Planned Parenthood

    Okay, here's what I want to know.

    In all the kerfuffle over Planned Parenthood, the grilling of Cecile Richards, the shout your abortion hashtag, why doesn't anyone EVER talk about the guys ffs?

    Speaking as a white, middle-class, professional female, I would like to address the innocence/experience divide. Innocence is when you believe the guy when he tells you he'll pull out before orgasm, experience is when you know he's lying.

    I had one of those experiences, then raced to the doctor for morning after pills the next day. When I told the guy responsible, he yawned – he was still getting over his hangover.

    This is the pinnacle of entitlement, to produce not only pregnancy in women, but trauma about pregnancy, and then yawn and go back to sleep – and, more than likely, on to a new partner the next night.

    I'm not bitter about the new partner part – I would only wish to warn her what might await. When you're in your 20s, these guys are everywhere and virtually impossible to avoid. You're hot, you're horny, you want to get it on, and why shouldn't you? Except at the critical moment, lothario says he doesn't have a condom, but he promises to pull out before he gets you pregnant. Now that I'm older,, I would never go along with that premise/promise, but when I was 23, I was more trusting. More fool me.

    So, I guess, according to current mainstream media views, I was a slut and should never have been in that situation to begin with. Actually, I was trying to be a little better educated than my Victorian Mum about sex and should have been free to experiment any way I wanted, just like any male my age, without getting pregnant and ruining my potential for a successful career.

    The unwanted pregnancies that abound are caused by guys who can't be bothered to put on a condom. If the potential lives produced by that carelessness are so valuable, let science find a way to make guys lactate and make them give up their jobs to care for their spawn.

    IMO, women don't say no to men in sexual situations, because they also want to have sex – is that so bad? The only difference is that, without contraception, the woman's life is forever changed. Men can have as many partners as they want without any ding on their marriageability or pursuit of a higher degree. The same is not true of women, by a damning biological fact. If the guy fails to pull out in time, as he seduced them into thinking he would, then their life is potentially forever changed. In the politics of abortion, no one ever, EVER talks about that.

    Comments

    "You're hot, you're horny, you want to get it on", you're a woman, you don't want to get pregnant (or an STD), and you don't (fully) trust your partner.  Three solutions jump to mind: 1) sex aids, oral or manual sex, 2) your own stash of condoms at hand, 3) the pill or IUD.  My strong recommendation is 2 and 3 to maximize protection from both unwanted outcomes.  With respect to 1, if you aren't confident the guy (or gal) is clean but you're still looking for something something.  Examine closely for any cuts, sores, or other potential evidence of a transmittable disease.

    By the way, I am very sorry that the guy lied to you and put you threw an emotional rollercoaster.  You are not responsible for his bad act.  Still, forewarned is forearmed or is it the other way around in this case.


    This is pretty judgmental and cavalier, just what I'd expect from you. As was pointed by the OP while the responsibility should be shared women bear the burden of any mistake or accident which allows men to evade behaving responsibly. We need more messages to men that they too should behave responsibly in spite of the fact that its so easy for them to escape the consequences.

    I could grow into my maturity with little risk. I could walk down any street or get totally shit faced drunk without fear. I never had to worry that someone might slip a micky into my drink. I could have casual sex thoughtlessly. But let's just keep emphasizing the fact that women must always behave more responsibly than men. Be more aware of their surroundings, be more in control of their behavior than men rather than point out that it's mostly the behavior of men that's the problem and attempt to educate them to foster a change.

    I started having sex at 17 and we engaged in many risky behaviors. Sex is a powerful drive and maturity takes time to develop. It's only luck that spared us a tragic outcome. There but for the grace of god.


    I've trouble caring about another thread like this - yes, shared responsibility and danger, various societal penalties and constraints but men have much less to handle aside from possible child support or pay for abortion, and like Anna Karenina, society still has its sluts vs good girls equation politically and opportunity-wise and socially.

    One less discussed issue is that no contraception is 100% safe and many like the pill or IUDs have serious health issues for women not much considered - whacked out hormonal system? perforated uterus? I guess a simpler way to tie tubes and untie would be useful, but far in the future. Until then it's a constant inequality and ever-present life disrupting situation for women. For men, not very much, and if there weren't the overhyped hetero aids scare, condom use would be much less.


