MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
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MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE by Michael Wolraich Order today at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop |
Comments
We are not allowed to call Trump voters low information voters.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 7:33pm
No, we're not allowed to call them low intelligence voters (#deplorables).
by barefooted on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 7:44pm
You are risking hurting their feelings.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 7:57pm
Don’t worry. They don’t read stuff like this.
by CVille Dem on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 8:21pm
Lol.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 8:32pm
Excellent point, very important distinction. Grows more important all the time with the whole faux news issue.
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 8:55pm
P.S.I am reminded of a story a brother likes to tell about a regular customer he had at a small city parking lot he was running at night for extra money during college. She was a bigwig attorney, boomer age. He's a Gen X'er. They got friendly and used to chat about various things. They got into dinosaurs for some reason, probably some sarcastic reference to Jurassic Park. She said something that suggested she believed human beings and dinosaurs existed on earth at the same time. We he reacted huh are you joking? she not only vehemently argued the correctness of this belief but suggested he was the stupid one for not knowing it. It's actually quite common to be a low information person on one topic or another in this day and age of specialization. She probably took near zero science courses and never read on the same, and he, being a Gen X stereotypical male, was a fan of science about dinosaurs since he was a little kid.
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/10/2018 - 10:57pm
Uh, #deplorables wasn't about "low intelligence" - it was about meanness and awful morals, like "Evangelicals" who'd follow a porn star-banging president into the sewer or "conservatives" who'd brazenly gut the budget seeking self-serving payouts while leaving workers in the lurch, or a nation of "support the troops" "patriots" who'd actively support a regime that's under kompromat to our biggest long-term enemy.
Hillary pegged it - we keep fucking it up. It will be her most memorable, most accurate legacy.
Having Zuckerberg testify yesterday should remind that it wasn't just stupidity that led many to support a mad criminal, but selective abused vacuums of information in the "Information Age". But a bit of self-preserving common sense and moral compass would have made the atrocity much smaller. And yes, they do have Newsweek and US News and other anodyne publications at the magazine stand by the checkout counter, wherever you go - if you aren't tantalized by The Enquirer. Again, it's about personal taste and personal ethics, not just "smarts".
Christianity wasn't founded as a movement of college graduates, and while its excesses were manifold, the common sense nature and humanitarian bent of its basic principles were hard to mask by anyone who got direct access to the books as transcribed. For those who read and proclaim this every Sunday to turn it into a witch's chant of "lock her up" and "build a wall" and other knee-jerk hateful sets of bromides is simply a personal failing on mass scale - more Popular Delusions and Madness of Crowds.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 12:15am
I do know that is how Hillary used it, but some people here have the habit of using a different meaning of #deplorables as in: anyone who voted for Trump, or low info. voters are deplorable, or because they are low info.they are also incapable of understanding if they applied themselves and are deplorable, etc.
And I do think when people express themselves like that on a public website that leans left of center, no matter how small the audience may be, they are contributing to the whole elite snob thing that feeds the divide. Remember member Resistance? He was a pretty radical Christian and also very pro-gun, and one thing I liked about this site is that everyone still treated him with respect, they didn't treat him like a "deplorable".
And as a matter of fact, I think that even though Hillary didn't mean it that way, it hurt her mightily. I think it was a stupid choice on her part to even go there.
It's just like moderation rules: just say no to ad hominens,there's no benefit.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:16am
Well, everything hurt Hillary wildly, but the point of "deplorables" was a wakeup - half of Trump/GOP fanatics have gone crazy, but you can hang out with the sane refugees from the train to Doomsville.
Instead it was likely worse than we thought - "who are *you*-tell me I can't eat Tide pods - I'm going to go eat Tide pods". And the press piled on before words out of her mouth - never mind that she put togeter a coalition of sane Republican foreign policy experts, etc. Anyway, yes, a voice of sanity ignored and ridiculed.
And remember, Hillary was very supportive of whites Nand guns and Christians in 2008, but the new Dem party w lool kidz wrapped that around her neck, preaching to white voters became racist, so she had to tine down her reachout next time. Just like Obama basically inherited her "serious about defense" mantra while avoiding the stigma that 2002's vote required to be serious about defense & security and inspections. But he ran a more hawkish but aloof foreign policy than I suspect she would have run.
