Inconvenient fact: a cop gets shot nearly every day in America

By artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 2:25pm |

2. A cop gets shot almost every day in America: https://t.co/vDrzjBrKcm

This makes policing in America fundamentally different from policing in Europe, where cops have (almost) no reason to fear being shot.
— Coleman Hughes (@coldxman) August 27, 2020

URL:

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/officer-shot

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Comments

Inconvenient facts:

- More Americans shoot themselves by accident than in Europe

- More American kids kill themselves or a friend playing with a gun than Europe

- More American adults accidentally shoot a family member than Europe

- More Americans intentionally murder a family member or acquaintance with a gun than in Europe

- More Americans try to carry guns onto commercial aircraft than Europe

- More Americans commit suicide with guns than in Europe

- More guns are stolen and used in crimes in America than in Europe

- There are more and deadlier mass shootings in America than in Europe

- More Americans are killed by stray bullets falling from the sky than in Europe

WHY..?? I ask you ....WHY ..?

BTW Coleman just graduated from Columbia College, NYC.

He doesn't want reparations as he would be "demeaned", and even at his young age he has determined for sure that the "basic premise of Black Lives Matter — that racist cops are killing unarmed black people — is false".

He is much loved by personalities on Fox News.

by NCD on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 3:56pm

I linked to the Gun Violence archive, which is fact.

Yes Hughes short comment in his tweet which I included is suggestive analysis.

But I think it is an important suggestion as to any ability to reform how police act in this country!

If they fear for their lives, they are not always going to be acting as rational as cops elsewhere. What to do about that?

I kept this separate from the political thread for a reason.

I disagree with you putting this comment of his into a political context. It's a real problem he's pointing out, a big problem. And the more people become armed during this current mess--which is happening for sure, new gunowners fueling rise in purchases, there is even an ammunition shortage, the worse the affects will get.

Edit to add: I don't agree with your tendency to judge quality of content by who uses it in politics for their spin. I don't feel everything should be about politics. Policing reform is one thing like that.

And actually, if I go there for a minute, I don't see Joe Biden disagreeing with much that Coleman Hughes writes at all in all that he has published in his short life. Because Fox spinners might cherry pick his stuff because he has black skin doesn't change that fact, it just means introducing racial polticization of every fucking thing. It's okay when Joe says it, but not when Coleman does, he's sposed to be more liberal...

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:05pm

Back to topic. There are a lot of guns in this country and more all the time. There is not going to be an easy fix about that without a dictatorship visiting every house taking them and melting them down.

So in the meantime of, hopefully in the near future, having some more national gun control laws. Doesn't solve the problem of all the guns out there available to those with more criminal intent. Doesn't free the police to police in a way that Europeans do. So how do you train them

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:10pm

Here's the thing: you take it in a Fox vs. MSNBC political context as Hughes saying: feel sorry for the police, the suffer more than black people

For chrissake, he's not saying that at all! Quit politicizing it!!'

Yes of course that's what Hannity would say, it fits with ye olde support the troops ideology. Taking Coleman with black skin, says something we can cherry pick and put in on "our side"

Myself don't feel sorry for the police, I don't even like most police, I especially don't like hardboiled big city police. My father taught me growing up not to trust the police, As a city labor negotiator, he also taught me that they are extremely well paid in compensation and benefits for the risk that their job entails and they know that going in.

But neither is Hughes saying "feel sorry for all the police victims"! Feelings of the reader have nothing to do with it. The irrational feelings of cops is what he is pointing out!

He is pointing out: fear colors the work they do because of all the guns in this society. So that we can really try to fix something. At least a little.

You know the one thing I really disagree with you about, NCD, is how you have a closed mind about sources according to how they are politicized. That works well for me when Lulu posts all kinds of crap propaganda. But I don't think as a rule it works out well at all, all it does is stoke divisiveness by presuming everyone is doing propaganda and not just offering contrarian thinking or a new perpsective.

To not keep an open mind and just feed the divisiveness of only two versions of reality, we might as well just give up right now. Both sides are truly the problem. Reality is more than two sides.

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 5:23pm

Joe Biden

“I’ve heard him speak really eloquently about systemic racism and housing,” said Vanita Gupta, who led the Justice Department’s civil rights division under former President Barack Obama. “And he’s had a close relationship with law enforcement for many years, and I don’t think the two live as contradictory things in his mind.”

In trying to have things both ways Mr. Biden risks alienating both ends of his coalition. Suburban voters — particularly older white voters — are less enthralled with the idea of defunding the police. And activists say a pledge to prosecute bad cops doesn’t go nearly far enough.

“We have to get away from this good cop, bad cop thing,” said Cori Bush, a Missouri Democrat who went from protesting police violence in Ferguson to unseating a longtime House member this month. “I agree with Joe Biden that something needs to change, but we have to take it much further than that. Because in the balance are dead people that look like me.”

Progressive lawmakers and activists say they do not believe their differences with Mr. Biden and his running mate, Senator Kamala Harris, on policing will hurt him electorally. They say they can find common ground with Mr. Biden, despite their reservations about his positions, but not with President Trump, who they fear will make things only worse for Black and Hispanic people with his aggressive vision of law enforcement.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/19/us/politics/democrats-biden-defund-police.html

And

For too long, black Americans have lived with a knee on their neck — not only institutional violence but daily injustices like having the police called for sitting in a coffee shop or watching birds in the park.

