MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
Order today at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop
MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE by Michael Wolraich Order today at Barnes & Noble / Amazon / Books-A-Million / Bookshop |
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LOUISIANA STATE TROOPERS TEXTED ABOUT THE ‘WHOOPIN’ THEY GAVE A BLACK MAN
submitted by rmrd0000 3 hours ago
Shortly after four Louisiana State Police troopers allegedly beat a Black man who had surrendered following a high-speed chase, the officers of Troop F sent 14 text messages to brag about the “whoopin’ ” they had given to 29-year-old Antonio Harris, according to court filings.
“He gonna be sore tomorrow for sure,” trooper Jacob Brown group-texted his colleagues in May, the filings allege.
“He’s gonna have nightmares for a long time,” trooper Dakota DeMoss allegedly said of what unfolded in Franklin Parish, La.
“Warms my heart knowing we could educate that young man,” Brown replied.
The court filings from earlier this month, which were first reported by Sound Off Louisiana, come weeks after four White officers — Brown, DeMoss, George Harper and Randall Dickerson — were arrested on accusations of excessive force, lying about multiple arrests and turning off their body cameras.
Brown, 30, who faces charges in two other excessive force cases, resigned on Wednesday. DeMoss, 28, and Harper, 26, were placed on administrative leave after an internal investigation concluded that Harris was beaten after he “immediately surrendered.”
Read the article at https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/03/13/louisiana-police-black-man-text/
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:21pm
Interesting that you don't do this when AA gives us one of her homicide updates.
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:23pm
1) if there's a thread, readers can read the whole intro section *without there being a first comment* (you're welcome)
2) 4 or 5 articles on 1 topic makes it easy for me to collect in 1 batch even without coffee. "Hey! this looks like another Police Brutality piece!"
3) no idea what homicide thing, but if you notice AA's brackets, you'll see she already largely knows how to thread.
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:56pm
NIGERIAN FEMINISTS FIGHT POLICE BRUTALITY
submitted by rmrd0000 1 day ago
In Nigeria, ‘Feminist’ Was a Common Insult. Then Came the Feminist Coalition.
Read the article at https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/12/world/africa/nigeria-feminist-coalition.html
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:22pm
News from London today retweeted by NYC Antifa:
thread of more similar anti-police, videos, pics and comments:
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:27pm
PORTLAND, ORE., REACHES $2.1 MILLION SETTLEMENT WITH FAMILY OF BLACK TEEN WHO WAS KILLED IN POLICE SHOOTING
submitted by rmrd0000 1 day ago
Mayor Ted Wheeler, who’s also the police commissioner, urged City Council to approve the settlement. He cited how whether it’s education or the law, the systems in place often fail young Black and brown men. He asked city officials to consider how they could “improve the public structures and systems that too often are unable to prevent the circumstances that caused us to be here today,” and noted that no amount of money could replace what the family has lost.
The county commissioners offered the family an apology while approving the settlement.
Read the article at https://www.theroot.com/portland-ore-reaches-2-1-million-settlement-with-fa-1846465695
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:24pm
GEORGE FLOYD’S FAMILY TO RECEIVE RECORD $27 MILLION IN SETTLEMENT APPROVED BY MINNEAPOLIS CITY COUNCIL
submitted by rmrd0000 1 day ago
MINNEAPOLIS — The city of Minneapolis will pay a record $27 million to the family of George Floyd to settle a wrongful-death lawsuit related to his death last May in police custody.
The payout was approved in a unanimous vote by the Minneapolis City Council on Friday morning in what was a last-minute addition to the agenda of the council’s regular meeting. The settlement would be the highest ever paid by the city of Minneapolis, eclipsing the $20 million paid in 2019 to the family of Justine Damond, who was shot and killed by a Minneapolis police officer in 2017.
The settlement could have implications for the ongoing criminal trial of Derek Chauvin, the former Minneapolis police officer filmed with his knee on Floyd’s neck last May and who faces multiple murder charges in his death. As jury selection began this week, Eric Nelson, Chauvin’s attorney, sought to block mention of any possible payout by the city to the Floyd family, arguing it would be prejudicial.
The vote followed an impromptu closed-door session to discuss the civil lawsuit filed against the city and four police officers in the aftermath of Floyd’s death.
Council president Lisa Bender offered her condolences to Floyd’s family after the vote.
“No amount of money can ever address the intense pain or trauma caused by this death to George Floyd's family or to the people of our city,” she said. “Minneapolis has been fundamentally changed by this time of racial reckoning and this city council is united in working together with our community, and the Floyd family to equitably reshape our city of Minneapolis.”
But legal observers questioned if publicity over the settlement, which came on day four of jury selection, could result in a possible mistrial.
“I think it’s a potential disaster for Chauvin,” said Mary Moriarty, former chief Hennepin County public defender. She said if she were Chauvin’s attorney, she would request a mistrial.
“The concern is that jurors will be aware that the city gave George Floyd’s family a great deal of money," she Moriarty said. "And I suspect the jurors will have a hard time avoiding the news, even if they try.”
Nelson did not immediately respond to a request for comment. News of the settlement broke during a lunch break during day four of jury selection in the trial.
Read the article at https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/03/12/derek-chauvin-trial-update/
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:25pm
Justine Diamond's family received $20 million
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/justine-damond-s-family-agrees-20-million-settlement-minneapolis-over-n1001716
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 03/12/2021 - 3:07pm
Uh, (not) driving while white & blond?
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 03/12/2021 - 8:13pm
So far this thread looks to me like evidence the system is working when bad things happen to happen.
by artappraiser on Fri, 03/12/2021 - 3:26pm
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:35pm
YONKERS POLICE ID RESIDENT WHO FIRED AT OFFICERS IN STANDOFF ON SATURDAY
submitted by artappraiser 4 min ago
This just popped up on my laptop screen from local news alerts I get, and thought I'd share it. BECAUSE: it's the kind of story that happens all across the country every day but doesn't get any national attention because it happens all the time.
By Ryan Santistevan of Rockland/Westchester Journal News via Lohud.com, March 14, 2:33 pm ET
URL:
https://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/yonkers/2021/03/14/yo...
Shoulda sent the social workers for the "welfare check"? If so, would there be dead social workers now?
For whatever the reason, this is our reality:
Patrick Sharkey @patrick_sharkey Professor of Sociology and Public Affairs, Princeton
patricksharkey.net
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:42pm
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:49pm
another "not unusual enough for the national news" story, saw it now just because I follow Milwaukee's newspaper on Twitter
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 5:19pm
L.A.P.D. SEVERELY MISHANDLED GEORGE FLOYD PROTESTS, REPORT FINDS
By rmrd0000 on Thu, 03/11/2021 - 8:22pm |
The Los Angeles Police Department severely mishandled protests last summer in the wake of George Floyd’s death, illegally detaining protesters, issuing conflicting orders to its rank-and-file officers and striking people who had committed no crimes with rubber bullets, bean bags and batons, according to a scathing report released on Thursday.
An ill-prepared department quickly allowed the situation to spiral out of control when some protesters got violent, failing to rein in much of the most destructive behavior while arresting thousands of protesters for minor offenses, according to the 101-page reportcommissioned by the City Council.
The report was also highly critical of the department’s leadership, saying that high-ranking officers sometimes made chaotic scenes even worse by shifting strategies without communicating clearly. In many cases, officers used “antiquated tactics” that failed to calm the more violent demonstrators, some of whom the report said deliberately threw things at officers from behind a line of peaceful protesters.
The review is the latest to find serious fault with a police department’s response to the wave of protests that swept the country in the wake of Mr. Floyd’s death in Minneapolis on May 25.
URL:
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/11/us/lapd-george-floyd-protests.html
the view of "New York City Antifa" on this:
it basically follows, of course, that it's impossible to reform policing, you have to abolish it
by artappraiser on Fri, 03/12/2021 - 3:40pm
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 2:49pm
Police Shrugged Off the Proud Boys, Until They Attacked the Capitol
Two Proud Boys accused of leading a mob to Congress followed a bloody path to get there. Law enforcement did little to stop them.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/14/us/proud-boys-law-enforcement.html
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 5:52pm
Cross-posted
Kentucky Senate votes to criminalize insulting police in way that could cause ‘violent response’
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/03/12/kentucky-insulting-police-bill/
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:01pm
Breonna Taylor's Boyfriend Kenneth Walker Files Federal Lawsuit Against Louisville and Police Officers Involved in Deadly Raid
https://www.theroot.com/breonna-taylors-boyfriend-kenneth-walker-files-federal-1846473790
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:04pm
No Charges Against Officers Involved In Daniel Prude’s Death
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/daniel-prude-no-charges-officers-rochester_n_60357696c5b656e70b9268fd
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:08pm
Colorado Police Had No Legal Standing to Stop Elijah McClain: Independent Report
https://www.thedailybeast.com/aurora-colorado-police-had-no-legal-standing-to-stop-elijah-mcclain-independent-report-finds?ref=home
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:10pm
Former Ohio Police Officer Charged with Murder in Fatal Shooting of Unarmed Black Man Andre Hill
https://people.com/crime/former-ohio-police-officer-charged-with-murder-for-fatally-shooting-unarmed-black-man-andre-hill/
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:14pm
Five Oklahoma Officers Charged in Shooting Death of 15-Year-Old Boy
First-degree manslaughter charges were brought against the police officers after body-camera footage showed them shooting Stavian Rodriguez multiple times after he dropped a gun, prosecutors said.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/10/us/oklahoma-city-police-stavian-rodriguez.html
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:19pm
'The jury made the right decision': Reporter Andrea Sahouri acquitted in trial stemming from arrest as she covered protest
https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/2021/03/10/andrea-sahouri-trial-des-moines-register-reporter-acquitted-george-floyd-protest-arrest/6933780002/
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 6:45pm
All the data about police shootings since 2015 to date in this WaPo March 11 article on their continuing project
The rate has been steady since 2015, it's been about 1,000 a year, protests changed nothing on the shooting front.
The demographics have been constant, too.
It locates all the shootings on a map. There are lots of graphs and lots of links to data.
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 10:09pm
So there's less than 500 shooting deaths a year of blacks by police that haven't increased or decreased BUT there's probably more than 7,500 black deaths by homicide in 2020, we know there were just under that number in 2019 and many localities have reported huge increases of homicides in 2020.
Also one question nobody ever asks: How many more homicides of blacks were prevented by police?
After a year of fixation on topic, including sooo many protests and severe corresponding violence and looting that caused much bad will, and counterproductive related voting trends, I've decided that I'm pretty much with this guy, who wrote this Baltimore Sun op-ed almost two months before we all saw a video of George Floyd killed by a disgusting cop outlier
Homicide is a ‘devastating plague’ on black communities, and it is time we stop ignoring it
The continued fixation on "police abuse" when the rate of death from the same is way less than homicide, and probably way less than deaths by improperly practiced medicine WITHOUT EVEN CONSIDERING 100,000+ minority deaths in one year from coronavirus, this is an ABSURD HYSTERIA.
Especially when most of these cases are being adjudicated in our justice system and more and more cops are wearing body cams and people are taking videos of them at work. It's not like they are running around like the Klan in 1920, they're being watched all the time. And when the hysteria is causing more people to buy guns. With which more minority people will be maimed or killed.
Could policing be improved? Of course, everything can be improved. But this does not need to be a priority, many more lives can be saved via other reforms first. It's totally irrational to make this a priority!
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 11:02pm
I would like to emphasize this paragraph from WaPo:
I.E. police shootings resulting in death are a side effect of policing, just like dying on the operating table is by risking heart surgery or from an auto accident by risking driving. We can cut down all of those deaths with certain measures, but we chose not to because getting them further down asks too much.
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 11:11pm
p.s. I will not be surprised if in 10 years we look back on this and see something along these lines where excessive emotionally manipulative media coverage of outlier incidents without any balance caused nonsensical beliefs and distorted priorities.
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 11:21pm
Unarmed people should not be killed by the police
This truth is not dependent on the whether the homicide rate is high or low
Trials to see if mental health workers can lead to better outcomes went police are called into situations where mental health issues are important
Those who make jokes about sending mental health care workers into active shootout situations are broadcasting that they have no true interest in police reform
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 10:42pm
I was not joking upthread when I suggested that if social workers had been sent on that Yonkers "welfare check" upthread, they probably would be dead right now along with the shooter who would have then killed himself. He shot at the police, why not shoot at social workers? He threatened someone on the phone, he had a warrant out. Again how come no one ever asks how many lives policing saves? All of us in NYC were so very grateful for how they reduced the violent crime rate astronomically for a while, as nasty as they can be personality-wise, you put up with that for such quality of life, for civilization. You are never going to get 100% perfect cops, nor doctors nor politicians...
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/14/2021 - 11:36pm
Unarmed black people should not be killed by armed (or unarmed) black people.
The truth is the homicide rate remains rather alarmingly high.
For each Brenna or Floyd there's 100 everyday killings of children, women, men.
It's hard to see how more social workers will stem the tide of black on black killings (and other predatory behavior that drives this horrid outcome)
So many times AA has posted links about killings at rap events. I'm a musician, but I'd be a bit humbled by my music leading to deaths. I remember rednecks with shotguns in pickups after football games, and was never too into that. Why are black rednecks with guns any better?
Elephant in room - blacks kill a lot of blacks. Not much a dumb cracker from the south is gonna do about it's Got any ideas? It's only been a half century of rap and dumbass killings at events that were supposed to be fun. I was into punk, but not a lot of murders at punk concerts.
I remember Indians in a town split by a river* had a festiva where they'd get together once a year and throw rocks at each other, and dozens would be killed or maimed, and i thought how bizarre and uncivilized they were, but maybe that was just their way to keep from doing it 365 days a year. Someone impressed on me, "people do dumb things for good reasons", so always worth considering.
*reviving my memory of the festival/soort, a)the "good thing" might have been saving a sacrifice thru bloody carnage, except people still die, and b) it seems the introduction of video into the equation in the 70s just made people more vain and fashionable, so may have escalated the situation - perhaps rap is video culture gone awry as well?
