Coming February 6, 2024 . . .
MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
Pre-order at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop
Coming February 6, 2024 . . . MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE by Michael Wolraich Pre-order at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop |
..it should be intuitive that educational attainment is a lower priority for parents who haven’t gotten a higher education themselves.... People who don’t have a higher education resent the hell out of the fact that their kids will need one. What they’d wish for... is that their kids could practice the trades and professions they practiced and have the same standard of living. They don’t want their kids to leave home for a college education if that means they’ll come to question their values and never come back.
Comments
Booman's post was interesting, I am mainly commenting to remind myself to look for the "continued" of a Washington Monthy article tomorrow. As was the analytic article on polls that he linked to.
Though I don't know if I agree with your takeaway from it that this type doesn't want their kids to go to college. I would lean the other way, that most of them would like to see that, that only a few want their kids to have their life.
by artappraiser on Wed, 05/31/2017 - 3:45pm
All "damned if you don't, damned if you do".My father quit the party over the great taxcut approach where forget education, suddenly the American Dream became not doing better than your parents but simply paying nothing in taxes. All a shifting goalpost as well.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 05/31/2017 - 4:23pm
Well I have been recently influenced on this front having just read this carefully and in full:
There's not a one addict's story mentioned in that article that wouldn't be the type to want their kids to get the fuck out of there by having the hope of going to college while still in high school and actually going thereafter. They have a severe hope problem there, and lots of cheap heroin around. Hope is what the kids need not to start the cycle like their parents did and their parents would love not to see that happen. There's some incredible.people trying to help the (huge) already addicted population, but it's a real tough game after they've started using. It's clear that kids got to see a road out at junior high stage. As users abound and so does heroin (nobody can afford all the oxycontin the drug cos. sent there, the narco industry filled the need right away.) There's even the main example of one history where the sibs that could go to college got out and never used, but the one who got hooked didn't, and still wishes the world for his kids.
Edit to add: I read it for other reasons, being interested in the recent loosening of availability of anti-overdose drugs like narcon, for very personal reasons I'd rather not get into. But there was an interesting phenomenon in the article on that whole thing: a significant subset of the culture there gets mad that narcon is so available, they think "let them die," that those who are so weak as to be scummy addicts don't deserve to live. So there is the very Protestant work ethic belief, the whole "bootstraps" thing, and the "you're sinful, gotta pay" that might make some GOP narratives attractive.
by artappraiser on Wed, 05/31/2017 - 7:49pm
I am very interested in how he thinks Democrats can reach these voters. The Luddites lost the battle. I don't see a message from Democrats that will appeal to this subset of voters. I await the new article.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 05/31/2017 - 7:24pm
The new piece is here. The money quote:
While I agree with BooMan/Longman's view that consolidation of corporate power has devastated poor, working, and middle-class communities, I think his solution is slightly over-thought. Instead of concentrating attacks on monopolies, I urge the Democrats to focus on good job creation by calling for 1) a repeal of all the "free" trade pacts, 2) single-payer government-provided health care, and by working much more closely with unions.
More from BooMan/Longman:
"The lesson for Democrats may be that they can get away with being pro-choice in an anti-choice district, and pro-climate in a coal-extraction economy, but only if their economic message kicks the shit out of the message coming from the other side."
Now, this is a sentiment with which I agree wholeheartedly. Indeed, I've been saying exactly the same thing for quite some time. See, e.g., http://dagblog.com/reader-blogs/why-bernie-matters-22401 (comment) ( "[a]s I've noted elsewhere, Democrats have to be better - perhaps much better - than Republicans on economic issues to win elections since Republicans have the advantage of being much freer to appeal to people's worst instincts - racism, sexism, homophobia, xenophobia."
by HSG on Thu, 06/01/2017 - 11:32am
From a Booman commenter on what the Dems need first to promote that economic message:
by NCD on Thu, 06/01/2017 - 12:29pm
You may be correct. After the Trump disaster, there have been articles about Oprah Winfrey or the Rock running for President. Those with real political experience need not apply.
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 06/01/2017 - 2:29pm
I don't think that what works for republicans will work for democrats. While a personality might do better in the general the democratic base looks at policy and an Oprah or the Rock wouldn't make it through the primary. That's why we so often push forward policy wonks like Hillary or Dukakis who lack charisma on the stump.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 06/01/2017 - 1:57pm
College? Army's the way for flyover country. Not "free" - they pay you!!! Lesson - single solutions don't fly.
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 3:35am
Great article with incredibly striking map illustration! Good lord, looking at that map, one can almost understand Trump's claims and attitudes about the election. It's an overwhelming sea of red framed by a skinny border of blue, where not coincidentally all those illegals manage to slip in. It presents a picture like this: what are the blue people thinking that they can be in charge of this country?
Good point to bring up the military because even before it offered a college education, service in same has traditionally filled the function of giving a young aimless guy same sense of "purpose" (not a job but a sense of purpose and meaning) is in all the millenial cultural chatter. (Ask ISIS, they surely know this!) And yes, this little cultural p.o.v. about the military does often extend to minority cultures! Of late probably even more so than rural whites.
So then we have the rest of the blues being not very gung ho on military service, since Vietnam, and I am one who is with them there. Because to me, when those kids sign up, chances are they might come home in body bags. Not to mention what it does to some of them in giving them "a sense of purpose." But then I'm a child of a man who hated being drafted for WWII. Grateful that some want to volunteer just so others don't have to be drated. It's the whole cannon fodder thing, just doesn't feel right, feel guilty that the uneducated are being used as cannon fodder. So I try to respect others views of military service as being the right thing for some but I just don't want to produce more cannon fodder nor do I want there to be more fathers around who are trained in the Great Santini type authoritarian masculine role.
