cmaukonen's picture

    What happened to us ?

    When I was around 2 years old, according to my mother, my parents had just purchased a small house in Altoona Pa.  Shortly there after a tropical system came up the coast and was threatening Long Island NY where my grandparents had a large house boat. They made the trip to Long Island where my father help my grandfather keep the boat moored and from being damaged by the storm.  Unfortunately that same system triggered and ice storm that send a tree right down on their house.

    They simply left the house and went to Ohio where my aunt and uncle let them park a small trailer on their property while my father built a new house. I remember when we were living in that house one summer, I guess I was about 5 at the time, I decided to do some exploring with my younger brother. We walked across two large fields  but by the time we got to the end, it was beginning to storm. So I took my brother and went to a nearby house and knocked on the door. The lady answered and after some questions found out who I was and where I lived and called my father who came to get us.

    As our family grew my father decided to build another, much larger house. Like the previous one he had a lot of help from friends and family.  Sometime much later I remember him taking my mother and brothers and sister and I one night on a trip from Ohio where we lived to eastern Pa. He had to rescue a friend he new from work who's car had broken down. A VW bug, I believe. We towed it behind our car all the way into Cleveland and then went home.

    My brothers and I would go and play up the street with the neighbor's kids all the time and the parents there would also keep an eye on us. When they came down to our house it was the same.  My father sometimes counsel parents that he knew and their kids. Like the time our milkman got all upset because his son did not want to continue the dairy farm. He wanted to be an engineer. So my father went over and talked to both of them and helped our milk man realize that maybe being and engineer was best for his son.

    When we went to Florida the first time, a family friend - who did not live particularly close by - would go over to our house in Ohio every weekend to make sure everything was OK. After my father died, we stayed with my grand parents up in Pa. until my mother could get the estate in order and figure out where she wanted to live.

    I could go on and on withe other such incidents but you get my drift. People help one and other and were generally not looking for remuneration in return. But something has changed in that.  Some call it self reliance but it seems more like a self-centeredness that has taken over. Were what was considered common kindness and courtesy is not looked down upon by more that a few. An I got mine, to hell with you attitude. Everyman for himself and the devil take the hindmost. To the extent that when one does do someting for a friend or relative,  it invokes some kind of suspicion and cynicism.  Where one wonders what it is the giver is looking to get in return.

    While Seisetsu was the master of Engaku in Kamakura he required larger quarters, since those in which he was teaching were overcrowded. Umezu Seibei, a merchant of Edo, decided to donate five hundred pieces of gold called ryo toward the construction of a more commodious school. This money he brought to the teacher.

    Seisetsu said: "All right. I will take it."

    Umezu gave Seisetsu the sack of gold, but he was dissatisfied with the attitude of the teacher. One might live a whole year on three ryo, and the merchant had not even been thanked for five hundred.

    "In that sack are five hundred ryo," hinted Umezu.

    "You told me that before," replied Seisetsu.

    "Even if I am a wealthy merchant, five hundred ryo is a lot of money," said Umezu.

    "Do you want me to thank you for it?" asked Seisetsu.

    "You ought to," replied Uzemu.

    Why should I?" inquired Seisetsu. "The giver should be thankful."


    We should express our appreciation, but also be grateful for the chance to give as well.



    Comments

    Thanks for your post. I grew up in Ohio, but I don't recognize the state today. The Palin rallies in '08 shocked me. What happened to the reasonable, friendly people I remember growing up. And people were quiet about their business. I didn't know until the black minister came to my Dad's funeral that my Dad had donated the land for his church.

    Re "self reliance", I have "studied" on it. I think we have lost self reliance. Sure I can go to Home Depot get some lumber, crank up my table saw and make bookshelves. But most of the goods and services I consume and rely upon are "packaged" and delivered by giant institutions of one kind or another. I am not self reliant, I am reliant upon the system and as an individual have no power at all to change the system. For example, the difference between lowe's and home depot is nil, and that equates to very little power.

    Somehow we need to deconstruct the system under which we live but so far I am unwilling to retire to my 10 acres, sell my car and divorce myself from a qualified hospital.   


    Yup, they nab us with these damned conveniences.  I don't know....after reading Donal's post about post-grads and their MBA's and how they're all working as waiters and customer service reps, I'm inclined to think maybe we should be teaching our children how to build houses and sew clothing.  But that's my pessimistic side talking.  I think...