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1989-09-24-mn-271-story.html
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 1:36am
Homicide rates were high in the 1990s
It is not clear why they came down even during a recession
Dealing with homicides is obviously a different issue than police killing unarmed people
No charges for the officers who killed Breonna Taylor, but an officer charged for shooting into a wall
Killings by police are not going to be ignored despite the wishes of you and AA
Legislatures and Congress and working on police reform
Mental health workers will have police protection
As, I said, it is good that you and AA only have control over dagblog.
Your deal is to ignore the Breonna's
Not gonna happen
Homicides may decrease with a focus on poverty, but as I noted, homicides decreased during the recession.
Gang activity probably accounts for much of the crime
There were anti-gang task forces in places like Baltimore
Turns out, the cops became their own gang.
Same community distrust in Chicago.
Same gang style behavior by the police
If police reform builds community trust, police may receive tips on possible future events
Although prior notice didn't seem to help much in the attack on the Capitol
So we deal with police reform and keeping police from killing unarmed Blacks
In the meantime, we try to figure out why homicides went down to historic lows
The gun homicide rate dropped 49% from 1993 to 2013
https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2013/05/07/gun-homicide-rate-down-49-since-1993-peak-public-unaware/
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:14am
Great, Bill Clinton balanced the budget in the 90s and unemployment's only twice what it was under him, so what me worry in 2021, eh? Are we higher than the 50s or 60s? Can we get back to that?
You like focusing on these outliers and feel good changes that maybe will tick the stats by a few percent (at great cost), and never much about what the community itself can do.
And yes, i talk a lot about the Brenna's and George Floyds. But still by far the minirity. Meanwhile:
==
The Gun Violence Archive reported that more than 19,000 people died in shootings or firearm-related incidents in 2020, the highest figure in over two decades.
New Orleans-based crime analyst Jeff Asher took a closer look at the number of murders in 57 major American cities and he found that the number of offenses grew in 51 of them. He only focused on agencies where data was available and most of them had figures through November or December of 2020. Growth in violent crime varied by city with Seattle seeing a 74 percent spike in homicides between 2019 and 2020 while Chicago and Boston saw their offenses grow 55.5 percent and 54 percent, respectively. Elsewhere, Washington D.C. and Las Vegas saw growth in their murder offences, albeit at a slower pace of less than 20 percent.
New York's homicide count went up by nearly 40 percent with Mayor Bill de Blasio stating that the figures should worry all New Yorkers and it has to stop. He attributed the situation "in part, to the coronavirus and to the fact that people are cooped up", according to NPR, adding that "it's certainly related to the fact that the criminal justice system is on pause and that's causing a lot of problems". The rise in homicide has not been confined to cities and Asher says that the problem is also increasingly rural. He told NPR that the numbers for 2020 are by no means final and that the official end of year statistics will tell a startingly grim story. He also said that the U.S. is on course for the largest one-year rise in its murder count ever recorded.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:22am
What is your super special project to solve the issue?
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:37am
Considering police greatly helped bring the homicides down, maybe focus on other issues besides mean police for a sec?
If police killed *0* unarmed people in a year, there's still gonna be a fuckload of unarmed people killed that year, right? Oh, maybe fewer than under Clinton 30 years ago. So say a half a fuckload.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:44am
You have no plan
Like the poor community in Hillbilly Elegy, there are few resources in urban poor areas
Even when vaccines were targeted for poor black neighborhoods, rich white folks swooped in and took their spots,
Edit to add:
Homicides are different than the deaths of unarmed police
Deaths by police can be targeted
A focused attack can be planned
Urban homicides are harder to address
We don't know why they went down or why they are going up.
Apples
Oranges.
==
You still have not laid out a plan
To prevent homicides, focus on what?
Police are still going to be the prime focus when armed people are killed.
Your wanting to ignore those homicides is not going to happen
[Note - if you're going to comment on the same topic, could you please just edit your comment to add the additional thought? Having additional Comments that are really 1 extended comment just clutters the Comments list - PP
PP PS - I'm not a police administrator, politician, or otherwise empowered to make up and recommend or execute "plans" - I'm just a blogger. Sorry if there's been some misunderstanding on that score. Joe Biden won't even return my phone calls.]
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 8:03am
repeat excerpt from WaPo:
neither going to happen, deal with 1,000 deaths a year, less than 500 black
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 12:11pm
here's the exact # from U.S. News & World Report: 239 blacks shot dead by cops out of 1,009 people in 2019:
And again, as per WaPo, the numbers are stable since 2015.
We have to have a U.S. government plan for this? When soooo many more are dying from homicide by other blacks?
Sounds like crazy paranoia about police to me, like there's a huge conspiracy to shoot black people and they are all racist and that needs to be fixed or people will riot. Like, oh, Trumpies believing he won the election. Or people believing Covid vaccine is dangerous...because they read that "everywhere", stories every day: election stolen, vaccines dangerous plot...
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 1:12pm
How effective do you expect your condemnation plan to be?
Yes, we do need a government plan.
I believe that if communities feel the police are being held accountable, homicide rates will fall.
A national plan to hold police accountable is needed
Police homicides have remained steady
You cannot internalize this data
Poilce are not trusted
https://www.vox.com/2020/6/1/21277013/police-reform-policies-systemic-racism-george-floyd
The initial step is police reform
Neither you or PP understand this.
You both want to dictate what the Black community has to do and ignore what government sanctioned police need to do.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:33pm
I understand that Trump was the motherfucking president these last 4 years, and he wasn't about to do dick to make things better. Which part of that super obvious factoid don't *you* understand?
But if blacks want to kill blacks in ever-escalating numbers, really doesn't affect me, especially since I live in Europe. So since you seem to care so much about this shit, let's see your plan, aside from "defund the police" and "social workers to shooting sites", which most of the time is after people have already been shot dead.
Besides "police reform", could there be "people reform"? Cuz, like, even if police treat everyone nice and don't shoot, there's still gonna be 18,000 shooting deaths minimum. That sounds like a lot to me, but I'm sure we:ll find some other group to blame that on as well.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:09pm
Again with the send social workers into shooting sites nonsense.
You have concrete thinking
Try reading some of the suggestions in the linked article
Some are included in the George Floyd Bill.
No one is blaming other groups, the idea is to build trust between the police and the community
That could aid your so-called people reform with police and community working together.
I will go with the suggestions of experts and reject the PP and AA rants.
Thanks for verifying that you don't care.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:35pm
As i implied, i don't give a fuck and am simply bored with overloaded racial identity crap. I live in Europe and not my biggest concern. There are thousands of issues out there - your skin color is just one of them, believe it or not.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:39pm
Not the exact number, because 239 is the total blacks shot dead by police, not the suspected # if wrongful shootings of blacks by police. Obviously with nearly 20,000 shooting deaths, a few police shootings will be totally justified, right? Your number is about 1%, so potentially wrongful will be 0.5%? 0.3%?
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:24pm
The idea is to create trust between police and community
Trust would involve holding police accountable when the police screw up.
Your option appears to be to tell the community there is nothing to see here when a person dies at the hands of police.
I think that a program based on your model will fail
I believe that a national program holding police accountable might work.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:42pm
With maybe 0.3% of fatal shootings being potentially wrongful deaths of black people, i see it as a small part of a much bigger problem. Sure, figure out a way to lower it, but 20,000 deaths by shooting dwarf it, and idiot protesters destroying minority-run businesses isn't going to fix it.
BTW, i don't have a "model" - I'm just describing current reality. What is there to "see here" when a little kid dies from a thug's Bullet? Does the "community" get out and protest the way it protests for Breonna? And why not? Again, i was outraged back in May. But worse stuff going on now. Sure, fix something, but as AA points out over and over, don't exaggerate the problem enough. This isn't "black people dying from cops blog", believe it or not.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:55pm
Homicides are high
Trust in police is low
Any homicide by police decreases community trust
People do not see police being held accountable
Police reform sends a message that police will be held to account.
That could build community trust, leading to police getting tips
The result could be a reduction in homicides.
Read the article that lays out the suggestions for reform.
I don't possess a magic wand, so I don't expect the homicide rate to go to zero
I do believe that most people who live in high risk neighborhoods are not committing homicides
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 6:08pm
now this, this looks like it needs a plan:
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 1:15pm
Looks like punk and metal guys prefer overdoses and car crashes.
High homicides for rappers
We are not going to ban punk or rap
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/15/the-causes-of-musicians-deaths-by-genre/
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:36am
Killing yourself or death by carelessness is different than killing others (or others killing you)
Comparing peak 1993 murders with lowest murders 8 years ago doesn't accurately describe how it's going, and gives a false sense of security & success.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 2:42am
off thread-way interesting chart! what the heck is going on with folk singers and cancer? is it the vegan diets? Jazz and folk-many long nights spent in small smoke-filled bars?
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 3:38am
Could be more time in and consuming smoke, could also be more blues & jazz singers are black with a higher tendency of heart issues etc.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 3:42am
You can post whatever you like here.
And like is being done with lots of news and social media, I can post analysis and criticism of that news.
In this case I think police abuse against blacks is being over-covered way out of all proportion to virtually any other danger, giving an unrealistic, almost delusional picture of what are the major priority problems in this country and what are not.
That in our capitalist media system, media may be feeding an emotional desire for such coverage, feeding people like you what you want to hear, to confirm your beliefs, out of all proportion and balance.
That videos are taken of abuse and go viral because it is confirmation bias.
Hardly anyone takes videos of cops saving black lives. If they do, they don't go viral.
Major media does not cover the overwhelming number of cop successes to balance the negative depiction. Sometimes local media does that, but rarely.The cops have to do that on social media themselves, and nobody pays attention.
Nobody takes videos of cops harassing white people. Not because it doesn't happen, all us white people know it happens. If they did, they wouldn't go viral. Because they don't confirm the current delusion of the day that cops are all racist.
But WaPo's stats don't lie. There's been no change in deaths by cop since 2015.
This is the result of millions and millions of police and citizen interactions in the U.S. every year: 1,000 deaths per year of all skin colors. Since 2015. No change.
What other stats do suggest: black males 20 to 40 commit a lot of crime out of proportion to the size of their demographic So police profile them. Makes sense to me. Is also extremely unfortunate for young black males who are innocent.
If we were able to pay cops a fortune so we got only Sherlock Holmes caliber cops, we might have more discerning and exacting profiling that would be more fair. But we wouldn't even if we could.
So young black males maybe have to take it upon themselves to use peer pressure to change their demographic ot have a more positive image rather than encouraging usage of guns and violence through rap and other cultural means?
If not, black parents will have to continue to give their sons "the talk".
But again, there's been no change, negative or positive direction. That highly suggests a number that can't be changed without major major adjustments to the way things are done and even then might never be improved upon.
Edit to add: furthermore, even you have been reduced to posting stories how instances of abuse are being investigated, addressed and adjucated. You are aware that most loss of life cases due to negligence in professional duties are not adjudicated by criminal cases but in civil cases? And then those responsible for paying fire that guy or gal or try and to reform things so they don't have to keep paying over and over. It's actually quite rare to prosecute a grossly negligent doctor or car repairman for murder. I don't know why everyone's started to expect that to happen to grossly negligent cops. A reminder that juries aren't perfect either but they are all we got.
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 3:31am
Did anyone ever post the result of the case over which half of downtown Kenosha, WI was burned or wrecked and then two protesters lost their lives in a fight with an immature armed counter protester not to mention it cost the city a fortune in more police duty:
New audio shares the moment Jacob Blake confessed to being armed, DA's investigation reveal
so much for the effect of viral videos of police shootings.
Edit to add, and then there was this Walter Wallace Jr.'s Family Does Not Want Police Officers To Face Murder Charges after major riots and looting in Philadelphia because of a video. His family was there, they knew what happened. The rioters and looters saw a video or heard about one. Shrug? Not like Proud Boys angry about a supposed stolen election, not the same thing at all?
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:14am
To be clear what happened here
PP moved some of my posts to this blog which PP titled "Police Brutality & Interaction"
PP did this so he would be free to talk about what he wanted to discuss
My intent was to discuss police killing unarmed people
PP and AA have made it clear that they do not gave a damn about that topic and prefer to discuss urban homicides
My intention was to focus on tissues like those brought up in the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/us/george-floyd-act.html
I think urban homicides are a separate topic, but it looks like we will be discussing them together.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 8:47am
PP moved posts to Police Brutality, then renamed
PP overall is very bored with this topic and wouldn't discuss it all, but he/she/they did it to group similar topics under 1 thread, rather than vomited all over the site every day.
Go ahead.
PP and presumably AA are bored shitless with 10 months of regurgitating the same mindless talking points while the black-led cities experience a surge in killings, get to deal with destructive spoiled brat protesters, and Republicans use Breonna-and-Floyd inspired poutstorms not to fix the judicial system, but to bring disgruntled minority residents to their side, win elections so they can keep black Democrats from voting, which presumably will lead to worse conditions for black urban dwellers. (take a circle and caress it, and it turns vicious). I certainly write enough supportive comments and blogs back in May and June, before the BLM actions became counterproductive (see Atlanta mayor speech for one) and a fundraiser topic for Trump.
You had a month of Black History trying to be Root Jr. which was manageable because the individual comments (guess you don't know how to group items) went under 1 thread. Contrary to hat l, we have 3 threads on Woke & 1 on Dr Seuss that will set under Readers Blogs* for forever (*a misnomer, cuz most of this is just readers cutting and pasting, not writing original thought)
I
deletedmoved your Meghan the Stallion post cuz we discussed that back in October. I left your post on some relic returned to Italy (even though it seems as noteworthy as "man kicks dog" - but no one appreciates my benevolence)There are 3 people who regularly post new content here. If you don't like my style of moderating, there are a million or so blogs out there that you're welcome to join OGD at. Not sure how many allow open daily whining and repetitive content, but Google it and see.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 9:53am
I use an iPad. Photos, etc do not format well on your platform.
Edit to add:
The "whining" posts are usually articles taken from MSM sources, not tweet snippets.
AA repeatedly takes us back to Portland
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 11:35am
I often have to edit photo sizes - don't know what different iPad does. You'd have to pont me to a concrete example to see what the issue is.