I support the proposal pending in New York to enhance penalties for making a false 911 call based on race, gender or religion. No one should be subjected to that kind of discrimination, ever.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2020/06/10/biden-root-out-systemic-racism-not-just-divisive-trump-talk-column/5327631002/

Coleman Hughes

There are some disparities in a cop’s likelihood to put his hands on a black or Hispanic suspect. As Harvard economist Roland Fryer found, cops are around 20% more likely to go hands-on a suspect if he’s black or Hispanic. The reason for that is unclear. It could be racial bias is a factor. It could be that black or Hispanic suspects are more likely to resist arrest because they perceive the arrest as being unfair for some reason. There could be different cultures of resisting arrest. That would be another plausible explanation – and it’s probably a combination of all these things. But the evidence that there’s racial bias in a cop’s decision to pull the trigger is paper thin, and in fact, really nonexistent.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/interview-coleman-hughes-on-police-reform-black-lives-matter-and-the-importance-of-data

As NCD notes, Biden sees racial bias, Hughes does not.

by rmrd0000 on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:29pm

More Joe Biden

Addressing the unrest in Kenosha, Wis., after the police shooting of Jacob Blake, which Republicans have seized on to try to present themselves as the party of law and order, Mr. Biden condemned violence “in any form” but also said that he supported the right to protest peacefully.

And he said that he was troubled by reports that Kyle Rittenhouse, a 17-year-old who was arrested in connection with shootings that left two people dead on Tuesday night, may have had “a connection to a militia in Illinois.”

“This is not who we are,” Mr. Biden said. “This is not who America is. They want to bring about some order in safety and security for people, we have to start dealing with the real problems underlying all these issues. And the president never speaks to that.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/08/27/us/rnc-convention-election?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

by rmrd0000 on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 5:38pm

She posted this in two places.

Blacks being killed by police is not a priority

Guy who just shot two people walked by Kenosha police without a problem

What is the allowable cops shot nationwide to police able to shoot black guy ratio?

by rmrd0000 on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:06pm

How many black died from Covid yesterday? How about those who now have no income, no job, getting evicted? Not a priority to rmrd types, priority is fighting police.

What about those whose family members have been murdered recently by non-police? Are they getting help from police tracking down those perps, are they getting justice? Or are police busy with protesting over a few cases?

Yes I do resent that anarchists have inflamed this topic right now and are hijacking the national discourse, which may help Trump win, it's hard not to think they might be doing it with the help of a foreign country.

Ain't going to change my mind on that, it's clearly irrational hysteria to make this the center of national discourse at this time. And may help Trump and Republicans win.

Blake case is being handled quickly, there has been progress on that front because of past protests. Now stop and prioritize numbers until the election if you care about actually affecting change rather than irrationally emoting on the streets and causing totally counterproductive results.

Don Lemon is not a right winger enemy of black people. Get rational for chrissakes.

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:21pm

We are talking about police abuse. Another diversion on your part.

People are aware of the disparate effects of COVID on the black community.

I'm sure that you have done a great deal personally to combat COVID

I've made donations to food banks and charities that have the resources to help people in need.

Had a board meeting Tuesday with a charity figuring out how to help at risk children.

The charity usually did hands on work with schools but now we are working around COVID restrictions.

Don't dare tell me what is and is not a priority.

Edit to add:

I'm listening to "Caste" on Audible. You come to mind when Wilkerson mentions the rigid upper class in India. Hypocritical and clueless.

Lefties, Wokes, and rmrd types. Typical.

by rmrd0000 on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:58pm

well please leave this thread as a "diversion" then, as you call it and take your national emotional outrage fest against Dem local governments on their policing back to one of the many other threads for that purpose.

don't gaslight me, I'm not hijacking anything, it's you are hijacking on a new thread I made to keep emoting about police abuse and the politicization of that emoting out of it

Take it back to where that discussion is,not here. I even made a convenient list of all the many other threads about protests there in the first comment. You could take it to one of those as well.

But I am not talking about just Dagblog.

Just turn on your local news and see how people are more obsessed with things like schools reopening right now. For all colors of parents and teachers. The types who haven't seen a cop in a long time, but to them, going back to school could mean : death.

Your myopic bubble focus is not necessarily everyone's even if you convince not just all pro sports and their media, MSNBC CNN and Fox to focus on it, even if you get all the Korean pop groups and the Queen of England to talk about Blake and Kenosha. There are other angles.

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 5:20pm

Hot morning take for everyone: As problematic as the police can be, de facto replacing them with less accountable private security and politicized militias is worse.
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) August 26, 2020

And yes I understand that nobody is proposing this. In general nobody *wants* the negative unintended consequences of their approach.

And yet!
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) August 26, 2020

Also a short while ago Yglesias retweeted this Vox story:

I review some new research that helps us understand one of the most disturbing parts of the Kenosha shootings: the police support for militia activity https://t.co/yA9Mu2SRum
— Zack Beauchamp (@zackbeauchamp) August 27, 2020

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 4:41pm

Not sure what they said new. There's some discrepancy between handguns and long guns - a sense that handheld streetguns are used for crime, long guns used like militias. That if course sets up the Bundy's and Boogaloos as heroes. But the article didn't really clarify the racial coding it presumed to expound on.

by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 10:45pm

I agree. But then Vox is not that good at going deep into weeds, they sell simplfying splainers. (I did like Yglesias' morning warning, tho.) Seen a lot the last few days about right wing militias "infiltrating" rural and small town P.D.'s but I think of that as very old news, not to mention having a chicken-or- egg problem. I think what's going on now is far more complex, there is a flood of radical libertarianism that lacks unifying ideology, lots of coalition making and breaking, and like the FBI is going mad trying to figure out what's really up. (No surprise to me that "it's hard work" for them, as counter movie stererotype, I think lots of FBI aren't the brightest bulbs on the planet either. And that's from personal experience when they'e tried to investigate the art world.)

by artappraiser on Thu, 08/27/2020 - 11:08pm

Inconvenient fact: a cop gets shot nearly every day in America

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