     


    Liz, look around you and tell me what you see. Big box stores that sells a large varied of merchandise in both the vertical and horizontal plane at easily affordable prices within most budgets and all made in either China or southeast Asia.  Same to for the grocery markets. After you see your environment for what it offers you as a consumer, tell me how many stand alone butcher shops there were, or bakeries that have fresh baked bread made that very day on the shelves, or the farmer's market where you can get fresh produce straight from the farm depending on the season. On top of that, how many electronic shops are there to repair your electrical appliances from TV/flat screens and radios to computers, mixers, crock pots and toasters. They're all gone. We've lost that ability to work with our hands, to use our heads to think and apply knowledge to fix what we break. It's cheaper to replace a broken appliance than it is to repair it.  We lost it all because education was advertised as the only road to a better life. I have a degree, but it's my technical abilities that gets me hired...the degree is only necessary to fill a slot on the paperwork that indicates my educational level. Unfortunately, even technical expertise has its' limits when a business decides to go with the cheapest item and hire people, at wages slightly above minimum wage, who only have know how to remove and replace entire units...troubleshooting a broken unit is a waste of time, money and resources as well as lost production time, so it's easier and cheaper to just remove and replace an entire unit the first instance a problem occurs. It really boils down to businesses expectation of growth and consolidation that has run their smaller competitors out of the business and given the public fewer choices in product selection as well as employment expectations...they expect the public to keep buying, but aren't providing the jobs or salaries necessary to sustain their expectations of growth and profits. So before we teach children the value of hard work, we need to level the playing field so they can see the value in doing it yourself rather than just buying it off the shelf because at the moment, there's no incentive for children to do otherwise.


    Damn, that's good, Beetlejuice. And at some level, everyone knows this, and it has made us continuously search to bring something back, or perhaps, take our country back.


    I cannot help seeing that picture of Lisa Douglas from Green Acres throwing the dirty dishes out the window rather than cleaning them. Good comment Beetle.


    We've lost that ability to work with our hands, to use our heads to think and apply knowledge to fix what we break. It's cheaper to replace a broken appliance than it is to repair it.

    Life has become all about entertainment beginning when a person first opens their eyes.  A child rarely sees examples of people doing hands on work unless maybe the remote is lost and the TV is stuck on PBS and a woodworking show comes on. One of the reasons that people do not try to fix things for themselves is that it doesn't even occur to them to try. They have never seen it done. Yes, that is a slam on our culture and how we raise our children by the experiences we, and our culture writ large, give them, but there are other reasons too. Remember the proverbial kid who could take apart a clock when he was six years old and put it back together and make it run? He learned to do it by doing it. If that kid takes apart a modern electronic digital clock to see what makes it tick he might as well cut into a bar of soap.    

     Here are a few excerpts from an article at "Salon" that demonstrates some of my criticism. The writer is enthusiastic about his son's entry into the world of "Geekdom". I am not.

    "We're all familiar with negative stereotypes of the geek -- obsessive behavior, crazed attention to detail, a seeming inability to socialize easily -- but if there was one thing I took away from BlizzCon, it was that an essential thing defining geekdom is the capacity to be enthusiastic. Geeks want to be enthralled, and more than most people, they open themselves wide to that kind of ensorcellment."

    "The worldwide appetite for fantasy seems unquenchable. Blizzard has capitalized on this fact as well as anyone this side of Peter Jackson or J.K. Rowling. There is an extent to which my son -- all of our sons and daughters! -- never had a chance for another path, even if one sets aside the influence of my family lore. The seductive power of the entertainment machine has never been more powerful, more immersive or more addictive."

    http://www.salon.com/life/real_families/index.html?story=/mwt/feature/20...


    Yes, where is Ghandi when you need him. Maybe that's the only way to break the system.


    Liz made a very important observation, but it's really up to us to see to it children have that level playing field to see all the possibilities before them and have the opinion to choose of their own free will the path they wish to follow rather the one chosen by society because that's what they're suppose to choose.


    Liked it. I would love to move to Mayberry, but can't find it on the map.

    Yeah, pipedream, take our country back, cowboy-myth redux.