Kenosha/Milwaukee and New York are also AA's concern too, among others (Atlanta at the time, Seattle...), but if Portland keeps making the news, there may be more to say, esp. post-Jan 6. But nice try at deflection.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 12:26pm
No deflection
You combined Nigerian police brutality, Louisiana State troopers, Minneapolis, Portland. Yonkers, and LAPD under one banner.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 12:34pm
Like duh - police brutality. That's the point, right? Mostly cops are cops, and bad cops are bad cops. Doesn't really matter nationality or skin color - the problem's largely the same, no?
BTW, i might have tossed the Portland piece here too, but it already had 8 comments and is about to scroll off the page.
The Kentucky piece is more a freedom-of-speech 1st Amendment issue
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 4:27pm
The type of thing that used to make headline news everywhere, no big deal anymore? Police use twitter instead of bullhorns now? Where were the social workers?
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 6:29pm
Yeah, 15 people shot at party last night in Chicago, no big deal, not of national interest:
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/15/2021 - 6:37pm
beginning of article (by John Schuppe):
by artappraiser on Tue, 03/16/2021 - 1:23am
From NYT
Murder Rate Remains Elevated as New Crime Reporting System Begins
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/upshot/murder-rate-usa.html
Theories about the increase in crime are the usual suspects; gun sales, pandemic stress (although fewer people were out and about), and lack of trust in police to resolve conflicts. The 2020 numbers won't be available until September.
The impact of the new system on the numbers reported is unclear. The reporting should cover 81% of the population.
The article notes the possibility that homicides may decrease later in the year
Obviously, this is speculation
Regarding high crime neighborhoods, when yo look to buy or rent property you look at crime, schools, restaurants, etc.
You go to the best area that you can afford
If crime increases in your neighborhood, and you can afford it, you move.
Some of those who cannot afford to move, do protest the gang activity
Like this program in Chicago, the activity is generally ignored
https://blockclubchicago.org/2020/06/24/chicagoans-do-protest-gun-violence-and-organize-for-safer-neighborhoods-all-the-time-heres-how/
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 03/16/2021 - 9:41am
by artappraiser on Tue, 03/16/2021 - 6:50pm
In City After City, Police Mishandled Black Lives Matter Protests
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/20/us/protests-policing-george-floyd.html
For many long weeks last summer, protesters in American cities faced off against their own police forces in what proved to be, for amajor law enforcement agencies across the country, a startling display of violence and disarray.
In Philadelphia, police sprayed tear gas on a crowd of mainly peaceful protesters trapped on an interstate who had nowhere to go and no way to breathe. In Chicago, officers were given arrest kits so old that the plastic handcuffs were decayed or broken. Los Angeles officers were issued highly technical foam-projectile launchers for crowd control, but many of them had only two hours of training; one of the projectiles bloodied the eye of a homeless man in a wheelchair. Nationally, at least eight people were blindedafter being hit with police projectiles.
Now, months after the demonstrations that followed the killing of George Floyd by the Minneapolis police in May, the full scope of the country’s policing response is becoming clearer. More than a dozen after-action evaluations have been completed, looking at how police departments responded to the demonstrations — some of them chaotic and violent, most peaceful — that broke out in hundreds of cities between late May and the end of August.
In city after city, the reports are a damning indictment of police forces that were poorly trained, heavily militarized and stunningly unprepared for the possibility that large numbers of people would surge into the streets, moved by the graphic images of Mr. Floyd’s death under a police officer’s knee.
The mistakes transcended geography, staffing levels and financial resources. From midsize departments like the one in Indianapolis to big-city forces like New York City’s, from top commanders to officers on the beat, police officers nationwide were unprepared to calm the summer’s unrest, and their approaches consistently did the opposite. In many ways, the problems highlighted in the reports are fundamental to modern American policing, a demonstration of the aggressive tactics that had infuriated many of the protesters to begin with
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 03/21/2021 - 12:27pm
I read the whole thing. It basically concludes that nearly to a one, all the police forces were not prepared and had no smart plans for dealing with large protests, had lousy plans or no plans and no decent command structure for decent crowd control because they have so little experience at it, no training in large crowd control.
(A major missing point, mho, left unsaid: reduced staffing and exhaustion because of Covid.)
That they basically left individual and lower level cops go wily-nily and do what they think. Including using all the fancy equipment some had bought over the years, of which many had not been trained to use, and some of which was so old that it was no longer in working order (like for example wrist ties that were so old that they broke easily). That they would also do things like arrest a lot of people and then have no idea where to go with them.
It made me think: gee, this is the same exact story the Capitol Police told!
Then I went to Twitter and looked at some of the reaction to the article of people with leftist inclinations who went to a lot of protests either as activists or free-lance "reporters" and I saw a lot of complaining that the NYTimes article reviewing all the independent studies was all bullshit whitewash absolving the police forces of intentional brutality, that none of it was true, that cops ganged and planned to brutalize all the protesters and did a good job of intentional brutalizing.
I even saw one complain along the lines of "you mean to tell me NYPD doesn't have training in large protests?" And I thought a minute: huh, the guy is not from NYC, he doesn't know how they never let unexpected crowds get that big, they usually require licensing for any large gatherings. And then for large licensed gatherings, for which the rest of citizens are warned at least a day in advance on tv and radio and traffic reportig services that there will be a large group activity or protest that they might want to stay away from, they always do things like separate people with barricades and other barriers into smaller, watchable groups and have each of the smaller groups watched by several cops to avoid any mob forming..
And if it's a planned march, they separate the march into block-long groups with cops inbetween them and accompanying them, same like with parades, and they make sure to have enough staff to do that, so that traffic can still move and other people can still get about their business. So I would tend to believe that they don't have a lot of experience at handling large unplanned protests, precisely because: their practice is: not to allow them in the first place.
Especially after terrorism lessons and things like the Boston marathon bombing..
.but since these protests were against cops themselves, they were put in the strange position of allowing them without licensing and not like: closing down the Brooklyn bridge before they could get across. And yes, I do recall seeing some pictures of earlier protests forming in Brooklyn and getting waaay out of control,both protestors and cops basically breaking out into a melee of rioting.like a giant bar brawl and veering close to becoming, like, say, the Capital riot.
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/21/2021 - 1:26pm
the conclusions of the reports are a no brainer, actually, if you just remember the news as it happened. If the police forces had been ready and trained for such things happening, you wouldn't have like the mayor of Atlanta getting on TV to say "GO HOME, THIS IS NOT THE WAY YOU PROTEST!", it would have been properly handled and dispersed before it got to the stage of the mayor having to go on teevee with emergency messaging.
by artappraiser on Sun, 03/21/2021 - 1:35pm
This points out quite well how the problem is really all local and can only truly be fixed if more people who care get involved in the local government and stop voting for losers who don't fix things but yammer on about like Israel vs. Palestine or sytemic racism, and don't care about how massive money awarded in lawsuits and then being paid out by cities. The result is not causing enough of the intended affect, they get to wash their hands of it. Torts, it's supposed to be a punishment that causes altered behavior. But it doesn't in this case because taxpayers just keep paying without being interested that their money is being used for paying out on lawsuits. They don't pay attention, they just pay the bill via their sales tax and property tax or whatever and keep paying and don't demand reform like private companies or insurers would. They don't think of the money being spent on police abuse lawsuits as their money, when it is!
Sure the DOJ can come into a city and prosecute and try to reform. But how well has that worked out so far? Bad cop departments and unions just lie and coverup.
People who really care about police reform got to get more interested in budget, not to defund police, but to get rid of the actors that cause big payouts in tort cases. You can't prevent a few bad apples in any city services, and the city will in those cases will be liable and you have to expect that. But you need to ride hard on them when they cost you over and over and over, it's just a matter of good government, good wonks not demagogues
by artappraiser on Wed, 03/24/2021 - 4:49am
City Hall: New Police Grant Approved With Little Scrutiny
Latest grant got two minutes of discussion, not months of meetings.
by Jeramey Jannene @ UrbanMilwaukee.com, March 26
Operation Legend is a DOJ-initiated national crime fighting project introduced by Bill Barr in July 2020
by artappraiser on Fri, 03/26/2021 - 7:05pm
Withheld video: Chauvin's going free
George Floyd, the Law, and the Absolute Necessity of Due Process - YouTube
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/29/2021 - 12:32pm
on the other hand, great counter argument to that, admired by a pro (30 years as a federal prosecutor):
by artappraiser on Mon, 03/29/2021 - 2:41pm
Watch the video. It's all there.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 03/29/2021 - 3:05pm
trending: "The EMT"
by artappraiser on Tue, 03/30/2021 - 6:36pm
Who Are the Jurors in the Derek Chauvin Trial?
The jurors bring to the table a range of views about race and policing, some forged by long life experience and some formed after the death of George Floyd.
By Shaila Dewan and Tim Arango @ NYTimes.com, March 30, 2021
by artappraiser on Wed, 03/31/2021 - 7:29pm
watch the whole thing; don't miss the use of dogs at the start, compare and contrast with U.S.
edit to add, there's a longer version, here,where they show the minutes before, with the police forming a line after the dispersal announcement and the crowd starting to throw stuff at them:
by artappraiser on Sat, 04/03/2021 - 4:56am
Similar happened here. You get foreign provocateurs along with locals unhappy about the situation. Quite often it's the foreigners who are stoking the situation the most - who they represent knowingly or unknowingly can be hard to say. I've seen similar with other protests like WTO, where people are marching calmly, and then suddenly the pros show up, smash windows and such for 10 minutes for some chaos, and then are gone
by PeraclesPlease on Sat, 04/03/2021 - 5:03am
Policing is not really on trial in Minnesota. That’s too bad.
Opinion by James Hohmann @ WashingtonPost.com, April 6, 2021 at 6:49 p.m. EDT
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/06/2021 - 9:00pm
Yeah, i noticed that - all the cops be all Miss Manners and Hints from Heloise, and then this Chauvin cat comes along and he destroys the police's reputation for politeness. "We would never put a knee on a man's neck, Miss Scarlett..."
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/06/2021 - 11:14pm
Brennan Center for Justice analysis: "The Problem With Mayor de Blasio's Policing Reform Plan"
(arta's short version: stupid as usual, what did you expect from an idiot panderer to any changing winds?)
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/09/2021 - 5:53pm
My opinion is that I don't see this opinion often enough:
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/09/2021 - 11:31pm
It is weird the amount of screaming - did *anything* precipitate this weird commandeering attitude?
0 politeness to start? The Lieutenant's speaking calmly, but the cop stays screaming - does he not know how to de-escalate, to mimc moods to bring emotions down?
by PeraclesPlease on Sat, 04/10/2021 - 4:15am
The lieutenant is suing the police.
https://www.theroot.com/black-army-lieutenant-sues-virginia-cops-who-pulled-gun-1846657943
by rmrd0000 on Sat, 04/10/2021 - 12:14pm
The Governor of Virginia is calling for an investigation into the incident
The officer who pepper-sprayed the lieutenant has been fired
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/virginia-gov-investigation-police-assaulting-black-army-lieutenant_n_6073a975c5b6ed5952810f00
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 11:50am
Study by Travis Campbell University of Massachusetts at Amherst - College of Social and Behavioral Sciences - Department of Economics estimates that over the 5 years of 2014-2019 cities with BLM protests had as much as 300 fewer deaths by police, which would be 50 per year:
Note that because accurate figures to use are not available -
Note that method does not seem to include any recognition of race of victims? Including the known fact that more "whites" are killed by police annually than "blacks."
I would also note that this study does not attempt to quantify whether there were more deaths due to violence by civilians in these areas during the same time.
I would also note that an average of 49 people per year are killed by lightning in the U.S..
I for one therefore am not convinced by this study that protests had much of an effect at all on saving black lives.
by artappraiser on Sun, 04/11/2021 - 11:40am
300 fewer deaths over a 6 year timespan, meaning 50 per year nationwide?
How is that even significant enough to verify & register.
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 04/11/2021 - 12:16pm
agree. *bias verification alert*. And we want academic freedom, so that's fine that one academic decides to try his hand at that.
But more a question for the public at large: Why did Scientific American even publish this article pointing to it? Because it's confirmation for popular narrative that people can share on social media causing more traffic and clicks? Aren't they supposed to be sorting the news for the reader for quality?
by artappraiser on Sun, 04/11/2021 - 12:27pm
proof there's no reason for federal politicians to even be involved with this, they don't even need to express an opinion, and that people interested in police reform should rather be involved in local politics and if they are pro-reform, they should educate themselves on how Democrats win power in the states. Unfortunately, it seems that this last election, a significant number of swing type voters, and immigrant types, who might help Democrats win power in the states, seem to have been upset by things like protests, rioting and looting all summer, woke reform of schools, anti-business, anti-capitalist and anti-gentrification attitudes of leftist activists, and voted GOP down ticket in a lot of states. But if you manage to help Democrats win state houses instead, then you can accomplish stuff like this:
Maryland Passes Sweeping Police Reform Legislation
The measures, enacted over the objections of Gov. Larry Hogan, placed the state at the forefront of a national debate over police brutality and officers’ excessive use of force.
By Michael Levenson and Bryan Pietsch @ NYTimes.com, April 10, 2021
by artappraiser on Sun, 04/11/2021 - 2:02pm
off thread but related to Maryland politics above, here's a nice thread that just appeared on the sort of egregious gerrymandering that can be fixed if you just have enough discipline to win state houses instead of turning swing voters off by things like, um, not speaking out about rioting and looting and burning police cars, using slogans like "defund police" and words like "socialism", producing images for viral consumption of marching through gentrified neighborhoods screaming at people to leave and attacking them eating outside at restaurants, etc..
