MURDER, POLITICS, AND THE END OF THE JAZZ AGE
by Michael Wolraich
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Bernie Grasps that Trump is a Fraud
By NCD on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 11:20am |Bernie finally perceives Trump is a con man: It is hard not to laugh, to see President Trump alongside these Wall Street guys. I have to say this Jake, and I don't mean to be disrespectful, this guy is a fraud," Sanders told host Jake Tapper on CNN's "State of the Union."
URL:
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/sanders-trump-is-a-fraud-234662
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Comments
Breaking: NCD finally perceives that Bernie loathes Trump despite the fact that he's been denouncing Trump as a bigoted "pathological liar" who will betray the working class since at least December 2015. But I guess we see what we want to see.
by Michael Wolraich on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 12:35pm
It looks like it was 2016. Bernie did seem to believe he could work with Trump just 2 days ago "if the President meant what he said in the campaign."
And work with Trump on infrastructure 1/17/2017.
We have a mentally ill incompetent president surrounded by nutcase extremist advisors and Bernie is all over the place day to day. The average protestor in the streets seems to 'get it' better than Bernie.
by NCD on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 2:03pm
Your understanding of where Sanders stands in relation to Trump would be helped if you notice a key word in Sanders significant statements. From the articles you linked to for the purpose of showing that Sanders is " ... all over the place day to day."
If Trump, for whatever his reasons may be, is willing to work towards some good end [again, notice the word "if"] then I hope that Sanders is not the only politician on the Democratic side with sense enough to work with him towards that end.
by A Guy Called LULU on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 3:48pm
Those are some pretty large "Ifs."
I think Sanders is just sticking a thumb in the eye of all those who fell for the bait and switch.
by moat on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 4:24pm
I agree completely but I think it is just a way of sticking Sanders in the eye to ignore the "ifs" so as to make fun of him. They are definitely crucial to his message.
by A Guy Called LULU on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 4:54pm
Sure - get Mitt Romney on the phone, he can straighten out the confusion - has direct access to the Oval Office, from what I understand.
[translation for the hard of perceiving: after watching Mitt completely humiliated, why would someone else beg for similar abuse? Trump already played "pull my finger" with Bernie over a fictitious debate back in late May.]
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 5:06pm
I am just glad he is pulling the oars in the right direction.
To switch metaphors in mid stream, I never got involved in sorting out his motivations so his "message" has always been planks on a platform for me.
In the present circumstances, I will pay him by the number of boards nailed down on any given day.
I am glad he is on the crew.
by moat on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 5:37pm
Seconding Lulu. Sanders has often called Trump a liar and a bigot who will betray the working class. He has never praised Trump (despite misleading headlines to the contrary) nor indicated that he trusts him. He has expressed agreement with a few of Trump's policies, namely rejecting TPP, and he has said that he will work with Trump on issues where there is alignment but always adds a conditional "if he is serious."
There is an ongoing debate about whether Democrats should be open to working with Trump or whether to oppose him unconditionally on everything. Sanders is in the former camp, but he doesn't trust Trump to follow through, and he's been pretty consistent on that. That doesn't mean his approach is the correct one, but it's not the zig-zag you suggest.
Personally, I think Democrats should focus on driving a wedge between Trump and GOP leaders, which is the key to breaking the Republican majority. If Trump turns on McConnell and Ryan, 2018 will be one hell of an election. To do that, Democrats should continue to press GOP leaders to denounce Trump's extreme behavior, but they can also "play" Trump by complimenting him when takes action that will annoy the right. I don't know if this is Sanders's strategy, but it's mine.
by Michael Wolraich on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 5:26pm
Presumably the cognitive dissonance of Trump agreeing with the Socialist should make their heads explode, but it's been 20 months of weirdness that they've assimilated quite eagerly, so I doubt it will trigger even a bit of annoyance - they know how to hold opposing thoughts in their head and stay enthusiastically vile (and might I say 'deplorable'? sure I can..)
by PeraclesPlease on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 5:50pm
We'll see. So far Trump's policies (if they can be called policies) have hewed close to Republican orthodoxy except for TPP. But it's only been two weeks.
by Michael Wolraich on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 6:33pm
I agree lulu. If Trump comes up with a good infrastructure bill, something democrats have tried to pass for years and were stymied by republicans, democrats should work with him. If Trump agrees to negotiations with drug companies over drug prices, again something democrats wanted and republicans blocked, democrats should work with him. The evidence so far seems pretty clear that it's unlikely Trump will push any of those populist democratic proposals. His infrastructure plan has always been a privatization scheme. After one meeting with the drug companies he's already backed off price negotiations. So I doubt it.
