MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
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From the Readers
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From the Dagbloggers
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Hits of the Day
Syria: Trump declares victory & withdrawal; "White House" adds the fine print disclaimers as usual
By artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 3:52pm |The fans will of course think we've withdrawn and all the troops will be relocated to the border wall which has already started
[....] The White House confirmed in a statement that the administration has "started returning United States troops home" but emphasized that coalition efforts in Syria would continue. It also reiterated Trump's claim that "the United States has defeated the territorial caliphate." [....]
URL:
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/422040-trump-signals-us-withdrawal-from-syria
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Comments
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:23pm
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:36pm
Whether true or not, this is the type of speculation he's gonna get:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:24pm
hmmm, maybe, you never can know for sure who is directing what:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:32pm
Schumer, Brown and Menendez been busy with the Deripaska thing:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 6:31pm
I think "well said"
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:35pm
Sen. Graham already thinking how to manipulate Trump on this:
Bolton Sept. 24 @ WaPO: Bolton: U.S. forces will stay in Syria until Iran and its proxies depart
and Pentagon countered that it was there solely to defeat the Islamlic State
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:30pm
Clarification from Sen. Graham about northeastern Syria
I say: what a mess Trump makes for everyone with his willingness to just babble anything off the top of his head. Just put Americans in danger. The incompetence is the main thing, always. As the man Rick Wilson says Everything Trump Touches Dies
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:43pm
Best analysis I've seen so far, from a BBC editor:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:50pm
back up for what Sobel is saying:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 4:53pm
Julian Borger on what "senior administration official" said to him:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 5:49pm
Just asking for the Kurds, Arabs, Syriac Christians & Yezedis:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 5:52pm
NPR reporter: US getting out of way where Turkey is about to invade to attack the Kurds?!!
earlier she tweeted this:
This is her beat: International Correspondent for NPR, covering Syria, Lebanon and more. Formerly at the Daily Telegraph
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 7:13pm
Sen. Rubio:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 5:43pm
Sen. Sasse:
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 5:47pm
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 5:53pm
Senators Reed, Gardner. Shaheen,
I've seen enough
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 6:13pm
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 6:34pm
This is the question. Everything Trump does is disruptive and chaotic. Decisions are made spur of the moment seemingly on a whim without any consultation of or planning with relevant parties. A case can be made to withdraw. People on the left like Lulu or libertarians like Rand Paul and isolationists would surely make that case. But even if one supports withdrawal it's hard not to see this as rash and harmful to our allies in the region such as the Kurds. Such fecklessness will leave the US less trusted as a partner and harm us in the long term.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 7:33pm
I'll be glad if people don't trust America to wage war. Making war harms us far more than not making war. We need to either abolish the U.S. military or reduce it to a hundred thousand or so(enough to take part in an occasional peacekeeping mission, but not enough to wage war).
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 2:19am
America has started unprovoked and unwarranted wars. But the US isn't uniquely evil in the world. We're just uniquely strong. The US doesn't start or even provoke every single war that happens in the world. Turkey has the largest army in the Middle East and it wants to deal with what it sees as it's Kurdish problem with extreme prejudice. The only thing that might stop it is the US protecting our Kurdish friends and ally. What country will trust us to help defend them from aggression if we abandon the Kurds? Why would aggressive nations hesitate to attack other nations if they believe the US will not honor it's promises to defend and protect them? War won't end if the US withdraws it's military power from the world. It's more likely to increase as other nations fell free to wage war in the vacuum of power our withdrawal leaves behind.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 2:58am
We didn't protect the Kurds from the Turks; we gave the Turks the weapons with which they killed and tormented the Kurds. Washington would never fight our Turkish ally for the sake of the Kurds. If we have done anything to restrain the Turks, it hasn't been through the threat of war. I don't know if other nations would be more inclined to make war if the United States were a peaceful state. Even if they were, I doubt it would be any worse than having the current situation, where we have the United States and her allies making war everywhere. Turkey's war against the Kurds might have ended if we had cut off arms to Turkey, and the U.S. sponsored war in Yemen is one of the worst catastrophes around. The U.S honored it's promise to defend Kuwait and the result was a lot of corpses instead of the negotiated Iraqi withdrawal that we could have had. The Israeli conquests and war crimes that you falsely accused me of supporting would have been harder to pull off without American backing. A pacifist America might set an example to the rest of the world and make some countries more willing to try non-violence.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 7:06am
"I don't know if other nations would be more inclined to make war if the United States were a peaceful state. Even if they were, I doubt it would be any worse than having the current situation, where we have the United States and her allies making war everywhere. " - waddafu? wake up, dude. no, we're not fucking "making war everywhere" - Google it - there's very little war anywhere these days - the number of conflicts is handful in the middle east + a bit in Ukraine, and the numbers killed are much lower than formerly. And no, the US didn't lock up 1 million Uighurs like the Chinese, nor cleanse Cambodia of 1 million+ civilians in gulags, nor starve to death 8 million Ukrainians in the Holodomor, nor hack to death a half million ethnic rivals with machetes in a few days, or form gangs to run around the Congo countryside raping millions of women as collateral or wage a trench warfare for nearly 10 years like the Iranians & Iraqis, killing a million on each side.