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 3:25pm
golly, imagine that, who'd thunk it:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 7:40pm
The Floyd show has just been superceded. So here we go again. I don't know what to think- all across America black parents have "the talk", yet in Minnesota they don't tell the kids "don't hang no air freshener off your damn rearview?" Or that when a cop says get out of the car, you prolly want to get out of the car, whatever your rights"? At least this white punk would - yeah, I've asked cops "what's this about?" and gotten the surly unhelpful response. Doesn't everyone know this? And while everyone's building up the riots, and waiting for the video to drop in a month showing something much more complex.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 11:38am
from Minneapolis Star Tribune
Brooklyn Center police fatally shoot man, 20, inflaming tensions during the Derek Chauvin trial
Man, 20, killed after being pulled over for traffic violation in Brooklyn Center
By Mara Klecker, Kim Hyatt, Mara Klecker and Kim Hyatt and Star Tribune staff
APRIL 12, 2021 — 7:34AM
there is photo slideshow, here's two of 45
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 1:03pm
Spring weather - more pleasant to get your riot on
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 2:10pm
here's local TV station report from this morning:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 1:05pm
Here's the mayor of Brooklyn Center who instituted those nasty overnight crackdowns:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 1:12pm
^ can I just note there are these signs that say to me that he knows what he's doing here:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 1:32pm
here someone dug up the warrant out on him that caused the P.O. to challenge:
Clearly, it's a horrifically unfair "you can't fight city hall, especially during a pandemic when no one's at work" type thing.
But I've got to say this: if I had a warrant out on me, I wouldn't drive until I cleared it up. That's the kind of thing my parents taught me: police officers don't research shit like: is the warrant fair or not. And police officers are armed and dangerous.
I'm not blaming the victim, and I agree it's horrible what happened. But like you, I'm talking about ways of keeping oneself safe. Time to be a grownup when you get to drive. And that would include: if you have a warrant out on you, STAY IN THE HOUSE AND DON'T GO NO WHERE until you clear up the unpaid warrant thing! Pandemic complications or not. Clearing up the warrant is priority #1. You're gambling with nightmare scenarios if you don't. I don't even drive if I have an expired inspection sticker..my father taught me to be too afraid of what might happen. Granted I don't think about getting shot, but I do think about getting handcuffed and spending an unnecessary night in a horrific jail and okay, now how do I get a lawyer and what happened to my car, etc....
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 5:09pm
Must not let twitter misinfo. I posted above pass without being corrected. Sorry about that. NYTimes' reporting says the above was not the outstanding warrant, rather, it was this
I have no idea whether the officer would know what the warrant was for, they might be coded in a certain way, they might not.
also, this is something that I don't see reported much, that there was a girlfriend passenger (who was injured in the crash after he was shot?)
as well as that there were passengers in the car his car hit after being shot (but they would not be witnesses as he went "several blocks"?)
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 1:26am
Bottom line, the police chief says that the officer admitted she intended to deploy her Taser.
Whatever, he did, it was not a death sentence.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 7:48am
Decades ago i learned that if you (I) get in a car you give up many/most of your rights, simply because it's hard or nig impossible to enforce them in any kind of police encounter. I had a quite conservative professor - white, groomed hair, wore suits, smoked cigars - made a similar comment as he had tried to speak up at some unfair police encounter, and almost got his ass dragged downtown, so decided wasn't worth it. I like driving in Europe much better. Why do people think this a surprise though? You're in a car, even passenger, prepare to be searched and interrogated and feel like an outcast, whatever age or color.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 8:59am
Your statements have nothing to do with the fact that an officer was so incompetent that she used a gun instead of a laser.
The Minnesota homicide victim was so scared of the police that he called his mother to inform her that he had been pulled over.
The Army lieutenant in Virginia was so scared that he only pulled over after finding a lighted area.
Cops want to go home at the end of the day
Black people want to stay alive during an encounter the police
There is no reason to believe that the cop who stopped you is rational
Fear is a natural response
In Virginia, there were simultaneous instructions to exit the vehicle while also being told to keep his hands out the door
The lieutenant said he was afraid to open the car door
The officer told him that he should be afraid
In Brooklyn Center, a cop can't tell the difference in weight and feel between a gun and a Taser.
Let's see what we find out about the histories of both officers
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 9:37am
If he's so goddamned afraid, why's he got a fucking pinecone on his rearview, which is a guaranteed pullover? Why's he driving around if he has an arrest warrant? Why's he slow to get out of the car when they tell him to get out? How come fear only seems to make people do stupid things, not smart?
This is all "dealing with police 101"
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 10:22am
None of what he did should result in death by incompetent cop
Trevor Noah addresses the issue
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trevor-noah-daunte-wright-mistake_n_6075622be4b043d6d4a2ee31
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 11:15am
Absolutely, he's right.
But it's also right that an arrest warrant can get you arrested. Which is the process that was happening in the video until he tried to flee.
The narrative that he was just an innocent going about his business is not going to work with rational people. Pretty clear he was attempting to flee arrest in the video, he was being handcuffed.
Just as the argument that the officer confused her gun with the stun gun may not fly with some people.
I would never dare drive with an arrest warrant! Never, too dangerous that I would be caught. Driving is a privilege, not a right, and part of the deal of driving is a driver can be stopped at any time. This is in the updated NYTimes article: the police story conflicts with mom's story about the air freshener: who the police said was stopped for driving a vehicle with an expired registration. No one is allowed to drive a vehicle with an expired registration, chances are high you will be stopped.
And your heart starts pounding when they take your license and registration to their car to check on it even when you don't have an outstanding arrest warrant and have registered the car, maybe their computer is wrong.
I am curious: What kind of family buys a 20 yr. old a car (Mr. Wright’s mother, Katie Wright, told reporters that her son had been driving a car that his family had just given him two weeks ago and that he had called her as he was being pulled over ) when he has an arrest warrant stemming from a gun charge and a baby son and doesn't make sure it is registered? Playing with fire, living a real risky life. Do you want gun registration to work in this country? Then those challenged about their gun have to show up in court. No he didn't deserve to be shot. Nor did any person he might shoot in the future.
Here's the point: he should be afraid, he's got an outstanding arrest warrant concerning a gun. He shouldn't be out driving an unregistered car. He should be afraid enough not to drive.He wasn't afraid, he thinks he's special and can get away with stuff.
Stopping him was completely in line. Trying to arrest him was completely in line.Nothing racist or wrong about either of those things. It's what I expect cops to do: protecting the community from someone driving without a registration who doesn't show up in court about a gun violation. I for one am not buying anything about this being racist, unless they can somehow get into Officer Potter's head and find that black males make her more confused than whites Holy shit, I just shot him,
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 12:16pm
I did not focus on race.I focused on her incompetence .
She as inept as the 73-year old pretend cop from Tulsa who shot a man because pretend cop mistook his gun for a Taser.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/13/tulsa-police-shooting-eric-harris-district-attorney-weighs-charges
This is not about a family buying a 20-year old scar, it is their money
The cop was a training officer who was a screw-up..
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 12:31pm
Well, virtually all the protests do focus on race. And I genuinely feel sorry for the people of the Minneapolis area who are now left with lots more incompetent cops since the "defunded" thing started in reaction to previous protests, and many competent police left for elsewhere, and now after this, surely they will not be able to attract any more competent police. Is now like the last place on earth that a competent person would apply.
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 12:39pm
The incompetent police training officer resigned
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/minnesota-officer-killed-daunte-wright-resigns_n_60750008e4b0fcee71a131fe
If she was a training officer, why would we expect competence from the Brooklyn Center police department?
Edit to add:
The police chief quit as well.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/kim-potter-veteran-brooklyn-center-officer-who-shot-and-killed-daunte-wright-resigns?ref=home
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 2:06pm
Training doesn't keep you from screwing up - it lowers the chances. People have emotions, they freak, they fumble, they overreact, they do the wrong thing. Guess that 1:50, 1:100 encounters will go off the rails. No one's going to praise the 49 or 99 done by the book - they'll focus on the mistake. The worse the mistake, the more the attention, and if more pressure is put on, more mistakes will be made. But there's no more pressure on criminals who shoot people, who beat spouses, who pass fake money, who skip court dates, who steal stuff in stores, who sell oppidan to junkies, and so on - all of social media breaks out defending and dismissing whatever behavior.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 2:15pm
I believe M.D.'s, both incompetent and competent but accidental, do far more damage to humans. Is why their malpractice insurance is so costly. Not to mention a lot of insurers play real nasty these days when someone tries to make a claim.
But no big protests against them. Because they are presumed to be trying to help, not hurt, by most.
Cops are presumed more and more to be authoritarian jack booted thugs, the enemy. That is partly a self-fulfilling prophecy for those who help to label them that way, i.e. more and more authoritarian thugs seek the job.
I don't know how to solve that. Require everyone who reads a bad story about cops read the counterpoint of a PD twitter feed that is naturally filled with all the good stuff they accomplish every day?
Or we could go whole hog anarchist and publish more malpractice stories about M.D.s maiming and killing people, or just making them sicker, which happens every day. There are certainly internet forums where you can find many of these victim stories, I've run across them myself.
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 3:49pm
I am not exaggerating. See this 2017 paper.at Pub Med Even if they are exaggerating, cut their number by 2/3, what the heck:
Where's the outrage? It's all at cops, it's in people's heads. Now fueled by phone videos, which no one gets to do during a medical operation. They integrate the forces and they're still the same enemy, white supremacy bogeyman.
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 4:02pm
We don't praise the pilots who land aircraft every day.
There is a detailed investigations when pilot error is suspected.
Criminals who shoot people and are caught go to jail.
Attention is not going to be diverted from police misbehavior.
There will be no deal crafted that says crime has to decrease before police officers can be brought to justice.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 6:51pm
Pilots don't deal with crazed drugged out murderers - security screens out guns and over-intoxicated. If 20,000 murders happened in the air each year, pilots would demand whole different protections. Nor do pilots have to worry much about other planes or pilots, or random gunfire from the ground. And if security tells a passenger of whatever color to sit down and they don't, the plane lands and they walk the uncooperative person off the plane, likely to jail. Not a lot of leeway for an opioid-filled passenger dancing around in the aisle during takeoff or when told to sit down. Oh, don't try passing fake money to the stewardess for that beer or duty free. Totally bad news, federal crime.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 7:24pm
When planes crash, there is an investigation
When unarmed people are killed or harassed by police, there are investigations
A pulmonologist and a cardiologist testified that Fentanyl and cardiac problems were not responsible for Floyd's death.
The police screwed up
The Brooklyn Center police officer admitted to screwing up
The Virginia officer screwed up.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 7:57pm
When unarmed ppl pass stolen money, act crazy high, resist arrest, police often respond, shockingly enough. I know you have a rulebook where anything a black person does is excused, but it's more complex than that, sorry to say. Not completely open to abuse, thus the trial plus the responsibility once Floyd stopped responding, but still, they did have reason to detain him.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 8:03pm
Floyd stopped responding
Chauvin killed George Floyd
Floyd had a fake 20$ bill
So, George Floyd can be murdered by police with the public's blessing.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 8:49pm
Hardly "blessing" but go ahead and frame it fucked up stupid as always to try to score some point. Meanwhile the trial determines what role the knee vs drugs/adrenalin played in death and when Chauvin & others should have administered aid. Chauvin's stupidity and pathetic was is largely irrelevant. *Why* he kept yelling "I can't breathe" in the car still is a key detail to understand, despite all the self-assured "expert" testimony - i haven't heard it out in context aside from ignoring, but i haven't watched all proceedings.
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 9:20pm
See below
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 9:42pm
Perfect enemy of the good?
by PeraclesPlease on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 3:13pm
Black people want to stay alive during an encounter the police
Then why is it in so many of these cases the person shot is resisting arrest, refusing to obey orders, or trying to flee? I've had encounters with cops several times over the years and even when I felt I was treated unfairly these are things I never even thought to try. None of these things are capital offenses and they shouldn't have been shot but still. We hear often about the "talk" black parents have with their kids. I doesn't seem like fight back, disobey orders, and try to flee would be part of that talk.
by ocean-kat on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 5:10pm
There is no excuse for the deaths of George Floyd or Duarte Wright.
Police are allowed to be full of fear
Citizens can be just as fearful of police.
The Army lieutenant in Virginia was trying to comply, but full of fear.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 6:38pm
wanna hear my imagined narrative, oceankat? I think Whyte would still be alive today if he told the truth to his mother. I have four younger brothers and saw how several of them lied to my parents or hid stuff from them, sometimes real important stuff, because they thought it would make them think less of them. He was lying to his mother on the phone about being pulled over for an air freshener. That's because he didn't want her to know that the car wasn't registered and he had a warrant for not showing up in court. If he had told her the truth, she would have screamed: do exactly what they tell you to do, don't say anything, don't challenge them, don't question anything, let them take you to jail and we'll get you out and get a lawyer. The reason parents just want the truth, not some made up story about being harassed that makes you look like an angel, is because they want to help you stay alive and well, no matter how naughty you are.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 12:04am
Officer thought she was firing a Taser
BROOKLYN CENTER, Minn. — The police officer who killed a man in a Minneapolis suburb on Sunday did so accidentally, officials said Monday, releasing a graphic body-camera video that appeared to depict the officer shouting, “Taser!” before firing her gun.
“It is my belief that the officer had the intention to deploy their Taser, but instead shot Mr. Wright with a single bullet,” Chief Tim Gannon of the Brooklyn Center Police Department said of the shooting on Sunday of Daunte Wright, 20, during a traffic stop. “This appears to me, from what I viewed, and the officer’s reaction and distress immediately after, that this was an accidental discharge that resulted in a tragic death of Mr. Wright.”
The officer, who was not publicly identified, has been placed on administrative leave, officials said. Chief Gannon said that Mr. Wright had been initially pulled over because of an expired registration on the vehicle he was driving. The video showed a brief struggle between Mr. Wright and police officers before one of the officers fired her gun.
After the officer fired, she is heard on the video saying, “Holy shit. I just shot him.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/12/us/brooklyn-center-police-shooting-minnesota.html
Edit to add:
The looters will go to jail
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 1:50pm
here's the video of the police chief saying that and adding lots of details about training with tasers
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 3:20pm
"Accidental discharge" euphemistic bs. It was gross negligence resulting in the death of a young man.