Inserting a reminder here about how often Trump has harped on taking care of vets. And how Michele Obama, made "military families" a favorite issue. And how Barack was not tarred with the draft dodger, doesn't-know-how-to-salute thing that Bill Clinton was.
Here's the thing that just popped into my head. When blues watch Star Trek, they don't think "cannon fodder", not even me.
When reds see Peace Corps they see lily livered liberal kid trying to insert themselves in cultures where they don't belong where it's none of our business, or when reds (or blue minorities) see Teach for America they see elite white blues coming into their hood to indoctrinate their kids.
How can there be "Star Trek" government service for the 21st century where a majority don't find it disagreeable? Certainly it fits the whole "sense of purpose" thing.
Comes to mind, my own draft-hating military-hating dad served a stint in the Merchant Marine after being drafted at the end of WWII, and before going to college on the G.I.Bill. He hated the Army and did the Merchant Marine to avoid being re-drafted for Korea. He loved being in the Merchant Marine, it filled his desire to get away and "see the world" like sitting doing guard duty in occupied Japan didn't. And he wasn't a rural boy, he was a townie.
by artappraiser on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 8:52am
Also comes to mind with the news in London, that we've increasingly got lone wolf terrorism as a problem for the forseeable future, not to mention the epidemic of people with guns (lets add knives or bombs here to avoid getting into the guns issue totally) "going postal." Is there some way to make a sort "peace corps" service out of law enforcement, more like military service, without us becoming East Germany? Whatever most local communities are doing now in training and hiring of police forces including adding minorities, it ain't working with the "black lives matter" groups.And some might disagree but I believe that it doesn't work with a lot of white rural working class as well, they hate and fear "the cops" just as much. Is there some way to make police/law enforcement nationwide looked upon as well as someone in military uniform is looked upon? Doing this right would like kill three or four birds with one stone. The whole country needs to defeat gangs giving young people a sense of community and purpose, needs to lessen the "famous for 15 minutes" factor of lone wolf "terrorism" whether ideological or just "going postal", whole country wants "sense of purpose" work but the law enforcement in this country is still, even after all the "hero" first responder thing of 9/11, looked down upon as authoritarian. Why is it? EMT's and firemen don't have this problem.
by artappraiser on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 9:12am
1) firemen don't tase or abuse/rape teenagers or toss people in back of a van unsecured for a "joy ride". Abuse of authority has predictable results.
2) guy I was talking to on the train got sent to New Zealand to train kids in Outward Bound-like activities for his 1-2 year service obligation. Pretty cool.
3) military service in old Yugoslavia was a glue that biund kids from 8 different regions. Except the Kosovars - even there they were iutsiders.
4) Percent of Americans seeing combat since 1974 is relatively much smaller compared to before, so the Clinton Draft Dodger thing is no longer such a known affront - there's no draft. So they find other ways to build resentment.
But yeah, liberals think college is the sine quo non. (sp?). Middle earthers have the early dead-end job or military as competing destinies/narratives after high school. How did we miss the army bit?
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 9:29am
Re: train kids in Outward Bound
I've always noted with interest that the NYTimes editorial board has strongly promoted the "Fresh Air Fund" as a charity for decades, their promotion of it this year is here. Old organization, sends poor urban kids out to stay with volunteer rural families for "summer vacation" From reading them on it for years when I used to subscribe to the print edition, they really believe it helps society at large, not just poor kids.
by artappraiser on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 9:45am
Peracles... Recall my old TPM Cafe post?
You had left a comment on it back in March 2013 here in the Dag archives...
~OGD~
by oldenGoldenDecoy on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 9:32am
I recall after re-reading. My God, how many finger strokes ago...
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 10:02am
Peracles... I have no idea of the finger strokes...
What amazes me is that I was even able to recall the post and actually find it here in the archives.
At my advanced stage of age related memory degradation I can't recall what I ate this morning.
~OGD~
by oldenGoldenDecoy on Mon, 06/05/2017 - 6:56pm
Ah, but you *might* remember some newscast the morning of June 14, 1953... the paradox of memory and old age. There was something that with older folks, it's sometimes more successful to throw a nostalgia party based on decades-old setting than to set it up in a current milieu where they largely forget - the older stuff imprints harder for some reason.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 06/05/2017 - 7:24pm
Also, I think this is a great quote from your Hullabaloo link, it speaks volumes about the unnecessary polarization in our country:
This is the Midwest flyover people speaking that I know, where I come from (Milwaukee, WI and regions surrounding.)
But when one comes to online forums populated with urban coastals, one is told that they are all hate spewing racist monsters.
The "doctrinaire" pundits are on TV, radio and Breitbart are not the same as the red people out there, it is a game that they might enjoy watching, but not real life. It's not how people act one-on-one in real life, it's all kabuki.
Everyone gets involved in the debate game and wants to try their hand at their own political spin, and that is the problem of doing debate online and in general about the polarization of our political discourse and also the fascination with horse race in politics. My aversion to debate is not just personal, I think the popularity of adversial spin is bad for the country. Study of "horse race", on the other hand, is something I personally enjoy But I think that obsessive coverage of it encourages the amateur adverserial spin thing, and that's bad. (This is why I was very disheartened by TPM changing to all horse race all the time from more long-form, thoughtful analysis and discussion.) I think shortened campaigns would help the country a lot, a lot.
by artappraiser on Sun, 06/04/2017 - 10:09am