The next several days will be filled with postmortems about the "shocker" among pro-Trump Latinos in Florida@realcpaz called it last week: https://t.co/yo2uOea6Cn
[...] “It all boils down to understanding that you are in charge of your own kind of predicament,” Enriquez told me. “America, we’re really at the crossroads of either self-governance or being dependent on the government—and Hispanics know very well which decision they need to be making.”
Liberals may accuse these Latinos of voting against their own interests, given Trump’s mishandling of the pandemic, attempts to repeal the Affordable Care Act, and restrictions on immigration—all issues that affect millions of Latino lives. But many pro-Trump Latinos told me they simply define their interests differently than their more progressive cousins do. They don’t necessarily feel solidarity with Latinos as a whole, and many identify themselves as American first. (Some reject “Latino” or “Latinx” labels as well.) Many are lifelong Republicans not eager to abandon their party, and Trump’s economy-first message and opposition to abortion rights resonate with them. Democrats shouldn’t be surprised if Trump matches or improves on his 2016 showing among Latinos, or if their votes help him hold battleground states. Republican Latinos have always existed, and the Trump campaign has dedicatedsignificantresources to winning over more of the Hispanic community this election cycle.
Election-year conversations tend to flatten voters into stereotypes, but there is no one kind of Latino voter: They aren’t all of Mexican or Cuban descent, nor are they all Catholic or connected by a shared immigrant experience—even though these subgroups dominate national attention. Though 60 to 70 percent vote for Democrats, according to the Pew Research Center, Latinos aren’t a reliably partisan voting bloc and need to be persuaded, in culturally competent ways, to vote. Their differences in national identity, immigrant background, experiences with discrimination, and religious beliefs make Latinos just as complicated as any other demographic group, though they aren’t always portrayed that way.
Take immigration, an issue commonly identified as the central Latino priority because many Americans assume that all Latinos hold the same pro-immigration view. The first time Enriquez heard Trump speak about politics was during the future president’s campaign-launch speech in 2015, when he said Mexico was “sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime.” Enriquez told me he could forgive the president’s comments. “I know exactly the status of Mexico, and how crime has completely just taken over the beautiful country that is Mexico. So when President Trump was talking about what Mexico is sending, I immediately knew—I understood [what he meant],” Enriquez said. “Did he word it correctly? No, but he did emphasize that, you know, it wasn’t all Mexicans.” (Enriquez told me that he first learned about Trump when he wrote a paper on The Art of the Deal in ninth grade.)
Some pro-Trump Latinos told me they understand why immigrants seek new lives in America, but they want them to come to this country “the right way.” They don’t necessarily identify with the plight of Latin American Trump has done a good job of encouraging Latinos to start new businesses, seek employment, and advance their education—they’re not as focused on his immigration agenda. “We take pride in being self-sufficient. We don’t want a permanent handout,” Barbara Carrasco, a Latina businesswoman from El Paso who ran for Congress in 2012, told me. “President Trump really wants everybody to have an opportunity to succeed.”
Enriquez noted that young U.S.-born Latinos find messages centered on economic mobility and entrepreneurship especially appealing. Indeed, Trump’s pitch seems to be working for a subset of U.S.-born Mexican American men, which recent polling suggests would especially help the president in the Sun Belt. Overall, Trump has attracted higher levels of support among Latino men in swingstates than he did in 2016.
Even after the coronavirus hit and Republicans could no longer tout record-low and Republicans could no longer tout record-low unemployment figures among Hispanic men, the Trump campaign kept its attention on messaging to Latino voters. One week in July captured the clumsy but potentially effective drive to win them over: A meeting on Wednesday, July 8, at the White House with the Mexican president signaled Trump’s commitment to border security and what he considers fair trade. Thursday’s signing ceremony for the Hispanic Prosperity Initiative reaffirmed his stated commitment to school choice and increasing educational opportunities for Latinos. (At the event, the CEO of Goya, Robert Unanue [....]
