejecting people without even a modicum of face-saving courtesy: "Sorry, I want someone thinner." Unless you are one hell of a catch, word will spread in your social group, and you might find fewer and fewer people willing to run the gauntlet of your disdain.


    by Donal on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 12:12pm

    From William Shakespeare's Twelfth Night, Act V Scene I:

    DUKE ORSINO

    I know thee well; how dost thou, my good fellow?

    Clown

    Truly, sir, the better for my foes and the worse
    for my friends.

    DUKE ORSINO

    Just the contrary; the better for thy friends.

    Clown

    No, sir, the worse.

    DUKE ORSINO

    How can that be?

    Clown

    Marry, sir, they praise me and make an ass of me;
    now my foes tell me plainly I am an ass: so that by
    my foes, sir I profit in the knowledge of myself,
    and by my friends, I am abused: so that,
    conclusions to be as kisses, if your four negatives
    make your two affirmatives why then, the worse for
    my friends and the better for my foes.


    by DF on Sat, 02/14/2009 - 1:30pm