While the "ifs," the doubts, and the willingness to work with trump should all be there there is still the matter of how we discuss them. I think we should highlight the "if" and the doubts and downplay the our willingness to work with Trump when discussing this. Sometimes Sanders has downplayed the if and expressed few if any doubts while highlighting his willingness to work with Trump. I don't think that's the best strategy going forward.
by ocean-kat on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 6:42pm
It's all a crapshoot right now but I think that Sanders way of speaking to issues 'right now' is probably the best. Being Mitch McConnell's mirror image is not the way to go even if it ultimately turns out that Trump should be opposed to the max on everything he tries. And I agree that the chance to cooperate on good policies is unlikely to occur. The most likely place he could make a big move that I would support would be in the area of cooperation with Russia and I know that would drive a lot of Democrats over the edge. At least a few here.
by A Guy Called LULU on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 8:49pm
Working with Russia to what end? To hack the Norwegian elections, bomb the shit out of Chechnya, throw more Khodorovsky's in jail to steal their companies, poison citizens abroad and assert greater hegemony over their sphere of interest through energy and military threats? Or do you have something positive in mind? I don't hate Russians, I do business with Russians, but I'm not a fan of Russia's government as a controlling meddling corrupt behemoth. You may see the US as the same, but quality wise a see a lot of differences that matter. Russia doesn't do real alliances, and there is no stable, unsurprising level of more mundamne business-as-usual - it's always a power game, some intrigue, and there is no velvet hand to balance the iron fist.
also curious if you'd be so accommodating to Hillary as Trump if she'd won.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 1:52am
Working with Russia to what end? Christamighty crying in a muthfuckin’minefield! What is a stupid question.
by A Guy Called LULU on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 10:28am
So we spend all our time on Mideast, Palestine, Ukraine and Russia, a bit on Mexico and sending trainers to Africa. For 17 or more years I've been waiting for us to work with China and other Asia countries whi can provide mutual benefit. Insread you want more time with some slavic control freak Jackie Chan wannabe motherfucker. Yes, it's a stupid question - why should I want to give Putin the time of day aside from to shut down his finances, APT29 and GRU hacking divisions, and attempt to create a new mutual admiration society of power hungry despots with Syria and Turkey. So what am I missing, I'm yout student, I'm here to learn.
by PeraclesPlease on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 1:08pm
You left out invading Poland, which Flynn seems to desire also.
PS: I hope you'll inquire as to why your question was stupid. To what end indeed. Reminds me of the fable about the scorpion offering a ride across a lake. It didn't end well, except for the scorpion
by CVille Dem on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 10:59am
The Republicans prime directive is to make the rich richer. They will do it with tax cuts deficit raising and selling off public infrastructure to private corporations with guaranteed profits, stiffing the middle class and poor. Not to mention what they will do to Medicaid, ACA and what they dream of....vouchers for Medicare.
Working with Trump for real progressive federal programs is unfortunately a very unlikely event. The only move I have seen is the 'US steel for pipelines' issue which I blogged on (if you are going to destroy the environment, do it with American steel).
Trumps Commerce Secretary, Wilbur Ross, is the only cabinet/economy guy who I have read good things about, if anything good comes for the middle class, it may be from him.
by NCD on Sun, 02/05/2017 - 8:30pm
Bernie was one of our two good contenders.
by Flavius on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 8:16am
You always show up to support me.
But please, please me and make sure you link (by the link provided) the link.
Link the link!
That is always what I say. hahahahah
Trump is a con man and a non man and a pretend man and a pt barnam man. hahahah
God almighty I hate this guy.
by Richard Day on Mon, 02/06/2017 - 8:33pm