Look at the fucking numbers - they're all on the Google - and quit spouting bullshit. America being pacifist or having a standing army had nothing to do with Hutus hacking apart Tutsis or Russia invading Afghanistan or Ethiopia fighting Eritrea for access to the sea or Northern Irish bombing each other or South Africans locking of blacks and keeping them oppressed for the last century, or the Indonesians kicking the Communists out & killing a million people.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 11:08am
I don't see what the Rwandan genocide, the Ukraine famine, or the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan have to do with what we're talking about. I'm talking about American violence. I wasn't being literal when I said "everywhere", but we have been making war in Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, and (by proxy) Yemen. We actually did have something to do with the killing Indonesians have done. During the 1965 massacre of Communists the CIA provided the Indonesian army with lists of Communists, and we were giving them arms when they slaughtered the East Timorese.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:13pm
"I don't see what..." - uh, well, you said something dumb like "A pacifist America might set an example to the rest of the world and make some countries more willing to try non-violence."
Like which countries - Bumfuckistan? Name a single one that might be influenced to tone down orgies of violence by us going more hippie. Saudi Arabia specifically catered a more violent US regime to assist its Yemen & Qatar plans. Russia with Syria are using chemical weapons & mass cluster bombs on civilians as they push us out of the picture, while their pissed offness with Hillary & Obama was over peaceful election protests in Russia & the idea that Ukraine might want to join the EU & end their puppet regime. China's been locking up people since before it invaded Tibet & Xinjiang in the 50's. Turkey's been locking up dissidents in the 10's of thousands.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:25pm
, I think Britain and France,Turkey, Israel and the Palestinians might be inspired by America going hippie. I can't prove it, of course. It's possible, though perhaps not likely, that Russians would think about their belligerent ways if America set an example.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:54pm
geez you've disappointed me today. 1) France left 100,000+ dead on their way out of Algeria, and stuck us with cleaning up their Indochina mess. 2) Turkey was close to EU access when Erdogan jumped the shark, turned out the police & shut down all the "dissidents". 3) Britain's been pretty hippie. 4) Israel's been paying off our politicians so that Israel can refuse to reform and stick with the intolerable status quo. 5) Russia? seriously? we've been looking for improvement for what, 90 years?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 6:29pm
I didn't say these countries were peace loving, did I? I said that if we were peace loving that might inspire them to try new ways themselves. There have been improvements in Russia. There was deStalinization in 1956, and I'd rate even Putin's Russia as preferable to the Soviet Union. Perhaps the country can change again. The British are hardly peaceniks; they've fought wars in Kosovo, Iraq, Syria, and Libya--the last one was said to have been more Cameron's idea than Obama's.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 7:26pm
It's difficult to judge whether Aaron is just the victim of a low resolution postmodern pseudo-education or an activist neo-Marxist revisionist fellow-traveler. Whichever is the case the simplistic view of world history and human nature displayed in his comments and corrective nostrums requires a rereading and better understanding of 20th century history and a modern look at the story of Cain and Abel.