Hokum: "America, we’re really at the crossroads of either self-governance or being dependent on the government—and Hispanics know very well which decision they need to be making.”
Cubans gravitate towards right wing authoritarians, like Batista or Trump, with those on the in having the opportunities for graft and corruption. Miami-Dade is nearly half Cuban and has one of the highest violent and property crime rates in the country. Florida is the motherlode of scams. Cubans resent Hispanics of Mexican origin, think they are better than them, and if Cubans say Mexico is corrupt, when has Cuba ever not been corrupt?
It seems to me that one the problems of immigrants who have become citizensof all kinds of Hispanic backgrounds may have a more Republican-leaning ideology because it agrees with the reasons they immigrated, including starting their own businesses. And the immigrants of all kinds of Hispanic backgrounds who only have a green card are probably the more Democratic leaning as they come for the ability for earned income, to send remittances to others at home, they are not able to vote and haven't the luxury of time of thinking about such things. Furthermore the latter have seen how the DACA kids have been treated trying to become full citizens. So it's: why bother?
On the contrary, domestic small business stocks took a hit from expectation Republicans holding the Senate will block Biden domestic infrastructure investments:
"Anticipation that a Republican Senate would keep a tight grip on the government’s purse strings meant less enthusiasm for smaller companies. The Russell 2000 index of small capitalization stocks — which tend to be more domestically focused firms whose businesses depend largely on activity in the United States — drastically underperformed the gain for larger stocks."
Some of us were writing about Trump’s resilience with Hispanic voters back in early July, without even the benefit of speaking to any real voters. https://t.co/d4K865LZ3n
Still the best opinion piece that explains rising nonwhite support for Trump. Left of center analysts often see nonwhites as victimized stereotypes, have ignored the data and refused to talk to nonwhites outside of the highly educated prep school bubble https://t.co/ZQjAjcsC1o
What they are describing in this article very much reminded me of the two "Prosperity Gospel" evangelical churches in my Bronx zip code, which here seem to be most popular with Caribbean immigrants (we don't have many Mexicans or Cubans, nor Venezuelans or any other South Americans; we do have lots of Dominicians, and plenty of Puerto Ricans and Jamaicans, who dominate and help elect Democrats, but are pretty pro-police. Along with Chinese, Koreans, Indians, Irish, Russians, Pakistanis, Egyptians...Koreans have their own Christian church, the ones I have met do strike me as Republican types but can't know for sure. There's a Buddhist temple as well! Covid may have sunk them all, tho...) I mention all the ethnicities because this thought also struck me--I can't think of a single person I've met in this neighborhood that I think would support "socialism". They all to a one seem to be into capitalist pursuits.
By Beth Reinhard & Lori Rozsa @ WashingtonPost.com, Nov. 4
[....] Biden drew far fewer Hispanic voters than Democrats expected, carrying Florida’s most populous county of Miami-Dade by only seven percentage points, compared with the 30-point margin boasted by Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton in 2016. To top it off, the Republican surge in Miami-Dade sent shock waves down the ballot, appearing to help unseat two Democratic members of Congress who represented the county, including Donna Shalala, a well-known former Cabinet secretary and president of the University of Miami.
Trump’s gains in Miami-Dade accounted for about 75 percent of his gain in net votes in the state over 2016. So rather than potentially celebrating an outright Election Day win in a huge battleground state, Biden was left to wage a drawn-out, pitched battle for votes in razor-thin contests across the country.
“It was a bloodbath,” Joe Garcia, former chairman of the Miami-Dade Democratic Party, said of his party’s showing there.
While pro-Biden ads dominated television in Florida, the GOP outworked Democrats on the ground, narrowing the voter registration gap between the two parties to its smallest margin in decades. Democrats pulled back on neighborhood canvassing until the homestretch of the campaign because of the coronavirus pandemic.
