MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
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MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE by Michael Wolraich Order today at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop |
the left makes several significant errors with regard to racism on the right. Perhaps most important, leftists too often conceive of Trumpist politics as rooted primarily in racism, or even an ideological belief in white supremacy, rather than an authoritarian “different-ism” that manifests as racism at times but as distinct (if psychologically similar) intolerances at other times. The distinction matters regardless of whether one wants to fight the racist manifestations of authoritarianism or the full range of intolerances.
Comments
As I suspect you might imagine, I find this a brilliant essay. I think he's really onto something here, and it applies globally. Thank you, I might have passed on it if you hadn't pointed it out.
by artappraiser on Mon, 08/12/2019 - 9:46pm
It really explains what I've been seeing in both my reading and real life. I visit my parents at their blue collar retirement village. Middle class not rich but very well to do with their good pensions, savings, and SS. I hang with the group but don't argue politics or anything really. I'm just there to visit mom, don't want to create waves. There is a kinda low level racism, the nuanced kind, the kind you have to really think about to grasp. Never anything overt or obvious. They would be horrified if an actual white supremacist sat down and started to talk. I don't think they're really racist either. Yes there is a fringe group of actual white supremacist out there but this black white dichotomy that rmrd pushes just doesn't fit the majority of people anymore. Most have grown beyond it.
by ocean-kat on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 1:28am
The people you describe will vote for Trump, a white nationalist, at the end of the day. People who vote Trump will be judged by their action, not their words.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 9:43pm
The point of this thread is an attempt to understand this large group of people. That's different and separate from how we may judge them. But attempting to understand anything has never been something that interests you.
by ocean-kat on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 9:48pm
Don’t we know that cultural anxiety left them at risk to fall in with an authoritarian?
In order to change things, don’t we need a different leadership?
We need to identify Democrats and Independents who will vote out Republicans in 2020.
Breaking the grip of the authoritarian is a much longer process.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 10:01pm
This article and this thread isn't about how to defeat republicans in 2020. There are other subjects that some of the people here are interested in learning about and discussing. I realize it's the only subject you're interested in learning or discussing but you're not the only one here.
by ocean-kat on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 10:17pm
We are not in a vacuum. The soul of the country is at stake. Perhaps you simply don’t care.
The linked article directly addresses how to overcome authoritarians politically.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:21am
Perhaps you simply don’t care
You can just go fuck yourself.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:30am
You are able to humanize the Trump voters. You can identify with them despite the fact that they vote for a white nationalist with allows the Russians to hack our elections. There can be a different response if a black person identifies with Louis Farrakhan, for example.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 7:34am
You have no idea what I can do. You don't pay any attention to what any one writes here so how could you possibly know what any of us think. I don't identify with anyone. Not on dagblog, not in the place I live, not in my parents retirement community. I'm nearly completely alone. You have an agenda and you use us as mere foils to spread it. You assume that I was talking about Trump voters when I presented no evidence in my post. Simply because attacking them as Trump voters served your agenda. In fact I know some of them voted for Hillary because they told me. Some told me they don't like Trump. You are wrong. You don't think you pontificate. You come on every thread no matter what the subject and dump the same shit. The same shit even on threads where it is clearly off topic. And you expect us to smile when you do it. Not going to happen. You can just go fuck yourself.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 8:12am
You are ranting. Here is a take on the modern GOP from the NYT.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/13/opinion/vichy-republican-trump.html
Republicans are responsible for their actions.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 8:17am
When you have nothing to say you post long excerpts from random articles. First because your reading comprehension is so low you don't really understand what people are posting. Second because you don't care what people post unless it can be manipulated to serve your agenda. Third because you must win and to you that means having the last word. You're like a child, emotionally and intellectually.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 8:24am
I am responding directly to your posts. You and your groupies respond with no sense and ridicule.
You asked if I thought your nonsense about the email guy should have been fired, I gave you the response from Roxane Gay. You seem to count that as random snippets.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 11:45am
He just self-described elsewhere on this site as an extreme loner and introvert. He disagrees with others on this site often, and they with him. It's you that seems to be looking for "groupies" and you often sound angry about not getting them.
by artappraiser on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:43pm
You are ranting.
No he is not, you are.
Republicans are responsible for their actions
Someone said they weren't? Someone claimed anyone is not responsible for their actions? This thread is about Republicans and about responsibility for actions?
It might help get better reaction if you offered what the strawman actually said (who you revealed the other day, is probably someone you work with,) the person or people you are ranting about, what they actually said to make you want to rant about this.
Edit to add: it seems almost if in your hunting and picking of news articles, you look for items that are a retort to someone else who is not on this site, a strawman. It comforts you to find an article that verifies what you would like to say to that person. But that person is not here and has nothing to do with us. And the other members here don't want to stand in for that person. No do we want to give megadittos about something we weren't talking about.
by artappraiser on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:47pm
There can be a different response if a black person identifies with Louis Farrakhan, for example.
Certainly not here. Because that group could easily be labeled as having the authoritarian “different-ism” that manifests as racism that Friedersdorf is addressing in his essay. This would actually be a very interesting point of nuance to bring to a discussion of his essay.
by artappraiser on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:40pm
But we are basically in a vacuum: we are at little Dagblog, a small group of people where we know each other via writing under pseudonyms, and chat and discuss stuff away from the sturm and drang, bots and fury, political activism and spin and hate speech of Twitter and Facebook and big political activist sites. I can't speak for other members, but I come here to get away from that.
It is delusional to think the soul of the country will be saved by something that is said on Dagblog.
by artappraiser on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 3:38am
Heretic!
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 6:30am
By the way, I don't know how every one of the people on the retirement village will vote but I know some will vote for the democrat and some will vote for Trump. But I'm not interested in discussing this side issue that isn't addressed by this article in this thread.
by ocean-kat on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 10:30pm
I don’t think Democratic candidates miss the connection between racism and authoritarianism
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/07/democrats-have-found-their-battle-cry/593881/
Elizabeth Warren for one
https://www.newsweek.com/warren-trump-embraces-dictators-threatens-democracy-1237872
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 08/12/2019 - 11:24pm
I reread your comment - pasting 2 quotes - and don't see where they support the connection between authoritarianism and racism. They more or less say "Trump's a nasty piece of work", undemocratic and authoritarian, which I think we all know.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 2:04am
Interesting on Ibram Kendi's radically outside-the-box view on racism:
Sennah also throws in his own opinion here, which is also interesting:
by artappraiser on Tue, 08/13/2019 - 12:38pm
A case of mistaken "identity":
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-fox-news-conservative-parano...
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 08/14/2019 - 1:50pm