    As to finding Jesus, I was kind of stunned by this: in a Gallup survey question on religion, as many picked "Other" as "Protestant". When "Other" was asked on a followup, 85 % said "Christian". Accounting for Mormons and "foreigners" I take it that not only is the earth 6000 years old, but Christian churches in American started sometime around 1970.

    Reformation? History? Geology? Gimme a Bud.  


    You know I read this about fifteen times.

    Sometimes when I am down I take a walk and about four blocks from here is a day care facility. Actually two of them.

    The kids run around in this small small recess area with the slides and such with three or four adults looking on. The kids are not pushing other kids down. The kids are not talking trash.

    The kids are running and jumping and hanging on monkey bars. They are just running after each other in joy that other children are around.

    I don't know. It is just fun to watch.


    However, the mothers are somewhat skittish, perhaps rightly so, and talk in louder voices to their kids than I remember growing up--for example, when they are in the super market and holding class continuously for everyone around. If my gaze happens by random motion of my eyeballs to fall upon a toddler for more than one second, the mom gives me a dirty look, wheels the cart around placing her between me and the child and speeds down the aisle. (must be the beard). Then I can still hear her from the other side of the market. "This apple is ROUND"  " "This box is SQUARE".


    Drat!  Just when I'd decided you might be female!  (Though I did know a woman with a beard once...)   Innocent


    That's funny. But what happened to that four foot eleven inch girlfriend? Is she available?


    High-priced corporate Chi-Cago attorney, married...  Or: NA.   Cool


    Sorry to hear you're experiencing such a lack of help and aid from your fellow humans, C.  Around here, we still help each other.  I live in a very politically Republican/Tea Party-ish county, and we still help each other.  There is a section of the local paper in which people make public declarations of thanks for kindnesses shown by others: lost pocketbooks turned in, help changing tires on the highway, food and help brought during illnesses, etc.

    In the past, I can't tell you how many days a year we would spend helping each other's building projects, and it's true we can't do that as much now since we all need to work more (if we can) to keep our heads above water, but in general we do help each other.  The only downhill pattern I see often is the more general rudeness and selfishness of children.


    I think when we look at the big picture, it looks bad, but for most of us, nothing has changed in our own neighborhoods.  We look out for one another and nobody asks what party we belong to or how we feel about Obamacare.  I live in Republican country up here but I'll do everything I can for anybody who needs it, and I know without a doubt they would do the same for me.

    Our kids live in the city, but in neighborhoods that are just like the one they grew up in.  In the winter my daughter comes home from work to a driveway cleared of snow by one or the other of the older men who live on either side of her.  She in turn keeps them in produce in the summer.

    We're still tribal, it seems, and the neighborhoods are our territory.  It's a jungle out there and we put on our armor when we go outside, just waiting for trouble.  I guess it's always been that way.


    What happened to us ?

    The easy answer is the invention of affordable air travel.

    People move a lot more and but can still easily visit nuclear family that lives far away.

    Therefore, they do not need to create substitute family in those who live near them, and among those who live near them, they have the choice of only making friends with those who they really find compatible. You were no longer stuck with being nice to people you didn't really like only because they were your neighbors.

    But I think it is more complex than that and I do not think your experience is or ever was the standard everywhere for everyone.

    I do strongly believe that it is not anything new, it is a consequence of big crowded cosmopolitan communities where new people are always coming in and others are always leaving. I don't think what you think of as the "good old days" ever existed much in many dense urban situations, whether Rome, Constantinople, Peking or Paris. In that case, since personal space is lacking, privacy is top on the list in creating livable communities, a bit of privacy trumps helping each other. The ultimate downside of was exemplified by the famous Kitty Genovese story. What's considered a good neighbor is different--someone who respects the privacy of everyone else.

    The pioneers who helped each other with barn raising had plenty of personal space and fences to return to after that neighbor's barn was raised. The immigrants living squeezed on top of each other in tenements on New York's lower East side most of all wanted to get out and get some more personal space, even if that meant having to pay someone to babysit and help with big chores and not having others around so close to rely on in crises.

    Furthermore, the growth of the nuclear family, away from extended family and reliance on neighbors, was actually a dream fulfilled by FDR's New Deal et. al. Social Security meant nobody had to have retired Mom and/or Dad living with them any more. The GI Bill meant the son and his wife could escape living with and like his parents. The FHA and places like Levittown meant each little new family could have their own little home and piece of land and not have to live on the family farm. Etc.