What’s more, voters from immigrant backgrounds seemed to gravitate toward Trump’s aspirational, though at times misleading statements about the strength of the economy while dismissing Biden’s dire warnings about the public health crisis.
“Our guy was talking about covid all the time and wearing a giant mask,” said Garcia, a former congressman and executive director of the Cuban American National Foundation. “The other was headlining massive rallies, talking about prosperity and looking indestructible.”
The GOP’s attacks on Democrats up and down the ballot as “socialists’’ resounded with Hispanic voters scarred by authoritarian regimes in Latin America and seeking economic opportunity in the United States.
Results of the two intensely competitive congressional races in Miami-Dade point to Trump’s improved standing among Hispanic voters.
In the district represented by Shalala, Trump lost by only three percentage points, compared to 20 points in 2016.
In Garcia’s former congressional district, one of the most Hispanic in the country, Trump won by six percentage points on Tuesday. In 2016, he lost that district by 16 points [....]
“No wonder so many Republicans turned out to vote. Democrats proved to be the most effective GOTV operation for the GOP imaginable.” https://t.co/GQYtC9rzgY
“In a trend that went largely unnoticed by Democrats until lately, more recent Cuban immigrants who previously displayed little engagement in American politics have started to identify as Trump Republicans.” 4/x https://t.co/aOtYrMoUcX
One of the most disturbing stories of 2020 now looks even worse. Spanish radio stations in Florida were polluted w/misinformation & racist conspiracies in order to pit Latino voters against Af Americans. Published in Oct by @PatriciaMazzei & @jennymedina. https://t.co/Au9avC4ttn
Thanks, I figured something like that going on precisely because I've read so many stories about nightmarish results from the way social media use rumor mongers in Latin and South America in small tribal group to small tribal group. (As in lynch mob type situations against pedophiles or the like.) It's a problem in parts of Africa too.
I would argue, though, that it comes from not trusting propaganda though!. And only trusting family and friends and who those people vouch for. Wherever there's corrupt government that controls media in some way.
Wherever they have such an ingrained distrust of propaganda from official media, they take to social media like bees to honey, because they can pass info in very small tribal groups. They trust the people in them, often familial based. With the rumor mongering and gossip one would expect from that!
Does show how not being fluent in English can be a big problem, because like it or not, English is where some independent factual reporting is still going on? So ripe a situation for agents provocateurs who can speak the lingo and understand the small tribes, their interests and fear.
I can't imagine how frustrating it must be, much worse than dealing with a deluded Trumpie or Qanon fan on Twitter, because there al least you have outsiders to help
“It’s painful and scary to see people you love and think should know better fall into these traps,” she said. “I do what I can: I talk to my mother and think I convince her, but it’s like every time I put one rumor out, there’s another one the next week or even the next day.”
Really hits home how globalized English as a universal language supporting free speech is a better way for all it's faults? These little tribal groups: ugh, way to build hate and distrust of anybody with different DNA.
This one comment gave me a beeeg reality check on topic. Let's not forget that "Hispanics" or "Latinos" are a ridiculous label, as they are a huge and diverse group on track to be the majority, soon may not even be a legit minority. Just as whypipple are a huge and diverse group. There are Trump fans and then there are lots of others.
People keep talking about grassroots organizing among Hispanics vs. alienation of affluent Republicans as alternative theories of how Arizona got so much bluer but it seems clear that you needed both to get where we are. https://t.co/LlKxv4MX9J
Gawd I wish all race/ethnicity questions were erased from the census. We're Americans, that's it. Need to stop falling for the minorities game and start paying more attention to economic classes and the like.