    I expressed no judgment whatsoever about the writer.  I don't know how you could have found that.  She wrote that women who want to have sex shouldn't trust guys to "pull out".  Of course, that's good advice as far as it goes.  But what should the woman do?  Well, if she's going to be out there then she needs to protect herself right?  Wouldn't that have been wise of you to do at 17?  I'm certainly not suggesting you shouldn't have had sex if you wanted to.  I'm saying that if you didn't want a "tragic outcome", there were ways to avoid one.  Sheesh, talk about looking for a fight.


    They can bring a condom, but how to assure he wears it? Sexual situations are complex and varied, often tied to drunkenness, sleepiness, greatly unequal power, etc. There are no simple answers.

    In the situation the blogger described there is an easy answer.  She describes herself as horny and wanting sex but not wanting to get pregnant.  Well, there are ways to have sex and not to get pregnant.  As I noted, the pill or IUD plus a condom is ideal.  Sure, the guy might not want to wear it but she can refuse to engage in intercourse under those circumstances.  If he won't take no for an answer, hopefully, he'll go to jail for a while.


    Shhh.  Please.  Stick with what you know.


    The number of rapes that result in jail or any sort of punishment is shockingly low. What were the latest figures on campus rape - date rape and other variants? I've had Looking For Mr Goodbar on my to-watch list for a while - think it roughly covers the time and social settings this post addresses - though I understand the novel is better.

    It's the focus of your response and the condescending manner, your mansplaining to her.

    I'm not looking for a fight. I don't know you and I don't care about you. I simply have strong disagreements with some of your posts and I have no trouble expressing them.


    Thanks for the construction criticism Kat.  I'll be working on my "focus", "tone", and "condescending manner".  Not sure what I can do about the "mansplaining". I'm a man and sometimes I do explain things.


    Mansplaining is a term and a meme that's used quite often in these types of discussions. If you haven't heard it and don't understand it simply means you haven't done much reading on these topics by feminists.

    Anyway, I'm probably wrong. There's no doubt your post was a revelation to arc and other women and surely they are very grateful you explained it to them.


    Thanks for highlighting why the women will always have to be the more responsible sex partner.  We still, unbelievably, live in a culture where any problem with sex is the woman's problem.  It's a wonder women have any fun at all when it comes to sex.  Not that they're supposed to, of course.


    Thanks Ramona. I know women have to do the systems check and, yes, I do believe that makes the whole thing less pleasurable for us.  I guess I chose this example to illustrate the enormity of scale that differentiates the consequences for a man and woman in casual circumstances.  But what I was also looking for was an answer to why the discourse around abortion, which tends to center on women and their choices, is never challenged... even by women. Why do we accept the terms of the debate as they are? Why don't women talk about this in public forums? (Or do they, and I just don't know where it's going on?)  The only article I could find where some scholar even acknowledged male agency in pregnancy talked about it in the context of abuse, as in when the guy wanted to get his partner pregnant against her will and either tricked her or forced her.  So I chose a more benign circumstance to suggest that epic consequences flow from little failures of consensus.  Because women have much more to lose, I wish they would bring this fact up more in a political context.  The abortion debate always makes it sound like it is all about the woman's choice to end a life, not about her overbearing (libido-killing) responsibility about whether to start one, unless, of course, it's an extreme case like rape or incest.

    I recently got diagnosed with something called 'complex atypical hyperplasia,' which is basically precancer of the endometrium. My gynecologist immediately scheduled a total hysterectomy.  I researched a great deal, spoke to pathologists, and concluded that other treatments were out there, you just had to know about them. I also learned that gynecologists are required to perform a quota of hysterectomies (somewhere around 70) before they can be licensed, which might be one reason mine (who works at a teaching hospital) has his students perform them routinely, even though many studies predict negative outcomes for the patient. My gynecologist thinks I'm a nut and says he's never had a complaint from a single woman.  Again, digging deeper, I talked to a couple of women who had terrible experiences, but also said they didn't want to complain to their male doctor or discourage other women who might not have a choice about getting the procedure.