Aside from economic matters, what lifeline would Bernie have tossed to flyover whites? Not a lot - if he could go all purist on the center Dems, there wasn't much forgiveness towards rural/suburban America aside from "repent and adopt our policies". And then Trump was calling Mexicans rapists one day and asking for Hispanic support the next; saying all blacks live in ghettoes one day, and then appealing for thwir vote the next. Under this umbrella, Hillary's comment shouldn't have even caused a stir. Think how anodyne Romney's "folders of women" appears now.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:27am
"never mind that she put togeter a coalition of sane Republican foreign policy experts, ... ..."
I assume from the context of that statement that you believe Hillary would have [mostly?] followed the advice of those 'sane' Republican foreign policy "experts" and that that would have been a good thing. As you have probably noticed, foreign policy is something that I am interested in and so I would appreciate it if you would name a few members of that coalition of sanity you refer to. It could be valuable information because there is, hopefully and with a lot of good luck, another election coming in a few years in which other foreign policy "experts" will be involved, listened to, and then some appointed to important positions. Is Henry Kissinger, the technically undead sociopathic "expert", whom Hillary admired and was proud to have as an adviser, one who makes the list? Maybe the neocon Kagan? He was certainly, along with other neocons, applying for a position. Maybe his lovely demented wife who Hillary had promoted? Don't get me wrong, I doubt she would have listened to Bolton or if she did would have admitted it because we know from Hillary herself that as a politician "you need both a public and a private position" on the real important issues, and FP certainly being an important one. Too important to discuss honestly with the hoi polloi wandering the streets and blog sites of the country maybe? That's what experts and politicians are for, after all, but there are so many experts and even some misguided politicians in our system. It is all so confusing. To me at least.
by A Guy Called LULU on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 4:05am
Let's cut the bullshit, shall we? As they say, opinions are like assholes, so trying to keep 68 million people happy requires some diplomatic lying and keeping one's mouth shut when needed. Even Kissinger, for all his many documented faults and crimes, knows that much. You've seen what happens when Hillary speaks - even innocuous prattle can be used to attack her - it's a long-running game. (And look at the lies the opposition used re: TPP et al - it's simply not a level playing field)
As for would she take advice from Kagen or KristoKristol or whoever NeverTrumper, like fuck if I know or care - I get the idea of policies she's backed in the past (including the nuance part that the media regularly drops), and I can't imagine "oh Henry says carpet bomb or drop Agent Orange so I'm going to do it". She let the Muslim Brotherhood assume leadership in Egypt without overthrowing - it was only when Qaddafi started threatening to wipe out a city of civilians that she put together an *international coalition* to deal with it. Her big sin in 2002 was trying to set Bush up to be hemmed in by the UN and an inspection program rather than cowboy Bush's go-it-alone revenge occupation, but liberals are apparently too fucking stupid to read her speech, so I give up reasoning. Especially with "what great guys Putin and Assad are, and what horrid jackboot imperialists Kiev and Nuland and Hillary are".
How about this - could it be 1/2 as bad as it is now, anywhere? Thought not. Too much philosopohical debate while the Huns on the other side run loose.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 6:01am
Too much philosopohical debate while the Huns on the other side run loose.
Indeed. Huns may be too kind of a metaphor. Twitter threats of bombs in a still volatile and horrendous war involving many major proxies makes the thought of a President Bill Kristol look like calm,thoughtful heaven to this peacenik. I used to be quite understanding of those who might vote for a Jill Stein or a Ralph Nader out of principle. After this Trump thing, no longer.
Edit to add: I've got emails in my inbox from centrist friends who are hysterically worried that the world is going to blow up tomorrow. I don't really get where people who are commenting like George Bush is still president and Hillary is Senator from NY are coming from. Strikes me as absurd.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 11:37am
I hope you will indulge me with an explanation of this comment which seems to be internally self-contradictory. You suggest that the twitter threats of intensifying the horrendous war [here I assume you are referring to Syria which is the most horrendous currently of the seven countries we have been bombing in the last few years] make a Presidency of a truly despicable warmonger, Bill Kristol, something less worrisome to the extent of being like in a calm thoughtful heaven by comparison. That sounds to me like you think things could really blow up and soon. You then edit to add that people worried that the world may blow up tomorrow, which it might actually do if some in our current administration and in our Congress get their knee-jerk wishes to confront Russia with some military punishment, are being hysterical. It all seems a strangely incoherent statement. Absurd would be an appropriate word if I understand you correctly but maybe I don’t.
by A Guy Called LULU on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 1:12pm
Please explain if there are any Russian murders or military attacks that you might object to.