A simple rule that all cops from this 2 bit town always have their handguns safety engaged would add a step that would likely prevent confusion as to which weapon you held, adding a step before the trigger would work. The Chief is as much responsible for poor training and policies.
by NCD on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 4:19pm
law-professor-who-used-to-be-a-Republican-now-an-Independent Richard Painter says:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 5:44pm
this guy has a thought-provoking take; makes very good points that a lot of Minneapolis area cops now on the job definitely know what they have gotten themselves into and the devil's bargain they have made staying on the job. Especially if you have followed the full story, that many quit following Geo. Floyd riots and lack of support from local politicians, even to the point of many local pols going for defunding, and then after seeing skyrocketing crime, pols changed their mind, have tried to hire more cops but are having a tough time, not exactly a desirable job. He is basically saying: much higher percentage of bad apple cops left around those parts now. And that furthermore, they are lily-livered and the others are arrogants who would let their cities burn just to prove a point that that would happen.
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 6:49pm
titus uses two crucial words, mho, there is now a "low bar" for area cops, panicky cops are not what you want
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 7:11pm
"NYC Antifa" just retweeted this:
after tweeting this:
and this
and this
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 7:59pm
Official BLM has only tweeted this so far:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 8:02pm
Sergio and Justin Yau will no doubt be tweeting the developing in Portland. I think this is enough for me, I've seen the rest before.
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 11:56pm
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 8:09pm
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 10:27pm
A former Minneapolis police officer is on trial for murder
A policewoman shot and killed a 20-year old man, apparently by accident, in a city near Minneapolis
There is no guarantee that either officer will be convicted
Many have no trust in the police or the justice system
The protests against the police are predictable
Gun homicides are increasing in multiple cities.
Those types of homicides cannot be lumped in with homicides committed by police.
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 10:33pm
"No Go Zone"?!!!
They also have tweets on the curfews enacted, barriers erected and have been tweeting regularly about police and and protesters' actions, including some photos, along with regular crime reports.
But they aren't splaining that one that I can see.
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 10:51pm
Minneapolis Star Tribune reporter Liz Sawyer was live tweeting videos from from a protest tonight after curfew, here are her last 5:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 11:04pm
striking Star Tribune video from a daytime protest:
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 12:52am
Interesting chart he pulled up and question (I have no idea what website he is using):
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/12/2021 - 11:30pm
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 1:01pm
I was going to respond to PP's comment above
I think that I will just await the decision of the Chauvin trial and whether charges are brought against the officer who murdered Duante Wright.
Edit to add:
The officer who murdered Duante.Wright was a training officer.
Chauvin was a training officer.
by rmrd0000 on Tue, 04/13/2021 - 11:18pm
gee, I've read over at BLM and their confreres that the courts are rigged:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 2:02am
same reported by Justin Yau here.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 2:18am
Portland anarchists might want to be aware that FBI and federal prosecutors have a lot experience now searching social media for bluster about attacking federal law enforcement.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 12:12am
official BLM retweeted this on the Duante Wright case:
which would be consistent with their belief that there should not be any police nor courts, so there would be no arrests for warrants, as there would be no warrants. And that police are overall just wannabe killers.
But I also see that 12 hours ago there is also a long thread of tweeted complaints by them about Patrice Cullors being maligned and terrorized by right wing white supremacists, continuing a long tradition of terror against black activists, inducing fear. And it makes me wonder how they would accomplish their dream world if these people are still around, without police and courts. Rigid segregation with electric fencing and border guards? Race war? And since the reality is there are still police and courts, would they feel a right-wing miscreant, a Proud Boy, say, trying to flee arrest for a outstanding warrant for gun issues by getting in his car and driving away should not be stopped by a taser used by police either? Should the police get in a car chase after him and possibly cause accidents? Or if he manages to escape their handcuffing,. should they just let him run until he's ready to turn himself in?
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 2:50am
BLM has nothing to do with the fact that a police training officer could not tell the difference between a Taser and her gun
She murdered a 20-year old
Nothing Duante did warranted the death penalty
Nice attempt at diversion
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 8:02am
"Talking to Strangers" by Malcolm Gladwell (he's half Jamaican)
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 8:53am
Joe & 88k fentanyl deaths
https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_60761984e4b01654bb774b47
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 9:30am
Who owned Mercedes SUV?
Floyd fell asleep before cops showed up?
https://abcnews.go.com/US/man-car-george-floyd-day-died-testify/story?id...
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 9:51am
Fentanyl OD leads to a decrease in respiratory rate
Floyd's respiratory rate was at a high level because he was struggling to breathe
Fentanyl was not the cause of Floyd's death
None of your posts support Chauvin choking Floyd to death
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 10:11am
Why was he struggling to breathe in the back seat (gasping "i can't breathe!"), as he was getting into the ground, before any knee? Isn't it kind of useful to understand what was happening a few minutes before?
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 11:05am
Chauvin applied 90 pounds to Floyd's neck for 9:29
A person with a normal heart and lungs would have died
Chauvin murdered Floyd
It does not matter what when on in 2019 or after Floyd stopped resisting in 2020
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 12:49pm
I'm asking what went on 5 mins before those 9:29 started, when Floyd still couldn't breathe.
You like this advocating stuff. Any other billboard slogans for us?
BTW, should the gov have taken the plea deal for 10 yrs/3rd degree murder, or would that have ruined your fun?
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 1:23pm
You like this advocating stuff. Any other billboard slogans for us?
BINGO! Part of the problem, not the solution: population with mass delusion into stoking anti-authoritarian narratives. Someone's going to write a novel about it all in fifty years,something along lines of Fear and Loathing of Police and Government in The Time of Covid.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 2:07pm
What Floyd said before he was on the ground doesn't matter.
The only thing that matters is that he was choke to death by Chauvin.
Chauvin is the person on trial.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 2:22pm
Are you ignorant or deluded? Take your time. I mean, there's a difference in a manslaughter vs murder charge that depends in part on the difference between Chauvin-caused death and any non-Chauvin issues, but keep repeating your stupid mindless phrases - "hey ho, hey ho, Chauvin has got to go..."
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 4:57pm
Hopefully, Chauvin will go.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 8:35am
Well, pretty sure he's not returning to the police force whatever happens.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 9:41am
Wrong, I'm presenting a tweet endorsed by BLM on the issue. I'm not diverting anything. They are saying police shouldn't use a taser either.
Police should gamble their own life and the public safety when a suspect with a warrant out attempts to flee arrest, just let him go?
Because after all, he looked like a nice fellow? Here's a comment about another nice fellow who was successful and did some good things, and also some very bad things I just posted about on the other thread along with another story about another reasonably successful guy
“People are complicated man…damn.”
A lot of those "people are complicated" stories don't go viral. But cops have nonetheless seen a lot of them up close and personal, and more often lately.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 5:50pm
I just wonder like, what does official BLM think about hate crimes? Don't arrest them but send the social workers and psychologists? What if they won't answer the phone or the door and don't keep their appointments (just like Mr. Whyte didn't show up in court) because they're out committing more hate crimes because there are no consequences except social workers bugging you?
Heck, what about Officer Potter, why should she even show up in court, why respect the rule of law, why not flee to Mexico instead? After all, the court system needs to be done away with...what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 6:01pm
The Brooklyn Center training officer who could not differentiate a Taser from a gun will be charged with manslaughter
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/14/us/kim-potter-charged-daunte-wright.html
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 12:51pm
Appropriately so! Also seems to me to be the most correct of the several charges against Derek Chauvin as welll; his jury will decide. And I am hoping that people will not protest against his jury's decision!
So: I wish more would explain what the protests and outrage are really about.
Again, a good comparison is lot of victims of medical malpractice don't get such justice. They don't get viral videos about their cases that suggest a narrative that police abuse is an epidemic going on everywhere all the time and that deserves constant national attention and priority. They don't get nationwide protests and related riots and looting and calls for abolition of the practice of medicine. The practice of medicine does not get vilified
When facts, numbers, suggest that the real epidemics causing far more harm are elsewhere.
Not just including a pandemic but of civilians shooting other civilians with guns. Not enough narrative and outrage about that, it's a real epidemic. And I don't see any answer except policing, more social workers are just not going to do the trick. Biden was correct when he said more police, not fewer, are needed. The constant protesting about police and stoking of outrage and viral coverage of the outrage as if they are all Derek Chavin types is very counterproductive to the goal of hiring more good police, "the narrative" is counterproductive to saving human lives and having a society where the rule of law works. Rather it promotes anarchy (if Russian trolls can see how destructive this is, why can't we?)
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 1:57pm
A fact: police with public jobs were on duty, could NOT work from home but had to work, had close interaction with the public, with little social distancing in 2020
Study finds more active-duty police officers died of COVID-19 in 2020 than all other causes combined
FEBRUARY 25, 2021
https://thedaily.case.edu/study-finds-more-active-duty-police-officers-died-of-covid-19-in-2020-than-all-other-causes-combined/
2020 LAW ENFORCEMENT FATALITIES REPORT
https://dailymedia.case.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/02214818/2020-LE-Officers-Fatalities-Report-opt.pdf
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 3:50pm
NYC Transit workers assaulted 1,100 times in six months, union pushes for more cops
By Mark Hallum @ AMNY.com, April 13
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 4:15pm
^ asking for MORE COPS and MORE ARRESTS, not mental health workers. Many transit workers are P.O.C., BTW. Many have also died from covid, BTW. And what do they get for being on duty? Abuse and very little gratitude. All they want is: more police.
but admittedly transit workers didn't have to deal with huge protests, looting and curfews to enforce with reduced forces, at the same time their coworkers sick with Covid, who nonetheless showed up for duty, if not trying to breathe from covid infections, to handle: Brooklyn brats deciding they absolutely needed to practice their first amendment rights during a pandemic on the streets instead of on the internet.
that's my narrative of 2020 in NYC, that's what I saw.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 4:15pm
Your posts have important information, but have nothing to do with the murders committed by police officers in the cases George Floyd and Duante Wright.
They also have no bearing on the terror Lt. Caron Nazario experienced.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 4:30pm
Begs the question: what is the goal of continuing protests about the Daunte Wright shooting?
To scream and yell that life is unfair and bad things happen? Get back at the Dollar Store for renting a place in your hood? A replacement for closed nightclubs?
What it looks like to many who aren't participating: you are not happy with government by black Democratic mayors and black Democratic state attorney generals.
This is what rapid justice looks like; they're working their ass off. This is the best there is in history. Certainly lots of protesters in Myamar aren't getting the same deal, they're getting shot dead. Many murder victim's families are still waiting for someone to find the perp because he/she wasn't wearing a bodycam with footage that is revealed right away.
Sometimes I really do see the logic in swing voters voting Republican, as they see the message loud and clear that protesters aren't happy with black Democrats running things.
Are we absolutely sure continued protesting isn't being stoked by people with a nefarious agenda?
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 8:50pm
Law enforcement is arresting people who break the law.
Protesters are being met by police in riot gear.
It seems like hundreds of people are showing up to protest
A fraction of those hundreds appear to be engaging in criminal activity
Let's judge the entire Black community in Brooklyn Center by the criminal element.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 9:02pm
p.s. He did ask the 12th for this help in continuing to run the country:
Of course, there's that a lot of BLM protesters over the last year liked to chant "fuck Joe Biden" or put the same slogan in graffiti. Should those people really be considered allies of the Democratic party?
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 9:04pm
MSNBC is broadcasting that there are fewer people protesting tonight then in the days before.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 9:56pm
White lady with blond hair and radical political views involved with riot going on. No taser, no problem, go ahead and shoot to kill (other people's lives in danger?). Any protest? Lawsuit?
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 11:13pm
Absolutely no difference between crashing into the Capitol with a group of rioters and the guy in Virginia getting pepper sprayed
No difference between crashing in the Capitol and being choked to death to death for a fake $20 bill
No difference between crashing into the Capitol and a police training officer mistaking a gun for a Taser
Each event is the same
Protestors in Brooklyn Center are being arrested on the scene
Protestors at the Capitol were allowed to leave and had to be tracked down in their home towns.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/14/2021 - 11:32pm
Dumb comparisons with counterfactuals don't help you look sane. The Capitol Hill & Metro police didn't have near enough on duty by a long shot to detain rioters, *plus* many of them were in video and had cell records inside the Capitol (i e. illegal presence) to be traceable later.
Floyd wasn't choked to death over a $20 bill. He was apprehended in a car (prolly doing drugs with his dealer who gave him the fake $20) over a $20 bill. He was put on the ground because he wouldn't go in the police car - the police did what "Floyd" asked them to do (all while complaint about breathing). So Floyd died went on the ground and was restrained while he was kicking and thrashing about. Still all good. At some point thereafter the restraining and/or Floyd's physical/drug issues got too much and he died without the police properly checking up on him. So Floyd didn't die from a fake $20 - he died from his choices, freaked reactions, plus police's neglect of duty for a suspect in their care, and maybe excessive force/likely excessive time in a stress position to restrain Floyd.
BTW, where'd the Mercedes SUV come from that they were doing drugs in? Maybe not the latest model, but a pretty cherry ride for a bunch of addicts to be hanging out in.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 5:36am
Floyd and Wright died of the incompetence of two police training officers.
If the training officers are this stupid, what do you expect from cops on the street.
Absolutely nothing that Floyd or Wright did should have resulted in death. Period.
Minneapolis paid out $47 million because of police incompetence
Brooklyn Center is going to pay out money because of inept behavior by the police.
Floyd breathing complaints do not justify a homicide.
The Mercedes SUV is of zero importance in the homicide.
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 9:53am
You know if the stupid bugger wasn't jamming opioids up his ass, he might not have had to pass counterfeit bills, so he might not be picked up by the police for the 8th/9th time, so it sure as fuck is important, even if the cops were negligent and wow, maybe not the smartest dudes around - and there i thought cops were all einsteins. Personal responsibility goes a long way towards keeping yourself out of accidents and from being on the wrong side of malicious mischief. I mean, 88,000 died of opioids last year, 20k were murdered, and while it sucks that the thing with Floyd happened, i have much more sympathy for Sandra Bland or all these innocent victims of stupid flying bullets from drugged up vindictive psychopaths. I also had more sympathy for the kid who got picked up and they put him in the back of a van unsecured and whipped him around til dead. *That* was vindictive. *This* looks just irresponsible, and in my book the former's worse.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 12:56pm
The police receive CPR training. They did not apply CPR. They did not allow a firefighter to help.
The cause of death was lack of oxygen, not use of recreational drugs.
Chauvin's lack of personal responsibility caused the death of George Floyd.