Edit to add: the language problem is still one that divides. Maybe AI can solve that soon, though? In the meantime, couldn't census ask about what is the person's main language instead of race or ethnicity?
lol you really need to stop using the bubble slur because it makes you look ridiculously incoherent. Focusing myopically on the interests of a minority of anything is the definition of bubble, the opposite of big picture or even view from another different bubble. Everything you have ever done on this site is emphasize that a bubble or minority view is important, that all the rest of us, the majority out in the world need to understand your favorite minority bubble and all the details inside that bubble, everything that happens to your bubble needs to be noted, there is nothing more important to learn about than what happened to your bubble today and the next and the next...
If you see trumps numbers with minorities and your only take away is “these are stupid people who are open to white supremacy “ then I think you’re being as dense as the people you claim to oppose
just posted because it's thought-provoking. Self-describes as Business Owner, Financial Planner, Investor, liberal. Been tweeting since 2011, says he lives in Smyrna.
At a certain point one would think we have to admit that there is simply a large swathe of the population, including a substantial fraction of non-white people, who do not buy into progressive intellectuals’ conception of what racism is. https://t.co/iZJOUEgoLC
There might be two melting pots bubbling away in America, not one. Contrary to the lazy narrative that minorities lean left, 2nd generation non-graduate Hispanics might be "assimilating to norms & culture of non-degree working class whites"https://t.co/wRemBZ8kLl
Good piece. I hope this question is explored more in the coming years. Right-wing populism isn't going away any time soon, and boiling it all down to white racism isn't going to serve us (even though that's clearly a part of it). https://t.co/dIeLiv3ofU
On how Asian-Americans voted in Neveda & increase in Trump support among Vietnamese-Americans
Asian Americans are 11% of Nevada’s electorate, per one study. That’s quite a significant number in a perennial battleground and early primary state.https://t.co/bUtL43YBvD
Man, I’d missed just how poorly Biden ran in heavily Puerto Rican Osceola County. The Florida story is not just about Cubans and Venezuelans. https://t.co/3QjusBHFNJ
Comments
Oct. 29 at The Atlantic, by Christian Paz
excerpt
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 2:16pm
Hokum: "America, we’re really at the crossroads of either self-governance or being dependent on the government—and Hispanics know very well which decision they need to be making.”
Cubans gravitate towards right wing authoritarians, like Batista or Trump, with those on the in having the opportunities for graft and corruption. Miami-Dade is nearly half Cuban and has one of the highest violent and property crime rates in the country. Florida is the motherlode of scams. Cubans resent Hispanics of Mexican origin, think they are better than them, and if Cubans say Mexico is corrupt, when has Cuba ever not been corrupt?
by NCD on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 3:33pm
It seems to me that one the problems of immigrants who have become citizens of all kinds of Hispanic backgrounds may have a more Republican-leaning ideology because it agrees with the reasons they immigrated, including starting their own businesses. And the immigrants of all kinds of Hispanic backgrounds who only have a green card are probably the more Democratic leaning as they come for the ability for earned income, to send remittances to others at home, they are not able to vote and haven't the luxury of time of thinking about such things. Furthermore the latter have seen how the DACA kids have been treated trying to become full citizens. So it's: why bother?
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 6:07pm
On the contrary, domestic small business stocks took a hit from expectation Republicans holding the Senate will block Biden domestic infrastructure investments:
"Anticipation that a Republican Senate would keep a tight grip on the government’s purse strings meant less enthusiasm for smaller companies. The Russell 2000 index of small capitalization stocks — which tend to be more domestically focused firms whose businesses depend largely on activity in the United States — drastically underperformed the gain for larger stocks."
by NCD on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 7:43pm
I wasn't talking logical! I was talking ideology.
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 8:54pm
Yglesias/Vox on topic:
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 8:55pm
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 11:07pm
What they are describing in this article very much reminded me of the two "Prosperity Gospel" evangelical churches in my Bronx zip code, which here seem to be most popular with Caribbean immigrants (we don't have many Mexicans or Cubans, nor Venezuelans or any other South Americans; we do have lots of Dominicians, and plenty of Puerto Ricans and Jamaicans, who dominate and help elect Democrats, but are pretty pro-police. Along with Chinese, Koreans, Indians, Irish, Russians, Pakistanis, Egyptians...Koreans have their own Christian church, the ones I have met do strike me as Republican types but can't know for sure. There's a Buddhist temple as well! Covid may have sunk them all, tho...) I mention all the ethnicities because this thought also struck me--I can't think of a single person I've met in this neighborhood that I think would support "socialism". They all to a one seem to be into capitalist pursuits.