    I'm a boomer who grew up on several blocks of poorly maintained two-story rental flats mostly filled with young large working class families who could not afford a down payment on a house. (My parents could not afford that down payment until I was a teenager.) Us large crowd of kids ran free and wild among the untrimmed and unfenced yards and yes, everyone knew whose kids were whose and many watched what we were up to. At the same time, in summer, some moms shoved the kids out of the little crowded apartments in the morning and told them don't dare come back until night fall, because they couldn't stand all but the babies underfoot in a small 3-bedroom flat. Overall, my memory is that they would help each other if they needed a cup of sugar or a ride to work because the car broke down, but mostly what they all dreamed of was to have a place and the money not to have to require depending upon such neighborly assistance. An offer of hand-me-down clothes from one family to another would be considered an insult or at minimum a great shame if your situation was so bad that you had to accept them. The only barn raising type project I remember is my father and the man downstairs leveling the path by the side of the house and putting gravel down because the landlord was too cheap to pave it and their wives agreed the tracked-in dirt was driving them crazy.

    And then there is another, contrary American narrative to yours out there that I know from personal experience.  My mother's family was 7 siblings raised by immigrant parents on a small farm on the outskirts of the city maintained by them and their mother in the Depression years while their father worked full time in a foundry, and did the farming on weekends and summer nights. The farm was to have their own food and other things like feather pillows, and have leftover to sell at the farmer's market. As each got married and started their own families, the ethos I got from all of them was take care of yourself financially and for similar needs, because no one else is going to do it. On the other hand, for health crises and emotional support and celebrations of milestones like weddings or deaths, they were very close, all there for each other like no one else. (My surviving aunts are still calling me weekly several years after the death of my mother, their sister. It's like they feel they must offer a replacement for her. They never pry, though, they just offer an ear.)

    Their parents gave them nothing financial beyond allowing them to finish high school, and they expected it from no one, instead they were raised as if they were expected to prove the value of their existence to their parents. Also, once married, they were not asked for help back on the farm. Not a one of them ever loaned money to any other, nor helped with financial problems or things like a broken down car, they were taught to be self-reliant in situations like that, not depend on others, even their siblings, it was like a taboo thing to interfere with each other's nuclear family finances or to expect help from their parents or to expect services like babysitting from each other, they just wouldn't do that to each other much less neighbors.

    Finally, one part of your story really struck me immediately as contrary to my own experience--this:

    My father sometimes counsel parents that he knew and their kids. Like the time our milkman got all upset because his son did not want to continue the dairy farm. He wanted to be an engineer. So my father went over and talked to both of them and helped our milk man realize that maybe being and engineer was best for his son.

    Neither of my parents would never ever do this; they would consider it being a nosy interfering busybody. They would really resent it if someone did the same to them. I even recall my mother complaining about the visit from a public health nurse after the birth of own of my brothers; she hated the idea of someone checking on the way she was raising her children, it was a violation of her privacy. My mother was a very social type person with high emotional IQ type, the kind that people liked to tell their problems to. But if your milkman's son came to her with his tale of woe about his father, she would listen and console and offer suggestions, and she would talk to my father about it and they would say it is very sad, but I can't imagine they would ever consider going to talk to his father about it, never, that would be taboo to them. And she would probably become a life long friend of the milkman's son, but she would never consider trying to solve his problems for him by becoming an involved negotiator.

    Now that I look back on it, inspired by your own memories, I think almost all the families in my crowded childhood neighborhood operated on that principle, not to involve yourself in another family's business. Seems to me like it was an essential way they survived getting along with each other in a tense crowded neighborhood, For example, it was quite clear to us kids that there was a lot of horrible fights among couples about money but that that was something other grownups pretended in public was not happening. You could easily hear it all through thin walls and across the yards but you did not admit you heard it. Also that if someone got "laid off," it was something you whispered about and you pretended that the person still had the same money as before and you did not offer them help like they were poor or something, because that would be adding insult to injury.


    Pride goeth before a fall. Oh and my father was a High School Guidance counselor.


    Making money ?? Damn straight they are. And especially the so called State Universities.


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