Your EU-centric view of Erdogan's Turkey and their roundup and prosecution of the Gulenist infestation that nearly destroyed their democracy seems to show you believe the Turks would be better served by that cult of personality ruling their lives and minds. Turkey still needs and wants the economic benefits of free trade with Europe. Fortunately the failed coup and the necessary actions taken by Erdogan in its aftermath has saved them from falling into the black hole that becoming part of the degenerate EU would have inflicted on them.
by Peter (not verified) on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 1:57pm
Save me, Peter - the EU is holding me captive, repressing me, stealing my soul... all that cheap healthcare and 5 weeks vacation has made me weak, infected my brain like syphilis.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 8:10pm
Peter, you are a fraud. When you forgot that Republicans had control of mid-western states, you ranted about how terrible they were because of Liberal government. Once you were told that they were in Republican hands, you praise their economic prowess. Like anyone who supports Trump, you have no real core except to do what you think a Trump would do. You confront that Conservatives are a joke who only appeal to dim- witted people. If Trump realizes he needs the EU and sings their praises, you will join in the choir.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 10:09pm
I don't recall ever accusing you of supporting Israeli conquests or war crimes. I certainly didn't do it in this thread. One can't replay multiple versions of history to see how things might have played out. You can claim we could have had a negotiated Iraqi withdrawal from Kuwait. I don't see any possibility that could have happened. It always amazes me how often people have such an optimistic view of human nature that they see negotiated settlements without war or the threat of war every where. From a negotiated end to slavery with out an American Civil War to a negotiated peace with Japan before Pearl Harbor to a negotiated withdrawal from Kuwait and nearly every war in between. One can never know but I harbor serious doubts. Chamberlain's negotiated peace with Germany was widely supported by most European leaders and the public of most nations including the US. How did that work out in the end?
It's not always necessary to fight wars to defend allies. Sometimes the mere presence of troops or the belief that America would respond is enough to forestall military aggression. I think it's highly unlikely Putin and Iran are praising Trump's Syria withdrawal because they want to follow suit and withdraw also. I think they're happy because it will give them free reign to pursue their national interests in Syria.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 1:06pm
I'll have to jog your memory. "A fairly large number of the Jewish people stole a huge amount of Palestine, then in a series of war crimes stole bits and pieces more for the next 70 years...Aaron wants to claim that is moral".
It's still in the comments for my post from last May if you want to look it up.
Saddam made two offers to withdraw, and the second one was quite good. It went almost completely unreported. Unfortunately I couldn't post the link, but the Newsday article is available through note 82 of the wikipedia entry on the Gulf War. But Mr. Bush wanted to have a war.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:45pm
You'll have to post a link.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 6:30pm
http://dagblog.com/reader-blogs/reflections-somewhat-belated-israels-70t...
search for "Europe and America".
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 6:55pm
I don't remember every word I've written here in the last several years. PP supplied a link and I skimmed the thread. I stand by the things I posted. I don't know what it has to do with the topic on this thread.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 11:41pm
Well, you said you didn't remember saying it, so now you can see that you did.
by Aaron Carine on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 7:34am
What's your point? Three months from now I'll forget I said it again.
by ocean-kat on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 7:51am
My point is that you slandered me. You forgot it, but I didn't.
by Aaron Carine on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 9:43am
I didn't slander you. We had a difference of opinion. Are you seriously trying to make me feel guilty? I'm fine with the things I've posted and feel no need to retract anything.Don't be such a little baby.
by ocean-kat on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 12:59pm
You said you didn't remember accusing me of supporting Israeli conquests and war crimes. Well, you did. Peracles helpfully provided the link. Babies like me don't like people telling lies about us(or others). I'm also baffled by your level of reading comprehension, since almost the first thing I wrote was "what Jews did to Arabs in 1948 was very bad, indeed", but you still made the accusation. It's not just about my feelings, it's about the need for honest debate, which we don't have when people misrepresent what their opponents are saying.
by Aaron Carine on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 6:49pm
You brought up some bullshit point that has nothing to do with the discussion that turns out to be about some candy assed butt hurt you've been clinging to for eight months. I can't remember nasty shit Peter posted last month and you've been nursing this grudge over a disagreement for eight months. Grow up! Or don't, you can always post me and cry about it in eight months when I've forgotten it again. I'll care about your whining just as much then as I do now as I did eight months ago.