Miami-Dade Hispanics helped sink Biden in Florida
By Beth Reinhard & Lori Rozsa @ WashingtonPost.com, Nov. 4
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/04/2020 - 11:40pm
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 1:25am
Published Oct. 25, dateline Miami
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 2:04am
Latinos respond to propaganda - surprised?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 7:20am
Thanks, I figured something like that going on precisely because I've read so many stories about nightmarish results from the way social media use rumor mongers in Latin and South America in small tribal group to small tribal group. (As in lynch mob type situations against pedophiles or the like.) It's a problem in parts of Africa too.
I would argue, though, that it comes from not trusting propaganda though!. And only trusting family and friends and who those people vouch for. Wherever there's corrupt government that controls media in some way.
Wherever they have such an ingrained distrust of propaganda from official media, they take to social media like bees to honey, because they can pass info in very small tribal groups. They trust the people in them, often familial based. With the rumor mongering and gossip one would expect from that!
Does show how not being fluent in English can be a big problem, because like it or not, English is where some independent factual reporting is still going on? So ripe a situation for agents provocateurs who can speak the lingo and understand the small tribes, their interests and fear.
I can't imagine how frustrating it must be, much worse than dealing with a deluded Trumpie or Qanon fan on Twitter, because there al least you have outsiders to help
Really hits home how globalized English as a universal language supporting free speech is a better way for all it's faults? These little tribal groups: ugh, way to build hate and distrust of anybody with different DNA.
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 11:32am
This one comment gave me a beeeg reality check on topic. Let's not forget that "Hispanics" or "Latinos" are a ridiculous label, as they are a huge and diverse group on track to be the majority, soon may not even be a legit minority. Just as whypipple are a huge and diverse group. There are Trump fans and then there are lots of others.
Gawd I wish all race/ethnicity questions were erased from the census. We're Americans, that's it. Need to stop falling for the minorities game and start paying more attention to economic classes and the like.
Edit to add: the language problem is still one that divides. Maybe AI can solve that soon, though? In the meantime, couldn't census ask about what is the person's main language instead of race or ethnicity?
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 12:20pm
Using economic class alone is a horrible idea
For example, lower levels of medical care persists in the Black community even with a higher economic status
You want to hide that reality because it does not fit into your view from the bubble
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 12:40pm
lol you really need to stop using the bubble slur because it makes you look ridiculously incoherent. Focusing myopically on the interests of a minority of anything is the definition of bubble, the opposite of big picture or even view from another different bubble. Everything you have ever done on this site is emphasize that a bubble or minority view is important, that all the rest of us, the majority out in the world need to understand your favorite minority bubble and all the details inside that bubble, everything that happens to your bubble needs to be noted, there is nothing more important to learn about than what happened to your bubble today and the next and the next...
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 12:55pm
just posted because it's thought-provoking. Self-describes as Business Owner, Financial Planner, Investor, liberal. Been tweeting since 2011, says he lives in Smyrna.
He is followed by, among others: Danny Cardwell
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 1:50pm
Yglesias & Krugman on same meme:
by artappraiser on Thu, 11/05/2020 - 2:15pm
by artappraiser on Fri, 11/06/2020 - 2:08am
by artappraiser on Fri, 11/06/2020 - 7:51pm
On how Asian-Americans voted in Neveda & increase in Trump support among Vietnamese-Americans
by artappraiser on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 10:07pm
by artappraiser on Sun, 11/15/2020 - 1:40pm