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 9:42pm
The police also receive training on non-compliant suspects, yet each time you excuse the non-compliant behavior and put all on the cops. What happened with Reyshard (sp?) and Floyd is not all that different from this hospital scene, the grappling, the misleading statements.... So if they get someone in a safe position, they're not likely to change it considering the suspect might then bolt and run, grab a weapon, attack the cops, etc. There are a lot of cops killed each year - 89 killed in 2019, more in 2020 due to Covid. No big protests backing police who were killed. Blue Lives do matter - not at an indifferent exchange for the public, like the teen with his hands up, but in other situations, yes.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:54am
Carotid pressure on Quora (from years ago)
Dont know if there was any trial talk about Floyd's left carotid artery.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 3:13pm
Choke-out / blood choke
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choke-out
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 7:31am
Twitter special section 21 min. ago: Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot calls for peace as officials release footage of the police shooting of 13-year-old Adam Toledo pick and chose your preferred coverage at link
Summary: Hours before the release of the police shooting death of 13-year-old video Adam Toledo in March, Chicago Mayor Lori Lightfoot told reporters that she has seen the clip and warned Chicagoans to brace themselves for the "extremely difficult" images. Lightfoot described the body camera video as "excruciating" and later advised for parents to shield their children from it.
My reminders:
Edit to add new link on twitter that started trending while I was posting this: "Adam Toledo"
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 4:02pm
lots of children
by artappraiser on Sat, 04/17/2021 - 4:25pm
A few weeks later another 13 yr. old also died, shot dead by a 12-yr. old in a Maryland parking lot filled with like 100 "innocent" "unruly kids" hanging out, regularly dropped off there by their parents. His mother and the police and mayor has something to say about who is responsible for that.
Prince George's County remembers 13-year-old shooting victim killed by 12-year-old
Prince George's County Police charged a 12-year-old DC boy in connection to Douglas' death Monday.
by John Henry @ wusa9.com, Updated April 19
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/26/2021 - 2:59am
Jesus, yes it say something about the children too, even if they're not adults yet. "I shouldn't blow away my classmate" is pretty obvious in kindergarten, right up there with "play nice with others". *Something* is demanded if the wild kids even if adults are negligent - it's not like you leave 1 part outta the equation, the part that pulled the trigger.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 04/26/2021 - 3:08am
I have a new attitude after reading the above about the Adam Toledo shooting and protests about it. I think it will have ,maybe zero effect on any reform of the CPD. I do think it will have some good effect on reforming parents who let their 13 yr. old kids out at night in high crime neighborhoods to hang out with older kids that are like, trying to sell guns and other kids who are into fighting. That is the good effect it will have. Because it's very likely if he had not met up with the P.O. that night, he probably would be shot dead soon anyways. I'm on board with King Douglas' mom, parents need to change "the talk", it's on them. The police are not your babysitters, they are trying to fight the gun crime going on by older people in your neighborhoods. If you live in a high-crime neighborhood, it's your job to protect your kids. You can let them out at night when you manage to find the money to move to a safer place where they aren't selling guns on the street corner and his friends have one and he wants one too.
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/26/2021 - 3:22am
Oh look here's more "bias confirmation" that keeping em home at night saves lives:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/26/2021 - 2:20pm
Chauvin trial has closed:
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 4:10pm
Wasow basically specializes in studying what shifts public opinion and what doesn't as far as activism is concerned:
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 4:36pm
Still bizarre Barr turned down a guilty plea for 10 years.
And after 2 weeks of hearing police exclaim over and over how they do things by the book, we have a cop mistake a gun for a taser, another shoot a 13-year-old, another abuse a military officer, etc. Funny at the end the the Pat Robertson the woman says, "maybe they need more training", as if recognizing a bright yellow plastic taser needs a lot of training, or that more training might make them worse.
1 detail that still gets me is Floyd exclaiming, "my mother just died". His mother died 2 years before, and he was 46 years old. There's something weirdly regressive about the whole thing.
I still wonder what registered with the jury. I don't get the sense the defense did a very good job, but it's still a mystery til they announce.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 4:58pm
I have a possible explanation for a cop "accidently" shooting someone in a tense situation. A couple years ago I watched a video in which several cops surrounded a black man on the ground. They all had pistols drawn and aimed at him. For no apparent reason at all one of the cops [happened to be a woman] shot the guy. Another cop said why did you shoot him and she answered in a frightened vice, "I don't know". What I feel sure of in that case is that her pistol had a hair trigger, quite possibly adjusted to have a significantly lighter trigger pull than stock. A flinch or slight tightening of the hand can fire the gun. Target shooters and gun nuts like a hair trigger because the force required to pull harder tends to deflect the aim.
by A Guy Called LULU on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 5:30pm
I just appreciate hearing the anecdote, essence of human error. Too often I think people search for a "motive" (i.e.racism) with cops especially, but often enough there is: none.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 6:17pm
She said that she did not know why she shot the man
She did not say that she did not mean to shoot the man.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 9:48am
In the English language, "I did not mean to shoot him" is one of the possible interpretations of "I don't know".
Enjoy your time in America. Take only photos, leave only footprints.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:06am
I don't know why I pulled the trigger means "I fucked up."
Edit to add:
The guy was on the ground
There was no threat
She still pulled the trigger
No different than Chauvin saying Floyd was a big guy who had to be controlled, even after Floyd was dead
Bring on competent police.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:37am
There you go, hyper-interpreting to spin it with your bias - can never look at things neutrally, always a partisan.
ETA: and Lulu was pretty clear - she simply didn't know, except he suspected a hair trigger sharing the blame how you took it in another direction... As always.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:31am
You are the one asking about a Mercedes SUV as if that was why Chauvin choked Floyd to death.
Compare the testimony of the prosecution witnesses from the chief of police, to the head of the training officers, to the pulmonary and cardiology specialists and compare it to the testimony the defense witnesses in the Floyd case.
You are the one who is biased and acting like a defense attorney
You are biased.
If the police officer in the above situation shot a guy surrounded and on the ground, the officer is a screw up.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:43am
"I don't know" could also mean I'm pissed that I had to run after this guy, but I'm not going to say that out loud.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 11:52am
There you go again - in Lulu's telling there's no indication she had to run at all, but in your head you invent a chase thing. Amazing.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 11:57am
You argue that she put pressure on the trigger without realizing it
I imagine a situation where there had to be deliberate pressure put on the trigger for the gun to fire.
There is nothing to suggest the trigger was modified
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:28pm
you are really being absurd now, all that we know is Lulu sharing his own personal thoughts about an anecdote.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:39pm
No absurdity
A certainty that the officer carried a gun with a hair trigger was stated.
I think that a hair trigger could lead to the possibility of the gun firing if the officer fell
That represents a danger to the officer a the public.
In my scenario, the officer has to apply a deliberate amount of pressure for the gun to fire.
The hair trigger was mentioned as a possibility
I mentioned the possibility that the officer who shot the guy on the ground was pissed off
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:56pm
You make both of these statements in the same comment.
The second is correct.
by A Guy Called LULU on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 3:13pm
True
Mesnt to erase the first
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 7:09pm
And here's what I see on this thread: I see someone who thinks all police are liars and possible murderers, vs. like, the NYPD commissioner thinking that people who spray paint the slogan "kill cops" are just "knuckleheads". Which is the more rational person that I could trust to not make hysterical presumptions?
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:52pm
I mentioned that the police chief and training officers testified against Chauvin, breaking the blue wall of silence
I said police lie all the time.
When you read police reports of events, then watch the video, the lies become apparent.
I did not say, all police lie all the time.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 2:01pm
The Blue Wall says Chauvin was an outlier, that they normally do things by the book. That's the hill you want to die on?
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 3:27pm
The classic Blue Wall does not have the chief, training officers, etc testifying against a fellow officer.
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 7:12pm
could. This requires getting inside her head. Trials and juries are the system we have set up to do that, it's the best we've got, it's all we got. To paraphrase Churchill: the worst of all systems except for all the others. Deal with the reality of an imperfect world, everything is not a conspiracy. Only religious conservatives believe there is natural order with rules with a god directing everything that happens. The rest of us deal with the reality that there are imperfections to every system humans invent to try to have civilization because: change is the only constant.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:12pm
I think the comparison with surgeon malpractice resulting in death is helpful. If they make deadly mistakes, even if innocent of bad intent, they are liable for damages. If they make incompetent mistakes they can lose their license to practice. (And there's also this comparison: M.D.s who set up practices with deadly risky procedures because they are money makers are also sometimes criminally prosecuted.)
Have to admit some people claim racism is operative here as well. Instead of what I believe: mostly lousy doctors are willing to accept Medicaid insurance, i.e., both minority ghettoes and poor white rural areas will see a high amount of lousy medical care.
We unfortunately can't convince those determined to bend every single bad thing to a narrative of a white supremacist country. They like the idea of a conspiracy explaining irrational fear; I see this as no different as those who actually do believe in white supremacy and are fearful of losing it. It's the zeitgeist we live in. Cell phones with video cameras disseminated on social media and now social media of police body cams make everyone a reporter, and a judge and jury. People can confirm their favored narrative with that and continue to build it (bias verification.)
As I pointed out before, there's this difference with M.D.'s: we don't disseminate a lot of videos on social media of what doctors do to people. And even if we did, lots of people wouldn't understand what's happening in them. But everybody apparently knows the proper way to be a cop.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:01pm
"She did not say that she did not mean to shoot the man."
Yes she did in so many words. If my scenario is correct the cop was saying, as she was realizing what just happened, that she did not 'intend' to shoot the detainee. She was correct in saying this because she did not, in fact, intend to shoot a man laying on the ground and surrounded by cops. "I don't know, I didn't mean too," is what I heard even though the last phrase was unspoken.
:I don't know why I pulled the trigger means "I fucked up. ... She still pulled the trigger." I agree that she fucked up. I disagree that her fuckup was a deliberate act.
"IMO the shooting happened because of bad procedure and a weapon that could be fired with a very small amount of force being applied which meant that it was unsafe to point that weapon at a person because normal reflexes such as merely tightening her grip in a tense situation could make it fire. The same situation could occur when holding a taser in one hand and a pistol in the other. There are many ways and reasons to condemn the entire way the incident played out but to condemn it as a deliberate act rather than the culmination of stupid procedures is a mistake, IMO. If you do not understand the idea of a hair trigger being unnecessarily dangerous and possibly being the cause of the unnecessary shot, try cocking a big rat trap and then holding your finger against the traps trigger as you bend over to put it in place.
by A Guy Called LULU on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:05pm
And in all professions, people are legally liable for "deadly" fuck ups, real or metaphorical. Getting outraged about these things as if they are a case of getting off "scot-free" is the faulty thinking. We have torts when bad or unfair things happen, we don't have "scot-free".
Those who like the surety of executing everyone for mistakes, and dictators deciding when a mistake is made, perhaps they will like the model the Taliban may soon re-install in Afghanistan.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:20pm
You know for a fact that there was a hair trigger?
Cops lie all the time, so "I don't know" may or may not be true
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 1:20pm
In English that means he's guessing, but he thinks it a pretty solid hunch.
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 3:32pm
I don't think the Barr decision bizarre at all, makes perfect PR sense for any administration not to do any plea deal with such a bellweather case and make it go to trial by jury. Whatever you do on a plea, certain constituencies might be angry (with that one, pro-tough-policing people). Better to let the jury be the scapegoats with whatever groups dislike their decision.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 6:09pm
I hope someone points the Pat Robertson tape out to Wasow if he doesn't know about it, that should be thrown into his mix. While Robertson's not an indicator of as big a bunch of wingers like he used to be, it's still significant and comes before the Toledo video
(p.s., comes to mind that what he likes to do is figure out what "narrative" the majority buys into at any time. Why some end up winning as the dominant story, while others stay labeled as extremist or radical , and why.)
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 5:48pm
Interesting that the Hate Crimes Task Force felt compelled to retweet this one. "Kill Cops" "words matter"
(speaking of words mattering, I for one got a laugh that there are still people in the policing biz that use the term "knuckleheads")
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/15/2021 - 7:06pm
this is an incredible one, he wasn't handcuffed behind his back, and they missed that he had a gun in his pocket, and when they started to discover it in his pants, he accused them of grabbing his balls and this gave him a distraction to get the gun out? and they ended up having a shootout in the hospital room:
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:00am
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:42am
Seth Abramson:
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 12:57am
Op-ed author is Law prof @ColumbiaLaw, author of "Policing the Open Road". I know this is a hot topic as regards reforming forces.
I think I heard or read something the other day that we've already just done it in NYC but it's not really that big of a game changer here, for us it's a shrug, for other places it might be a big deal. We're different because: we have always had a separate "traffic and parking cop" force that's not the same as regular NYPD and doesn't do anything else; and we now have a city-wide speed limit of 25 mph, so like accidents are fender benders and traffic often goes slower than that, walking is faster sometimes! NYPD would do traffic like this: they had monthly quotas for traffic tickets at some precincts! They'd take a couple hours with sit with a radar on a street where they know everyone goes fast and get their quota pronto.Us drivers would be ever so grateful to have someone who does it full time and not on a quota basis. Within the city, there's just not many of the kind of stops that one sees in so many videos, driving is just not the same here. NYPD in a squad car is too busy with other stuff to like bother with pulling someone over for having a tail light out, and traffic cops wouldn't do that where it's busy traffic, it would make it worse. you'd only get that kind of stop once you cross the border out of town or near the border on one of the circumference highways.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 4:29am
Atlanta PD clearly having none of that kind of talk:
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/19/2021 - 2:56pm
Radar equipped signs with cameras might be an alternative.
Send the ticket to the owner of the plate number
by rmrd0000 on Mon, 04/19/2021 - 5:16pm
I am curious if the person saying "stop the fucking gun" is a police abolitionist. Irony to the point of absurdity.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 4:52am
just saw this interview on CNN:
She DID NOT EVEN MENTION SHOOTINGS BY POLICE. They are a comparative nothingburger, numbers wise. To her, a public health expert on guns, former E.R.doc, and other related background: even mass shootings are not the main problem. The main horrific epidemic, according to her, seen up close and personal by E.R. docs every day, many who may not come out of the concurrent covid and gun violence epidemics sane:
BUT noooo, our focus as a nation must be on approx. 1,000 deaths per year caused by police, with a majority of those deaths white. BECAUSE THAT IS THE NARRATIVE made dominant by viral videos of black deaths by police on social media.