by ocean-kat on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 7:19pm
The hell with it, you're incapable of just admitting you were wrong, so the hell with it.
by Aaron Carine on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 7:28pm
I'm quite capable of admitting I'm wrong. I've done it several times here. Most recently I've admitted that I was wrong in discounting how relevant Hillary hate was to a significant number of voters.
by ocean-kat on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 8:09pm
That's fucking absurd. Russia-& Chinese-backed North Koreans overwhelmed the South despite a negotiated truce and division, pushing the southern troops back to a toe-hold on the peninsula of say 50 square miles. Without the US, all of the Korean peninsula would be in the same state as the grossly retrograde North Korea 65 years later.
The Russians had no trouble invading Afghanistan looking for a warm-water port in the 70's while the US armed the rebels (without invading). The Russians were threatening Western Europe up to 1989 when the Iron Curtain self-destructed with the help of continued US pressure. Russia is still threatening Western Europe's gas supplies to freeze it out. Every 2-3 years.
The US *avoided* military action in Ukraine and over Crimea. If you look at the world's wars, they're greatly reduced everywhere except the Middle East, and that's more the fault of radical Islamists and the machinations of Russia in stirring up the region & trying to create proxy partners in Syria.
Anyway, surprised at your pretty feeble offering here. A lot of energy goes into ensuring world peace, including facing down dangerous characters who'd just as soon occupy as negotiate peacefully (see China in the Spratleys/South "China" Sea wih their new "islands" made of poured concrete; see Russia occupying Crimea and supporting Donbas revolt while pretending they have no troops in the region, ignoring photo evidence; see Saudis threats on Qatar besides holding its own princes for ransom...). Yes, we are the peace keepers - European Union peace and stability is because of *us*.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 3:47am
I doubt the Korean War was worth it , since 1) it cost the lives of two million people, about half of them civilians(our boys bombed the hell out of the civilian population, besides No Gun Ri). 2) the war could have ended after the North Korean invasion was repelled. Instead we tried to conquer North Korea and caused the war to drag on for another 33 months.
The United States protected Western Europe from a Soviet invasion, but that was in the past. I don't think Putin wants to conquer Europe. There has been a reduction in war, but I don't think it is because of American belligerence. I'm rather surprised that you referenced Saudi Arabia as proof of the need for the American military. Washington--the "peace keeper"--has subsidized the horrific Saudi war in Yemen
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 7:32am
I'm certain Mao and Kim would have loved your commie revisionist history version of the Korean conflict but the people of Korea might take exception with your measure of their worth. There were two invasions in the Korean conflict, first when NK invaded SK and then when 800,000 PLA forces invaded to assist the defeated NK forces to retake the whole country.
Truman had disarmed the US military after WW2 but fortunately the Marines had resisted and maintained their armaments and readiness for action. Under the UN mandate the Marines pulled off one of the greatest tactical maneuverers in military history, the Inchon landing flanked the NK invasion force and broke their supply lines. The invaders quickly ran out of munitions and supplies then broke and ran for the North. They only stopped along the way to murder as many educated Koreans as possible who might interfere with their future utopian plans.
The NK communists reunited Korea, for a short time, so when the UN forces gave chase they didn't invade but moved to destroy the commies in an internal Korean conflict. The PLA forces did then invade Korea when the UN forces reached the Yalu and pushed the UN forces back to what became the DMZ.