Do their killings count, or are they all just purely defense against the awful United States, thus justified?
Does Assad (son and father) share any blame for the humanitarian disaster on their soil, or is it just the US's (and perhaps Israel's) fault?
What's the worst thing you've seen Russia do since 1992, the action that bothered you most?
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:00pm
Please explain if there are any Russian murders or military attacks that you might object to.
Do their killings count, or are they all just purely defense against the awful United States, thus justified?
Does Assad (son and father) share any blame for the humanitarian disaster on their soil, or is it just the US's (and perhaps Israel's) fault?
What's the worst thing you've seen Russia do since 1992, the action that bothered you most?
You ask four thinly disguised but highly prejudicial rhetorical attack questions after refusing to even be civil when evading and then refusing to answer a single honest question about something you stated.
[1] I object to any murder anywhere by anybody. Any military of any country that has seen any significant amount of combat has engaged in actions I would strongly oppose including murder. War is ugly and dehumanizing and it turns many otherwise decent people, at least temporarily, into sub human killers. I have never in any conversation anywhere at any time suggested that the Russians or their leaders are beyond reproach. I have rejected the idea you once put forward that the crimes of the maniac Stalin somehow represent the nature of the Russian people and are an example that should guide our judgment of the current government.
I believe I can understand why Putin has such high approval ratings in his own country. The breakup of the Soviet Union led to massive suffering for the masses of Russian citizens. I have only been acquainted with a few native born Russians living in Hayward, Ca who lived through part of that time before managing to get to America. They were highly educated and had held professional positions before the fall of the Soviet Union. Their first person account as well as what I have read about that time has convinced me that what the average Russian experience was much harder than what the average American experienced during our Great Depression. The Russians who stayed home experienced a recovery from very hard times to relatively prosperous times under the leadership of Putin. It is as easy for me to see why the majority like and support him so much as it is easy to understand why my parents who lived through the depression in North and South Dakota and I think had it harder than most liked and admired President Roosevelt until the day they died. That is not a favorable comparison of the character of the two men so don’t go nuts. I don’t know Putin’s soul anymore than you or George Bush does. It is a comparison of the situations when they were their countries leaders and how the two general populations came to view them.
[2] Of course their killing counts. Do you really want to measure and compare national rectitude by comparing responsibility for unjustified high body counts over the last sixty years or so or are you really just trying to suggest that one side’s destruction and killings, no matter where or for what real reasons and by whatever methods are almost always justified and the other side’s are never justified because one side is good, maybe even “exceptionally” good and almost always acts that way and the other side is evil?
[3] I think Assad is/has been an authoritarian dictator who ruled with an iron fist and stomped on any dissent but before the insurrection did not go out of his way looking for reasons to brutalize compliant citizens of Syria. It is reported that a number of diverse ethnic and religious factions were tolerated. I think that absent outside support for the rebels, many, and most of the worst, imported from other countries, Assad's army would have crushed the rebellion hundreds of thousands of lives ago and before the destruction of vast amounts of the country’s infrastructure which will cause continued suffering for a very long time even if the fighting were to stop today. I think that despite the honest feeling of many Americans that we ought to intervene to help the Syrian people, humanitarian motives were never an honest reason for those who were actually in the position of deciding and did in fact decide to do so, largely by supporting organizations rightfully describes elsewhere they are active as terrorists. .
I believe that Assad has been, both for himself personally and for his country as a sovereign state, in an existential crisis situation since outside forces entered the conflict against him [Obama said he had to go] and is willing to kill as much as necessary to survive that crisis just like almost every national leader and certainly like ours. I have zero doubt Assad’s forces have committed atrocities against their opponents and anyone else who got in their way. I believe Assad’s opponents are at least as vicious and a significant numbers of them are worse. I do not think supporting their victory is a favor to the Syrian people and I do not believe that the majority of the Syrian people believe that either. [Saddam Hussein is said to be more popular in Iraq now then at any point in his lifetime] I have read, and not seen it credibly denied, that at any point along the way since the rebellion began Assad would have won an honest election, but I would not bet anything significant that that is true anymore than I would have bet the odds on our own recent debacle election.
And yes to the last part of number four. I think both the U.S. and Israel and also Saudi Arabia and some of the other oil rich sheikhdoms share a hell of a lot of responsibility for the extent of the humanitarian crisis in Syria. They have paid the Assad opponents and supplied their weapons and ammunition and provided some significant air support, but never enough support to decide the issue, only enough to keep the war alive as so many died and the country is destroyed. Some Israel leaders acknowledged that as a strategy and intention but I don’t intend to search for a link so anyone can reject that if they think it is wrong or just wish to not believe it.