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 4:27pm
Gun control is not forgotten. Guns rights organizations still have major impact on gun laws. Obama thought Sandy Hook would make gun control easier.He was wrong. Current efforts to change gun laws still face major hurdles.
Consider this:
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/547829-bidens-gun-control-push-poses-danger-for-midterms
No one forgot about gun control. If it were easy, it would have been done a long time ago
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 5:12pm
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 7:56pm
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:25pm
by artappraiser on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 10:31pm
We have a pretty good idea why a 13-year old gets caught up in a gang
A few people make it out of their situation and make to Harvard or Stanford
Most won't
The situation played out in "Hillbilly Elegy"
The book and movie view poverty as moral failings
Pull yourself up by your bootstraps
The portrayals received pushback
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/11/hillbilly-elegy-doesnt-reflect-the-appalachia-i-know/617228/
Papers publish articles pretending that people care about "root causes"
by rmrd0000 on Fri, 04/16/2021 - 11:46pm
Progress in police reform
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/18/us/police-reform-bills.html
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 04/18/2021 - 4:55pm
by artappraiser on Sun, 04/18/2021 - 5:31pm
Chauvin is accused of taking the life of George Floyd.
That homicide has nothing to do with other crimes committed in the community
by rmrd0000 on Sun, 04/18/2021 - 6:00pm
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/19/2021 - 3:39pm
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/19/2021 - 9:11pm
by artappraiser on Mon, 04/19/2021 - 10:38pm
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/20/2021 - 10:34pm
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/20/2021 - 10:44pm
Um, bodycam shows the 16-yr. old girl shot in Columbus was attempting to stab two others with a knife
Columbus Police Show Body Camera Footage Of Officer Fatally Shooting 16-Year-Old Girl
Police showed footage of the officer shooting the girl as she appeared to attempt to stab two people with a knife.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:27am
a respondent to that call that wasn't armed with a gun, if still alive, would probably be in the hospital along with the two others with stab wounds.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:31am
There are questions whether the teenager was the one who called the police because she was threatened by two other girls/women
One cop "calms" the crowd by saying "Blue Lives Matter".
https://www.rawstory.com/cops-chant-blue-lives-matter-after-shooting-teen/
Hopefully, the investigation will gives us fuller details.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:09am
You know, there was a time when people were killing each other off in different states and countries, and we really didn't need "details" to go about our business. In the 80s-90s i lived in places with worse murder rates, even a settling down war zone for a bit, but even there gunshot tracking wasn't a daily hobby. It's some kind of porn, all this "defend ourselves" and "crime scenes" like those live cop shows. Sure, we knew cops were bastards, so we tried to avoid. Now ew think getting pissed off or going out in the street to do stupid shit is all "activism" - for the most part it's just rubber necking.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:54am
You are wrong
Many cities are seeking police reform because of pressure from activists
Some localities have elected more progressive district attorneys.
Cities are creating units to deal with mental health issues.
Welcome to 2021
Chauvin was convicted
His buddies will likely go for plea deals.
You can't avoid police if they are going to stop you for not being able to see that you have a temporary tag.
Cities make money off of police making nonsense stops.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:32am
Progressive cities have progressive pols already - how's that working out?
Have you ever considered there's also something wrong with the people?
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:41am
Police carry guns and are supposed to protect people.
Most people do not commit crimes
Police cannot kill those who commit crimes if there are other options
Police cannot treat everyone in a group as criminals
When police departments are suspected of being biased, they should be investigated
The DOJ is investigating the Minneapolis PD
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/21/us/justice-department-investigation-minneapolis-police.html
Police have to earn community respect
Note in the police homicide in Columbus, Ohio, the cop shot within seconds of arriving.
Protests began because witnesses thought that he was too quick on the trigger
Police mistrust is not created by the media, it is created by the actions of police.
Were there other options?
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 11:09am
It is clear that things are wrong with people
Thugs stormed the Capitol
Those thugs do not represent all white people
Republicans lie and say the Presidential election was stolen
A majority of whites voted for Trump
Republicans are trying to suppress votes
White people who voted for Trump do not represent all white people
Crime is high in cities
All Black people have to repent
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:27pm
fiixed it for you
Crime is high in citiesAll Black people have to repentCrime is at horrific levels in poor inner city neighborhoods
The residents suffer horribly and want more attention to the problem but politicians they elect and elite national activists focus on other grievances, which distracts from the problems of those poor
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 3:50pm
oh and nothing, absolutely nothing, represents people of one skin color, except of course, their skin color. And even that becomes increasingly hard to discern as the human race continues to procreate outside of small local tribes. Everything else countering that is a narrative construct designed to fit colors of skin into political tribal affililiations of choice.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 5:10pm
Add to that that rmrd often represents the view of a minority of black people, for example a wide majority of blacks are in favor of a voter id requirement. Not saying that there isn't voter suppression of minority votes and that blacks aren't concerned about it.
by ocean-kat on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:38pm
I'm not in the minority when it comes to thinking voter IDs are discriminatory.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:48pm
Americans Oppose Many Voting Restrictions — But Not Voter ID Laws; APR. 2, 2021 @ FiveThirtyEight.com
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:06pm
A Rasmussen poll from March 2021 asked Blacks if voter ID laws were discriminatory
The full report is only available to Platinum members
Bits and pieces were available in different publications
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2021/03/17/poll-75-support-voter-id-law-including-60-of-democrats/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:36pm
you are quoting Rassmussen and Breitbart? lol!
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:46pm
As good as your tweet snippets from James Lindsay and Zaid Julani.
Edit to add:
I stand by my position on voter ID
It similar to the one taken by Stacey Abrams the intent of the Republican voter ID laws it's to target a segment of the population
Student IDs rejected, fishing licenses are OK
https://www.complex.com/life/stacey-abrams-gives-john-kennedy-long-list-objections-to-georgia-voter-bill
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 11:10pm
Note, historically places like the Black Belt of Alabama had very few courthouses and other facilities for a very poor population often without transport, so getting ID was continually difficult and a point of discrimination for preventing voting by making it hard and expensive to get ID. It's 2021, i don't know if this still persists, but I'm still always suspicious of these requirements, along with bastards at the polls challenging people and intimidating them. Additionally there was at least one awful case of 5 years imprisonment for falsely voting by an ex-con who thought she was eligible. These types of issues seem to largely work to disenfranchise blacks. Considering the rash of new voting laws recently pushed by Republican state officials, I'd surmise this is still same ole same old. So yes, while voter ID may be benign and reasonable in principle, there may be locations where it's used as a wedge. Note the long lines at scarce voting booths in *some* precincts in say Southern states (or others, not just the South).
But Blacks in DC undoubtedly have little problem with voter ID.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 1:17am
Junkies passing fake money are criminals. People shooting kids are definitely criminals. In general police have to deal with a lot of scum to protect the rest of that. Obviously there's some crappy profiling that goes along with this, but much as I dislike the police, i wouldn't want their job nor would I want them refunded. Tell me real reforms. Yeah, they can de-escalate better, quotas are a recipe for disaster, some basic training in racism...
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:38pm
Prosecutors open criminal probe into police who allegedly broke the arm of a 73-year-old woman with dementia
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/04/20/karen-garner-video-loveland-criminal-probe/
An officer did not call for a mental health unit to be dispatched
Police MO
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:50pm
Oh wait, she's white?
But yes, cops could be trained a lot better in non-dickish behavior to de-escalate non-threatening situations. It's not even good for getting compliance in dangerous situations - it creates the most resistance, which becomes a danger to the police. The cops at Wendy's with Reyshard were overall quite cool. The cop with Sandra Bland or the army lieutenant were total dicks. Does it take a mental health person to handle, or just a mobile app to remind, "i do not have to be a dick yet"
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 2:01pm
One thing I learned over my lifetime: there's some really bad people in every line of work. And lots of just incompetents too. But careful when microscoping in on the bad ones, can skew your judgment about reality about not just the whole profession but the whole world. (Hey! that might happen to some cops and, like, soldiers, a lot, they start to presume everyone is bad?)
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 3:25pm
The Chauvin case was one of the few times that good cops testified against a bad cop
The Blue Wall of Silence exists.
Police departments create the us versus them image
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 5:03pm
Police mistrust is not created by the media, it is created by the actions of police.
Wrong it is very much created by social media and media stressing misconduct towards people with one skin color, especially with the advent of everyone having a cell phone that can take videos. Larger number of deaths and abuse by police of people with majority white skin color is not covered.
Because divisive grievance based on race is stoked by far right and far left. And it is monetarily profitable for MSM to further stoke what is started by far right and far left. And amplified by foreign trolls who can see a good weapon to try to destroy an enemy society when they see one.
Furthermore, the amount of abuse is exaggerated by all actors because it is so profitable either monetarily or in other ways. Heck a maniac narcissist troll won the presidency of the U.S. that way. Once he was out of the social media limelight, oh look social media and MSM ($$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$) turned even more heavily towards race and policing, gosh I wonder why that is.
Our new president knows how to handle this all from a lifetime of experience both personal and political, but far left and far right have vested interests in seeing him fail. Mho, far left is more dangerous, more invested in grievance right now. Far right is just stoking what they can to eke out survival, the left gives them the ammunition.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 4:13pm
further example: large number of "Asian-Americans" recently decided "Afro-Americans" getting all the attention as victims of this or that via viral social media cell phone vids then amplified by MSM for profit. They started working on their own social media vids, showing how they, too are victimized, and often enough, by Afro-Americans, go figure. Then the mass shooting of massage parlors offered a perfect chance to amp up the Olympics contest of victimhood narratives, as all Americans focus on that news... they won for a while but now they are losing the attention again...
edit to add: the latter is because those activists happen to like the police and want more protection furnished by them, and that certainly doesn't fit today's narrative!
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 6:36pm
not only that, but the same day Biden and Harris were obediently pandering to the concerns of the tribe du jour, I see the "Hispanic Caucus" was sneaking behind the back of both "Black" and "Asian" lobbies to try to get some attention from POTUS. As if "Hispanic" didn't represent 50 different cultural heritages and like 12 voting patterns....not to mention many with that background tell the census they are "white".
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 6:22pm
RE: Protests
Whatever they are trying to do, facts are is that they are not saving lives, numbers wise.
READ IT research showing that communities with BLM protests from 2014 to 2019 saw a reduction in police homicides but an uptick in murders.
And deaths and maimings could ramp up horribly as more and more buy guns to supposedly "protect themselves" as policing pulls back at request of protests.
Furthermore, do note that once a small protest starts, white leftist elite move in to direct and foreign trolls assist. Empowerment for who? Sweet irony. I would not be surprised if historians in hindsight see the protests clearly as EXTRAORDINARILY counter-productive, causing much more of what they supposedly were trying to counteract. Especially as they occurred concurrent with the upheaval of a worldwide pandemic with massive death and economic upheaval and worldwide loss of faith in government to protect.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 4:34pm
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/20/2021 - 11:40pm
the above mentioned is titled
We have enough proof
What’s the purpose of sharing violent police videos anymore, other than to traumatize Black communities?
By Allissa V. Richardson @ Vox.com, Apr 19, 2021, 2:30pm EDT
by artappraiser on Tue, 04/20/2021 - 11:51pm
Without video, the words of witnesses to George Floyd's murder would have been ignored.
The murder of Walter Scott by a North Charleston police officer would have been used to conclude that.Scott attacked the officer. In truth, Scott was shot in the back. A Taser was planted near his body to support the lie. Even with the. video disproving the officer's lie, the local jury hung. It was only federal prosecution that sent the officer to jail. The video was crucial to the prosecution.
The author proposes that "we" simply start listening to Black witnesses that challenge official police reports. Does she expect this to happen by magic? George Floyd without the video? Chauvin would be free.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:14am
Rep. Val Demings (FL-10), former Orlando Police Chief:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 12:06am
Puppy love? K-9 attack
Worse, the told the guy's mother to sit in the car and shut up, instead of asking her where her son was (in the shower of course)https://kdvr.com/news/local/suspect-sues-police-after-k9-attack/
PS - they're white.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 2:49am
L.A.'s mayor suggests $3 billion more for LAPD for new fiscal year:
p.s. He's a Democrat. I'm pretty sure he knows what BLM thinks, what Joe Biden thinks, not to mention what his voters think. Worth a reminder:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 3:13am
3% increase, $1.76b operational (vs pensions, healthcare, etc)
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-20/garcetti-proposes-sl...
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 4:12am
thanks for reality based correction! always appreciated when I too sometimes fall for political weapon spin.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 4:44pm
REALITY: Brooklyn Center, Minnesota (of the Duante Wright shooting) LIKE MANY AREAS IN THIS COUNTRY can no longer be classified as an old-style "Afro-American community" (translation: segregated urban ghetto of Afro-Americans, growing rarer every day)
but has become a very poor suburb of immigrants, as Afro-Americans of any means have moved out of the town to safer and more well-funded suburbs. Many of the newer residents of Brooklyn Center are immigrants from west Africa, predominately Liberian but also Kenyan and Nigerian, throw in significant numbers of Hmong and Laotian immigrants.
This new demographic orientation has enough smarts to recently elect their own kind for like mayor and such, but since there is no fucking money to enact any changes, they are just getting started (as more born-here Americans of all colors of skin move on and away), and one of their problems of many, besides not having much of a tax base to do anything, is that their police force is composed mainly of people who no longer live there and don't git them. Baby steps, just starting out.
My druthers would be: DON'T SUBJECT THEM TO YOUR FUCKING NATIONAL OLD TIMEY RACIAL NARRATIVE vis-a-vis policing and "black American descendants of slaves vs. white supremacy system". PUHLEEZZ let them be to work on it themselves!. Introducing old-timey "Afro-American" agendas and the new woke versions of same would really be unfair, especially as many of the old tribes have chosen to move away themselves and desert them
If they were given time to handle this and develop a new paradigm, they might show everyone else a thing or two about how to change things. They actually have experience at understanding other cultures and chose this American one despite all of its supposed downsides.