    I short, I'm mystified by what sometimes feels like a network of silence, at least in the public sphere, about what women undergo at all points in their sexual life - and it sometimes has the taint of old world etiquette, whispering and maintaining an appearance of everything being 'just fine,' and that's between women themselves, who don't want to share the really private, really difficult stuff. I suppose the aspects of a woman (and man)'s sexuality that Planned Parenthood looks after are not, at the end of the day, very sexy - but gaining a voice and access to information is.  I wish young people would jump on board to support PP with the same fervor they have demonstrated in their support of Bernie Sanders, showing the same ingenuity to address the burden of pregnancy, abortion, and sexual health we all share.

     

     

     

     

     


    Sorry you've had to go through that with your gyno.  I decided long ago that my gyno would always be female, and I've never been sorry.  Maybe it's time to look around?

    I'm surprised that you feel there is that much silence out there about the things you've talked about.  There are many feminist websites where writers talk freely about all things sexual, and work to stop the misogyny.  Feministing and The Broad Side are two that publish articles all the time about all things sexual and are advocates for Planned Parenthood, and against all things misogynistic.  

    I've written many times about feminist issues, myself.  (Here is one. And another.)  Most of what I write is cross-posted here at Dagblog, and the men here are amazing and, for the most part, enlightened.  (I don't know how to find them here on Dag!)

    If I've misunderstood what you wrote, I apologize.  But the last thing I want is for any woman to feel she is fighting her battles alone.


    Women's issues always get shoved under "other" category. Health care should've been a women's issue - I went 20 years without seeing a doctor except a broken bone I dealt with myself (doctor's approach cut-off my circulation, would have been worse than the break for a guitarist). Women don't have this luxury plus they get kids afflictions to deal with besides their own, and get the old folks as well. Yes, the female reproductive system is high maintenance as are kids' low immunity high exposure ones. I looked forward to this election addressing "soft" issues and instead it will be 24x7 Benghazi and some goddam mail server (as if the Chinese aren't hacking *all* our "secret" infosystems and they still haven't cleaned up weaknesses from Bradley Manning and Eric Snowden. And female candidate #2 is out to show she's more Terminator than empathetic female - guess that appeals to the 25-45 immature male set. Yes, it would be great to see a female Occupy Wall Street-like uprising to push these things on the agenda, but that's a lot of work fighting existing structure when you have one party that simply doesn't care, that gets its marching orders from the Old Testament and shrouds itself in anti-science just-be-tough Many of these issues need to be addressed at state level, and need bot a lot of loud people plus money, which women often don't control the way of a Koch Brother or Soros, though Soros would be sympathetic. Lysistrata was written eons ago. The women's suffrage movement was mostly 100 years ago. Perhaps time for another insurrection, digitally enabled and somehow cutting into this self-created smug male control structure that laughs off or disdains any social issue.

    I did my share of marching and chanting when I was a young women for women;s rights. We lost the fight for the ERA.  We fought hard.  

    Women's health care started out as a state by state issue for the right to an abortion then finely we won Roe v. Wade. There were some early states that granted abortions before the court made it legal.

    There was even an earlier battle to get contraceptives in some states. 

    Many of us that were on the front line then have been baffled by the fact young women seem to take this all for granted.  They should be more involved in protecting their rights because of the political far right. 

    My Aunt Mary was a Suffragette. She was 17 years older then my mother.  She loved talking about it and show her sashing ribbon. 


    Most people resist change. Liberal activists have to drag them kicking and screaming into the future. The next generation takes it all for granted and rarely gives any credit to those who made it happen. They, in their turn, have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the future. It's always been this way.

    “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed, citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”
    Margaret Mead


    Yeah, my comment mistakenly implies/says that women haven't organized in 100 years. ERA certainly was a good ambitious attempt. How abortion success has fallen back is hard to fathom, except viewed with a mass attempt to debunk science. It's hard to imagine self-respecting men caring to superstition in the space age, but I guess it's city mouse vs country mouse as well. And since men control the dialog, there we have it - progress abandoned.

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