All your questions have a flip side. Do you think that the United States and Saudi Arabia and maybe Israel have anything to do with the horrible humanitarian crisis in Yemen? Is it justified? I know of no such crisis that could have been more easily avoided or stopped when it became apparent. All we, the U.S, would have needed to do was quit supplying aircraft, bombs, target information, and other logistical support to the Saudis or just mid-air refueling of their attack fighter-bombers. Do you align yourself with the infamous Albright answer? Do any humanitarian interventionists from the previous administration that you might admire publicly speak out against our support of Saudi war crimes in Yemen? Do you see any moral, ethical, legal, or humanitarian consistency in our countries FP?
[4] I’ve done my share. It is way past your turn to give an honest reply if you are serious. Play fair. Answer your own question at least since you have so far refused to answer mine. You tell me: What is the worst thing you see that Russia has done since 1992? Then answer if you will, is it, and if so by what metric, the worst thing done by any major power during that time? Claimed good intentions don’t count as justification for leaving out anything done by any major power unless you want to try to convince me that political leaders, even our own, don’t create propaganda that includes outright lies to justify the unjustifiable. Only the destruction and human suffering that resulted from the considered choices of the acting government should be the deciding factor of what was the worst. What if we included the entire time of my life or even the shorter time of yours? Would the answers be the same? Does relatively recent history count as something to consider when trying to judge the truth of today?
One more thing as long as I am rambling on. Even if we are exceptionally right in virtually all of our military interventions, can we afford to keep it up? Trump’s little rocket show in Syria that first made him “Presidential” a year ago is said to have cost a hundred million dollars. Most of the damned cruise missiles did not even reach their target.
by A Guy Called LULU on Thu, 04/12/2018 - 6:23am
Pretty funny, not one for specifics, are you? Except "Stalinism" and The Great Depression, which was long before 1992, and a nice smooch for Putin for that bolstered economy. And nice water down of any possible complaint about Assad et pere. And that glaring omission of "the worst thing Russia's done since 1992" - apparently there are no bad things. Even that low-hanging fruit of destroying Chechnya (2x!!!) goes unmentioned.
No, Lulu, you haven't much done your part aside from your usual litany of excuses for them, condemnation for us. Of course the reason I asked these questions was to see if any useful reason to continue discussing, if there might be any subtlety or nuance to explore, but as the ball of string said to the tangled twine, "Frayed knot".
PS - " refusing to even be civil when evading and then refusing to answer a single honest question about something you stated." - it was 2 years ago, you can Google as well as I can (I hope): "Hillary foreign service endorsements" or the like, it involved people like Deputy Secretary of State et al. She wasn't elected, so what exactly is the point of me holding that info in my head? To debate with you when you're going to pick these 2 obvious names out of the bunch anyway?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/12/2018 - 6:58am
What is your solution regarding Syria?
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/12/2018 - 7:02am
I decline the offer to indulge because you always debate as if you are still stuck in 1971 and nothing has changed since, it's always the same isolationist argument from you, why debate it over and over as if George McGovern was still available to run?
Except to say:
1) I wouldn't call Kristol a warmonger, but a neo-con interventionist. I would however, call Trump and John Bolton warmongers without hesitation. And then just wait til we have President Pence, oh boy support our troops hither and yon, let's have the draft back. Even Lulu might be wishing we could have a neo-con instead....
2) Syria is not killing a large part of its populace and sending a record number of refugees across the world in one of the worst holocausts the world has ever seen because of U.S. policy to date.
And no I don't wish to discuss it further. Because you do pie in the sky peacenik and I think the perfect is the enemy of the good. Suffice it to say: your choices for U.S.president were Trump and Hillary Clinton. George McGovern wasn't on the ballot. And the world would be much better off right now with Hillary Clinton as U.S. president.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 3:13pm
“Let’s cut the bullshit, shall we?” That is a great idea but obviously we won’t cut the bullsit because that “we” includes you. I will follow the tone of your overwrought response.