READ THIS and understand that we are not dealing with 1980 U.S.A. anymore. Our country is less and less "black" and "white" both literally and figuratively, and trying to fit it into the old narratives is just not going to work as much as people desire it be so
Unrest in Minnesota town offers warning to other U.S. suburbs, experts say
By Tim Craig and Silvia Foster-Frau, @ WashingtonPost.com, April 16, 2021 at 8:34 a.m. EDT
filed from BROOKLYN CENTER, Minn .
Edit to add: on the other hand, if you would like to encourage a lot of them to end up switching to voting for Trump types, keep up with the old timey rabble rousing in their community.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 5:58pm
You have several things that non-whites have to do.
From your link
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/brooklyn-center-diversity-suburbs/2021/04/16/ee9ff6e8-9d66-11eb-9d05-ae06f4529ece_story.html
You say that it is the non-white population that needs to appease. It appears that the police department does not want change. The article notes that non-white political candidates who knock on doors often have police called on them. What do white residents have to do to prove that it is not the 1980s?
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:40pm
Yeah, they didn't understand where i we coming from either - i had a bottle of ouzo and a toga hanging from my rearview, and they had me take a drunk test.
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:51pm
Still there are cases where cops act awfulfunding ways to get rid of them is a plus
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 3:23pm
Similar rational threads I ran across on U.S. police reform. First one's by an expert, in 2019. recommended by a rational person seeking rationality yesterday, and another by just a rational person not into being fed emotional narratives for MSM profit, recommended by a Russian-Jewish-American. "Voice of reason against the madness." (They're out there, rational people who are not into playing politics, believe it or not; you just have to look for them, they just don't make a lot of noise.)
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 7:34pm
Hmm, RJA, Talmud + borscht, where would we find such an illuminati?
Would Americans accept The Wrap used on George Floyd? How would that affect his claustrophobia, his earlier inability to breathe? (also that departure from the car was much more, er, abrupt - and i think that suspect was a bit lighter than Floyd)
by PeraclesPlease on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 7:46pm
here's their exact opposite; official BLM has nothing on Bree when she wants to stir shit and get people hating on each other more, pump up the volume on that narrative to the max, babee, get yer anarchy on:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:13pm
He's white, former Republican, former Bush admin., now an Independent, extremely rational law professor, he could be your friend, Bree, BUT NOOOOO, you gotta make him the cannibal enemy:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:09pm
Bree Newsome is the only option for partnership?
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:43pm
yes she is your only option, her and her friends like this here and official BLM types. Unless many of those promoting "the narrative" loudly and specifically renounce these types, including people exactly like you, rmrd, they are you and you are them. You can't get away with not saying anything and treating them like allies. Doesn't work, your movement will be fringe forever. The majority doesn't relish defunding the police much less the idea of living in Pol Pot's Cambodia, and you won't renounce Pol Pot. You are either with those people or against them. If not against them, you will fail.
Look at Noah Smith's reaction. He's a liberal. Those people eating are Manhattan liberals. Your "allies" are attacking them.
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:25pm
Rubbish
You proudly post that Gavin Newson and Joe Biden ignore BLM.
BLM's defunding impact is small.
I had not heard Bree Newsome's name in a very long time.
I said people who break the law should go to jail.
I say police reform, you say defund the police
I don't take you seriously.
by rmrd0000 on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:43pm
an extremely good counter to counselor Painter's argument:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 9:59pm
On Merrick Garland's DOJ announced probe of MPD:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 8:26pm
On a "robust majority" of NYC Asian-Americans supporting Yang's proposal for more funds for hate crime policing, despite "progressive" claims about "community-based alternatives" (+ bonus Makiya knife fight comments)
earlier:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:39pm
Robert Reich caught spinning about prison population:
by artappraiser on Wed, 04/21/2021 - 10:48pm
is the June 12, 2020 WaPo op-ed by Patrick Sharkey
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Sharkey
edit to add rest of Yang's comments with more excerpts:
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 1:43am
President Biden is calling for the passage of the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act, which calls for reforms including changing police immunity laws and bans chokeholds at the federal level.
https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/biden-calls-on-congress-to-pass-police-reform-bill-110617669990
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 10:34am
Police: Sixth-leading cause of death for young black men
https://isr.umich.edu/news-events/news-releases/police-sixth-leading-cause-of-death-for-young-black-men-2/
The leading causes of death for young Black men are accidents and suicides
Edit to add:
People want police, but many times good police do not arrive on the scene
The teen who called the police about a fake $20 bill regrets his call
Daniel Prude's family regrets their call to police
BLM protests occur after homicides caused by police
Stop police homicides and you stop BLM protests
If a study shows that police homicides go down after BLM protests, BLM is doing their job
If police are pulling back after being held to account and homicides go up, then we need better policing
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:19am
Playing bullshit w numbers
With 47 million blacks in the US, this makes it sound like 470k are getting whacked by police each year, when the number of blacks killed is in the 400-500 range, far far less than homicides. And even in the real comparison for causes of death, those 6th and 7th causes are way down there.
https://www.cdc.gov/healthequity/lcod/men/2017/nonhispanic-black/index.h...
But a lot of effort to avoid thinking "maybe just maybe black people are also doing too many crimes".
https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_60816a7ae4b05c42907257c5
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 12:50pm
Yeah there's all kinds of ways to make a narrative that confirms your bias. For example, this guy I just ran across isn't bothering with bullshit with numbers, he's going whole hog for emotions to create his:
thread continues with 13 more. Now of course, one might ask: where are the white kids? Well, I am sure that there's plenty of those, they are perhaps not so much about being victims of older people shooting each other but kids playing with guns they found. And plenty of people have made the point with similar social media postings. What's the diff; dead is dead? Well, one type of death might be more about criminal activity that policing has a chance of stopping while the other might be more about the harder task of politicians somehow cracking down on handguns owned by people and how they store them.
Telling stories, it's all about what you want to focus on. And in lots of stories, I am seeing a lot of irrational blaming of the idea of "police" when it's really a metaphor about authority and government being responsible for lousy lives.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 1:42pm
Oh, you mean like "stupid evil (likely black) motherfuckers with guns are the #1 cause of death among black children 0-12"?
Quite possibly, but where's the equity angle in that?
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 2:58pm
Also, as far as the numbers, I've posted more than one serious article on this thread about open-minded sociological studies that have tried to evaluate the results of BLM protests on deaths by police in the areas where there were strong protest efforts (since before George Floyd). They found that while deaths by police decreased a little in those areas, homicides increased by at least the same number, basically a wash. Certainly no more sense of control by residents over their own lives; a trade: less police interference for more violence and death by criminal activity.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 2:06pm
You consider it BS
Open your eyes, when people are killed by police, protests occur immediately
The police are not trusted
Solving homicides requires people in the neighborhoods feeling free to give information
Because police are not trusted, information is not shared
When Chauvin was convicted, neighborhoods throughout the country cheered.
Floyd died because of a fake $20 bill
Eric Garner over selling loose cigarettes
Their crimes were not death penalty crimes
The resistance Floyd and Garner displayed was not death penalty resistance
The best thing to do is to avoid contact with police
That is hard to do if police initiate the encounter because they had problems seeing your temporary license plate.
Poverty rates correlate heavily with crime in Black and white neighborhoods
Reduce poverty to reduce homicides
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 3:20pm
Floyd died because of 8 priors, because of passing a fake $20, because if his fentanyl addiction, because of freaking out & not staying out in the back seat, because of screaming "i can't breathe" when in the back seat so cops didn't take him serious later on the ground, because cops didn't pay attention to his actual risks and his signs of losing consciousness with the knee on or whatever. (not noticing the guy on the ground is dying is a problem even without a knee on him)
Floyd passing a fake $20 bill cost the guy running cash register about 3 hours of his work, assuming he's making $7/hour. You think that's okay or just an irrelevant joke, nothing to do with why the police wanted Floyd, not his fault. You're awfully callous towards other people's time, other people's work.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 3:53pm
"Solving homicides requires people in the neighborhoods feeling free to give information
Because police are not trusted, information is not shared"
The more common reason I've read that people don't cooperate with police is fear of gangs in their own neighborhood. In the end the only solution to that isn't defund or abolish the police but a greater police presence in those neighborhoods
by ocean-kat on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 5:33pm
Competent police
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 7:04pm
2018-2019 poll conducted by Vox and Civis Analytics found that most black people wanted more police in their neighborhood.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 7:37pm
2021 TOO!!! Vox and Data for Progress poll, this April 2-5. I did a whole thread on polls on that starting with that here
He's didn't even comment on that thread, probably refused to read it, he's in denial, invested in the idea that he and his activist friends on teevee and social media and at protests (many of which are elite white college-age people) represent "the black community."
Number one, there is no such thing as "the black community", that's a phrase used to build their narrative that everyone with black skin thinks alike. There is such a thing as the Congressional Black Caucus, they pander to activist's agendas.
Number two, truth is the numbers just don't add up that BLM-activism being a majority attitude, even among "blacks" much less other minorities.
And truth also is that numbers-wise, the police abuse problem is very small compared to lots of other problems we have as a society. It's real, but it's minor, less than deaths & injury from lightning strikes. Yeah, every life is sacred but a lot more lives and suffering have been sacrificed on the altar of civilian violence -- medical malpractice and poor medical care--COVID --or scratch that, fucking illness from the air and water-
It's a hysteria, SERIOUSLY., A hysteria from a narrative fueled by social media and MSM. NOT MUCH DIFFERENT from the hysteria caused by Trump claiming he won the election. I'm very serious, I think it's going to be a huge chapter in history books, no different than after the Black Death. People looking for evil to blame. One big groiup is going with racism and colonialism, another is going with Qnon and Trump, another is militia anarchist types, etc. It's a totally irrational blaming of all kinds of things on policing, they're scapegoats for crazy times. (Not to say that it's not partly their fault that they became scapegoats--if you always have the back of the assholes in your group, tends to happen.)
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 8:19pm
Comes to mind police have replaced Israel as the favorite evil. Many lefties still think Israel is a primary evil but it's clear they been losing ground on the outrage front since lots of Arab rulers and their minions stopped going with that narrative. It's getting harder and harder to fuel a boycott against Israel, cause they are just nasty sometimes, like everyone else.
Which brings to mind:
Racism and hate is not going away, it's the way lots of dumb people think. You can't avoid it, you can outlaw public statements about it, like in France, but they're still thinking it.
SO, when you hire cops, or teachers, or garbage men, or accountants, or soldiers or whatever, some of them are going to be racist against someone of another color. You can outlaw behavior, but you can't outlaw what's inside their head. It's just one of those human flaws we have to factor into things!
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 8:50pm
reposting the tweeted cut out from that poll that Yglesias retweeted, JUST SO RMRD HAS TO LOOK AT IT:
that's why I accused him once of practicing a posting style of news that's insidious. Gets the reader thinking that's what all black folks think. It's simply not! At all. He represents only himself and a small number of black people who think like him and probably a larger number of spoiled white millennials.
BLM activists of all types are a minority of a minority. Current created narrative is that every black person is on board, plus a lot of white liberals and left Democrats. They're all invested in pounding the narrative.
But Ben Crump is not Al Sharpton is not Jim Clyburn is not Kamala Harris is not Glenn Loury, etc., they all have different takes. Nor Clarence Thomas for that matter. Nor official BLM anarchists.
Joe Biden went for the best pollsters he could get in order to win and followed their advice every step of the way. What is the first loudly public thing he said when asked about BLM demands: police need more funding, not less!
Now he's murmuring healing sounds no doubt because: he doesn't want more riots and unrest from this minority. PLUS he truly cares about each individual case of any family that's hurting, that much I am not cynical about.
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 8:36pm
I stand by the position that people want competent police.
That is straightforward
Are you arguing that communities will tolerate police abuse for police protection?
Do you think Stop and Frisk was a rational technique?
Competent police.
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 9:01pm
why do you care what I think of stop n' frisk? I'm just one person on the internet. I don't really care what you think of it either if you weren't often pushing a narrative about how humiliating and abusive and useless it is.
I would, on the other hand, be interested to see any current polls of people in high crime neighborhoods support it or not. I also would care to hear from experts on whether it would help in the current environment of increasing gun crime and increasing number of handguns in places where possession of them is already illegal.
I have noticed, however, that the current Brooklyn Borough president supports stop and frisk; he's black, he's also an ex-cop.
Brooklyn is 34% black. He was re-elected as the incumbent in 2017 with 83% of the vote. Apparently his beliefs about policing don't bother many of the blacks in Brooklyn (including many very low income in the outer borough) and very many liberal lefty whites and many other minority groups and immigrants.
He is currently running in the primary for mayor of NYC and by most polls is 2nd place after Andrew Yang.
Hmmm, what a tough question for me! who should I go with?
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 10:43pm
I point to Malcolm Gladwell's note re the Kansas City experiment, where the community supposed tougher police methods in high crime areas - largely meaning *blocks*, not districts, but that applyung those tough love tactics in lower crime areas would be seen as abusive.
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:07pm
Thank you for remembering that. You know, I believe they do have the ability to go down to block level on methods with systems like Compstat. A lot of variation on micro-levels is part of how they got the crime rate down in NYC, they'd go whole hog invasion when they got intel. (I imagine they can't do that when they have to call up from a force partly ravaged with covid infections for protest duty all the time...not to mention tending to professional looting parties scattered all over town afterwards)
by artappraiser on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:49pm
"supported" tough love, not "supposed"... mobile phone typing, sheesh...
by PeraclesPlease on Fri, 04/23/2021 - 12:32am
by PeraclesPlease on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:16pm
He does not support the Bloomberg version of Stop and Frisk.
by rmrd0000 on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:18pm
"I stand by the position that people want competent police."
Everyone would like everyone to be more competent. More competent police, more competent waiters in restaurants, more competent doctors, more competent bloggers on dagblog, more competent everything, everyone, everywhere. But that doesn't address anything I posted or Arta posted. It's a non sequitur designed to change the subject. One of your most common avoidance techniques.
by ocean-kat on Thu, 04/22/2021 - 11:07pm
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