The reason the war dragged on for years after this redividing of Korea was that the North Koreans refused to negotiate on one point. They demanded that all POW's held in the south be forced to return to the North when many of them were resisting being returned to their utopian masters.
by Peter (not verified) on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 1:36pm
Ok, this is peculiar, Peter & me in total agreement - is the apocalypse that close?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 2:14pm
There wouldn't have been a need for negotiations if we had stopped after repelling the North Korean invasion. It would have been better--although still bad-- to hand over the POWs than have a gazillion deaths. This is one of those debates that can go on forever, so I'll give you the last word.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:21pm
Your logic is wanting - without an armistice, there would be no halt in hostilities - negotiations continued for 2 years while both sides sought to gain an advantage. Since North Korea broke the agreed border in 1950 and almost drove the South into the sea at Pusan, I don't get what a unilateral halt would have done except to encourage the North & by then both Chinese & Soviet backing that the UN (US) was weak and could be exploited again. It's not like the Vietnamese gave up hope in a half decade of waiting after the Tet Offensive to finally take Saigon.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 8:35am
I said I'd give them the last word, and I'll stand by that.
by Aaron Carine on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 11:25am
Correlation is not an adequate measure of causality. On the other hand, that quality often shows up in adequate explanations of what is happening.
The GOP just agreed to put the kibosh upon the Saudis. There are many fighters in Syria from Saudi Arabia. Most of them oppose the regime. So, if you were a person only interested in transactions to attain a particular result, maybe this move is a push back against condemning the Saudis.
by moat on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 8:10pm
There are sooo many possible explanations. Really hits home how it must have been like living in a true monarchy in the olden days. The saving grace for 17th/18th century colonists, they would have to wait months to know about change in policy in that wacky head of the king or queen, maybe that was the main idea about leaving the homeland? Damn that S.F.B. Morse, ruined everything.
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 9:01pm
NYT Editorial board: On Syria, It’s Trump vs. the Trump Administration
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 9:05pm
I found interesting: Laura Rozen, after todays news, then went over 2 yrs. of her notes and emails on topic, and ponders in a twitter thread that Trump and Obama basically have the same Syria policy, and that Trump doesn't really care much about Iran at all but only about Obama getting appreciation for Iran nuke deal.
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 9:15pm
more along the lines of: for Trump, anything about Iran is really just about Obama and any other domestic enemies of Trump, as is convenient:
AP FACT CHECK: Trump revisits old fictions about Iran money
By CALVIN WOODWARD yesterday
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 1:28am
there was this bad news yesterday (this is not to suggest Trump reads briefing papers! but some little bird on the phone could have complained things were going nowhere?)
Russia, Turkey, Iran fail in push for new Syrian constitution
@ AlJazeera.com, 20 hrs. ago
Stakeholders fail to agree on the makeup of a Syrian constitutional committee amid calls to convene next year.
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 9:29pm
from 2 days ago about an Erdogan/Trump phone call on Friday:
Erdogan: Positive answers in call with Trump, but says Turkey could act against US-backed Syrian Kurds ‘anytime’
By: The Associated Press via MilitaryTimes.com
by artappraiser on Wed, 12/19/2018 - 9:33pm
by artappraiser on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 5:39am
We fought back against ISIS with a painful block-by-block effort from a multi-state coalition, one of the most impressive military forays we've engaged in, freeing large amounts of Iraqi territory. No apologies from this liberal. Leaving defenseless people to brutal conditions is not a progressive value.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 6:23am
The war was a brutal condition. We killed 7000 civilians, besides others killed by the Russians and Iraqi forces. I'll concede that the Abadi government is a lot better than ISIS, but it wasn't worth war to keep Assad from being replaced by Baghadi, they are both awful.
by Aaron Carine on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 7:19am
In a 2nd post you complain we didn't defend Kurds, and then when we fight a long drawn out battle to free a defenseless population, you blithely say "it wasn't worth war". Well, no, they're free now, most survived. But thanks for playing. And yes, we might have prevented Putin's entrenchment in Syria with a bit more early effort, but that Hillary, she's just too much a hawk cuz she tried to/did stop a threatened bloodbath in Benghazi. How many sides can we play the peace card? "It's Okay If You're Not American"?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 1:41pm
Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL), an Air Force vet who flew missions in Afghanistan and Iraq, is on the House Comittee on Foreign Affairs, and wears a bracelet of a "buddy" who died "fighting ISIS" in Iraq this year, slams Trump on withdrawal on all 3 cable news networks:
on CNN
GOP lawmaker condemns Trump: I'm speechless
Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) reacts to President Donald Trump's announcement that he has ordered staff to execute the "full" and "rapid" withdrawal of US military from Syria
again on CNN AC360, which is re-played and written up @ Breitbart as
GOP Rep. Kinzinger: Afghanistan Drawdown Will Lead To ‘Major Consequences’
on MSNBC to Andrea Mitchell
Rep. Kinzinger on Trump's Syria video: 'It was really kind of tacky"
again on MSNBC-Morning Joe:
Air Force vet, congressman calls withdrawal a bad decision
and on Fox which is re-played and written up by Real Clear Politics as
Rep. Adam Kinzinger: "I Implore The President To Reconsider" Withdrawal From Syria
I think: very interesting, taking McCain's place? Certainly gives off something similar.