You claim knowledge of a coalition of sane Republican foreign policy experts that Hillary had assembled but your head explodes with fucking asshole projections when I ask you to name some of them. Then, regarding that select hand picked crew of sanity which you allude to your rant becomes: “... like fuck if I know or care” who they are or what they would have advised because Hillary would have made the right choices. You seem to believe that her history of FP choices is reason to believe that she would make good choices in the future. I offer Iraq, Libya, Syria, and Honduras and Israel as obvious examples of bad and counterproductive choices with murderous results. I don’t give a flying fuck whether you actually do care who she would have listened to but I do care what assholes, or rather as you put it, what “sane” Republicans, that she would have chosen to [presumably unless you can show differently] advise and push her to follow in the same directions she did in the past. The only affective ones I can think of from the last fifty years or so have made quite a bang up job of our FP, and are pushing for more of the same right now, but not a bang up that I would say is evidence of their sanity. Maybe if you had actually answered my question for which you claimed the knowledge to do so, and which is one involving an issue you brought up, there would be something to consider. As it is, your expletive filled spew rates a big zero at best.
by A Guy Called LULU on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 1:04pm
Why don't you simply Google it - like I give a shit about who Hillary was attracting in mid-2016 - it did make all the papers, one of the few kind of adult things that did. Of course your head will explode with Kissinger and Kagen and what-not. Nothing new under the sun.
So let's get it straight - HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ. HILLARY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR IRAQ.
I don't know if I need to repeat it a million fucking more times, but she was a Junior Senator in the opposition when the majority needed absolutely *ZERO* Democratic votes to pass their legislation. Instead she tried to lobby for the inspections route with guarantees that it would be taken seriously - but Bush overrode the positive results. So go "offer" Iraq to someone who doesn't pay attention and is still fooled by this bullshit almost 16 years later.
Libya? What was your solution when Qaddafi threatened to clean the streets of Benghazi - do nothing? considering Hillary/Bill's experience with Rwanda and Srebrenica, they were awfully sensitive about the horrors of doing nothing. I personally favored leaving Qaddafi in with his post-9/11 shift - kind of a Kissinger-like realpolitik - but when he threatens atrocities, it changes the calculus.
Syria - well, you brought it up - do you give a shit what Assad and Putin are doing now, or it's only that Hillary did something back in 2011 & 2012 that you don't like, but massive deaths now don't really matter, except "Hey, let's blame Hillary". Yeah, she was likely overoptimistic about regime change in the Arab world during the Arab Spring, and frankly I thought the pivot to armed insurrections vs. unarmed protests was a bad move. Then again, this isn't the British vs Gandhi - it's about some much less squeamish bastards not likely to give up quick. But hey, we've largely given it over to Putin, and he's the world's #1 peacenick from what I hear.
As for Israel, well, that's our toughest nut, because we're often stuck with unpalatable choices because of their connections, lobbying, etc. But the peace process with Arafat and Rabin was doing pretty well until Rabin got assassinated.
Honduras? the leader seemed to be trying a weird constitutional move and thus got taken out. Do I care? not particularly. yeah, sometimes the world is less than democratic - I've seen a lot worse in Latin America.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 1:54pm
I remember talking to my hair stylist during the election. He's a gay Latvian immigrant living in Manhattan, smart enough to run his own salon. Not exactly the Trump demographic. Yet, he was leaning Trump because he thought Donald was more honest than Hillary, adding that he didn't like to think about politics. This is just one anecdote, of course, but it's a nice example of a "low information" voter. Not everyone who voted for Trump is Fox-binging bigot or a conservative ideologue or a blathering fool. Some people just don't pay enough attention.
by Michael Wolraich on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 10:46am
I can verify it's not one anecdotal. I knew Manhattan people like that, too. Even people who were knowledgeable about what Trump was like from the 80's! I think the "fuck the swamp" thing was part of the appeal. Wanted to see the status quo shaken up. Bet those that voted for him are sorry now. But always behooves to remember about NYC that Guiliani and Bloomberg were not just elected but re-elected as mayor?
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 11:08am
I haven't asked my hair stylist how he feels now, but based on the first conversation, I'm guessing that he would shrug off the question. Politics isn't interesting to him. He assumes that all politicians are crooked, and it doesn't matter much to him who's in office.
by Michael Wolraich on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:35pm
Not worth upsetting your hair stylist - no good can come out of it, and you're stuck with any visible results.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:46pm
Good point
by Michael Wolraich on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 10:50pm
the conservative info. voters over at the Washington Examiner are being frightened by the editor:
WASHINGTON SECRETS: Millennial poll: Historic youth wave coming in 2018, Dems outnumber GOP 2-1
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/11/2018 - 2:05am