How can Trump even attack this young guy without hurting himself, though? We'll see.
by artappraiser on Thu, 12/20/2018 - 11:56pm
becoming increasingly clear that Syria is the reason that Mattis resigned today, the straw that broke the camel's back:
Repeating what I just posted on Mattis resignation thread, but this is not the only place I've read this, and further, I heard it on NPR too.
by artappraiser on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 12:35am
David Ignatius' column @ WaPo published Weds. night: Trump’s abrupt decision to pull American troops from Syria is riskier than it looks is worth the time, here's the first third of it for a taste:
by artappraiser on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 1:37am
Victoria Nuland: In a single tweet, Trump destroys U.S. policy in the Middle East
guest op-ed @ WashingtonPost.com, Dec. 19
(A reminder of her chops to opine: worked under both Bush and Obama)
by artappraiser on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 3:40am
Ah yes, that Vicky once said "Fuck the EU" and then the liberals pretended that $5 billion in total Ukraine aid over 10 years for all sorts of help was a single regime-change bucket piured in. The power of propaganda and repeated lies - and here we are, finally (or half finally, as I'm sure another awful foreign polucy disaster will ensue)
by PeraclesPlease on Sat, 12/22/2018 - 2:06am
by artappraiser on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 11:29pm
P.S. Lots of juicy chatter about Trumpco's fandom of Erdogan over at the Daily Mail; cavaet emptor:
by artappraiser on Fri, 12/21/2018 - 11:40pm
More White House insider stuff
by artappraiser on Sat, 12/22/2018 - 12:11am
More on the Erdogan call @ WaPo, with astounding quote:
by artappraiser on Sat, 12/22/2018 - 1:45am
Iran hawks @ The Atlantic today say
Trump Delivers a Victory to Iran
The president’s decision to withdraw U.S. forces from Syria has ruined the administration’s efforts to contain the Islamic republic.
By Reuel Marc Gerecht Senior fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies and Mark Dubowitz Chief executive officer for the Foundation for Defense of Democracies
including that
and Bibi is more than unhappy:
War of words escalates, Israel PM Netanyahu calls Erdogan ‘anti-Semitic dictator’
Speaking in Istanbul Sunday, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan called Netanyahu an oppressor who commits "state terror".
@ AP Dec. 23
But he's got other problems to distract him today:
by artappraiser on Mon, 12/24/2018 - 12:54pm
Now I'm torn - anything that makes Bibi unhappy usually gives me a chuckle (though I admit that if that makes Lieberman happy I should likely be chagrined - call it "the asshole you know vs the asshole you don't").
As for Iran, we`ve been playing our weirdly Israel-inspired game of bluff and deception for several decades, and it continues to stink. I`m not privy to all the intelligence, but nothing has ever seemed that Iran was so close to nuclear weapons as these neocons like us to believe, and the pissing match & chicanery over money owed Iran since 1979 turned rather disgusting and continues with Trump`s lies.
Even though I don`t like Iran`s fundamentalist system and Khomeini was more a bastard than most people realize, I`m hard-pressed to believe Reagan's actions to support Iraq in the war Hussein initiated gives us moral superiority (nor does the CIA helping overthrow Mossadegh in the 50's), and forever role Iran has played in the region - which one would think they might have a right to, since everyone else plays one - I don't see it as being revolutionary as much as holding together status quo, including support for Hezbollah in Lebanon.
Anyway, I wish we would stop using Iran as our straw man and virtual punching bag, even though better for them in this position than being occupied like Afghanistan & Iraq.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 12/26/2018 - 8:10am